Your gripes with CoC II
- Thread starter Narmlet
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The issue is that Thief lists its Primary Affinities as Strength, Cunning and Agility. The class itself is +1 Agility. But the class background selections provide 0 options to get a +1 to Cunning. It's therefore impossible to start with a "True Thief" in the same sense you can be a "True Warrior" (by starting with +1 Strength, Toughness and Agility) or "True Black Mage" (with +1 Willpower, Presence and Cunning) or any other class. Every other class can start with +1 in all 3 of its affinities (in the big list, represented as "[Class] Classic".
Thief is the only class in the entire game that lacks a background for one of its listed default affinities entirely. This seems especially odd to me given that Cunning is the stat I associate with thinking on your feet and the willingness to fight / play dirty. Picking locks is a matter of cunning, as shown in Dog Days. While picking pockets is equally a measure of both Agility and Cunning, as the same quest shows.
Given that 2 major thief functions rely on cunning, why exactly doesn't thief have an option open to them for a starting +1 to that stat? While it may not make much impact in the long run, I can't be a catburglar style breaking and entering thief from a roleplay perspective because the background that makes logical sense for such a thing (with +1 Cunning, again, the stat used for a Lock Pick check) doesn't exist.
Lone Wolf115
Well-Known Member
Probably after we do the classic hero thing and deal with the evil, or not for romancing Kas.
Based on this post by Savin if by 'hospitality' you mean 'get up close and personal with a princess' backdoor' then yes, yes we can indeed expect some royal hospitality.
Also, Moira showed off art of the frostmander king a while back and since that includes nude art, it's reasonable to assume that some manner of hospitality will be in the offering there as well.
The triggering condition to get the Champion of Hawkethorne title is to do the three big Act 1 quests (Right of Conquest, Harboring a Fugitive and the first part of In Her Footsteps via defeating the Alraune) so it seems like Tychris is somewhere we could visit in Act 1, once it's implemented.
Ahh, that's what you meant. In which case I refer you to Tobs' post again since the system isn't designed to cover every possible spread of starting stats.
Slum Rat exists and is the obvious Background if you want to play a burglar, it even gets multiple [pc.bg] checks at various points in the game. That it gives +1 to Agility rather than Cunning is just what the devs decided on. I doubt they're gonna change that up now, though I suppose it's not impossible.
But yeah, if you want to style your Champ as a Locke Lamora or a Crocus Younghand for RP reasons, that's where you want to be looking.
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I didn't realise thieves didn't have an option to start with +1 to cunning, that's funny.
However, both the checks you mentioned are automatically passed if the character is a thief, so a thief with extra agility isn't disadvantaged by 'lock pick checks', nor are they less of a thief in practice. Another example is the Mage-Ship, where locks are passed by being the thief class, having one of the thief backgrounds, or not at all. So roleplaying a thief is covered with or without the +1 to cunning.
(Also it's just late in the game's development to be adding another thing to character creation. A new background means a bunch of new includes to write to catch it up to the other backgrounds, which isn't exactly high-priority work compared to all the other work.)
Aww, I was so looking forward to a grand feast or, perhaps, a tour of the palace.
Hopefully, the princess is vag only!mc-friendly.
Slum rat is more "Aladdin", and I want something more akin to Phantom / Gentleman Thief. Arsene Lupin or Carmen Sandiego. There's not really an appropriate background for a thief that isn't noble but isn't gutter trash who decided to turn to thievery for the hell of it / thrill. Slum Rat is a pickpocket and a thug looking for their next meal. I want someone who sends calling cards and steals jewlery from the chambers of a noble woman, not for the money, but for the simple challenge of the thing and the thrill. (While you could argue "Noble Scion" and not be entirely wrong, I'll admit this, my min-maxer's mind can't stand the "waste" of a point in presence with no way to put it somewhere more useful to me mechanically. The character to my mind is neither Noble nor a Gutter Rat. Not a solider or a hunter. Simply a man of average birth looking for a thrill, and to make money on the side. Who sees the whole thing as a cat and mouse game, not a meal ticket.)
At this point however the conversation has become a sort of unproductive rabbit hole. I was merely expressing my gripe that the background to do the character I want doesn't exist with the capabilities I desire the character to have. I either have to take a stat in a place I don't want one, or take background that doesn't appeal to me. Both those options being unappealing (to me), is the source of the gripe.
I won't be continuing this conversation past this point, mostly because it's not productive however (I'm not going to change the minds of those that disagree at this point. And my own mind won't be changed). I'm just trying to explain my point of view on the matter, that the concept running in my head isn't workable with the tools presented to me (even though I feel it should be). While the core of the complaint is due to the "gamer brain" desire to min-max (hsss, wasted points in places I don't like. They burns us!), the "roleplay brain" also kind of agrees that it's weird to have a somewhat common character concept not be truly workable with the tools provided.
Aside: it's also a bit weird to me that Warrior is the only class with only 4 Backgrounds instead of 5. but that's just my desire for equilibrium speaking there)
Possible background solution and CoM spoilers
It's been established that the gods can fuck with peoples memories and our backgrounds are basically just that since we are probably not going to be interacting with the characters mentioned there. And as we can already change our race and class we might as well make it possible for the background. Just walk up to a god you mistrust the least and ask them to change your memories of your past to a different life.
Being unable to start as a barbarian who turned to thievery (and more importantly to more cunning and dishonorable combat) was the one annoyance I had when creating my array of main characters, and with the class swap costing an arm and a leg, I had to edit that character's save.
I don't know if I came across a bug, but I swear that the game treats lipstick and lip colour as different elements. If you get black lipstick and then use Soft Mud-Infused Cackle Berry, the Champion will get black lips.
It could be that game does nit have seperate flags for lips and lipstic and it all just falls down on lips. So when you use lipstic, you activate the flag for lips. Than when you use a TF that changes lips, it overwrites it.
They're different things, yes, but lipstick applied will stay on until you remove or change it (even though some sex scenes already have Champ leaving prints on their partners~ no matter how many of those you do, the lipstick on your face won't wear off) and it will be reflected in the appearance screen.
Kasyrra's redemption quest being locked behind sexing Cait.
Why do champ needs to fuck her to trigger temple of sin in the first place?
Why don't just lock the option of threesome behind sexing Cait?
Why do champ needs to fuck her to trigger temple of sin in the first place?
Why don't just lock the option of threesome behind sexing Cait?
For what it's worth, it's been said that in future, there will be other ways to start that questline. Temple of Sin was just the first one added.
I know that it's been said before but the whole Kitsune thing is a real drag at times especially like the whole Kinu engagement thing
It just doesn't feel like it really belongs in the story, like it used to be a part of something else but just got stitched in from another story.
There's just so much cramming of JP culture into this that it kinda seems to forget what this actually is. It stops feeling like a fantasy anymore
The protag also feels so muted during these heavy text drops that ultimately end in the relentless spouting of the mantra "there's nothing to be done" and you the protag meekly going, "Oh, okay," and walking off with a single sad rain-cloud floating overhead.
Kinda miss the Kitsune's in the first one who were more capricious fun lovers that liked to be dicked by you (and dick you) in the woods.
It just doesn't feel like it really belongs in the story, like it used to be a part of something else but just got stitched in from another story.
There's just so much cramming of JP culture into this that it kinda seems to forget what this actually is. It stops feeling like a fantasy anymore
The protag also feels so muted during these heavy text drops that ultimately end in the relentless spouting of the mantra "there's nothing to be done" and you the protag meekly going, "Oh, okay," and walking off with a single sad rain-cloud floating overhead.
Kinda miss the Kitsune's in the first one who were more capricious fun lovers that liked to be dicked by you (and dick you) in the woods.
Loved the first Kitsunes too, so much loving and some or at least one lady Kitsune had a cock. Kinu I'd rather been given the choice of not creating and still keeping Kiyoko in game.
I'm upset that characters like Eryka, Hinata, and Shar can't be companions even though they are interesting characters and have potential.
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There is a reason for that, and its literally kitsune society and how they view outsiders(especially considering most of of the current content that happens in it so far is before you could/did become one) and if your talking about the Kinu spend time scenes, of course theres a sad rain cloud, the PC is a damn good parent and hates the fact theres this big dumbass demon doin bad shit takin him away from her.
I just wish it took more than two seconds for Kinu to get engaged. The fact that literally as soon you regain control after freeing her she will already be engaged is just so weird to me. Like, you can't even do the homecoming yet, but Kinu already has a fiancé.
All I want to know is where are the futa Kitsunes? Surely you can't say every Kitsune is straight, and even if their cock hungry, a Lady Kitsune could easily drink/eat tf/magic up a cock to satisfy her partner. If I had the choice I'd rather Kinu got married to one of the ladies.
I mean come on just because Kitsunes share one soul, don't mean they share one mind.
I mean come on just because Kitsunes share one soul, don't mean they share one mind.
Well considering the PC isnt full blooded is why im pretty sure we can, but I think theres no futa foxes due to the whole Metaphysical nature of them. Also her instantly having one is less instant more "time is bullshit right now in the timeframe of the game".
Kinu is an absolute Chad and wants to assert her dominance over the family that ironically almost did something terrible to her parent. And the best way to do that is to fuck the family. Literally.
If so much stuff didn't directly impact the player's family, then I'd agree. The kitsune keeping us at arms length is understandable. Being told to piss off when concerned over our family being attacked is what's caused so much debate. We're not being told to wait for the right moment, we're being told off for wanting any involvement at all. And, in my disgustingly humble opinion, I've never noticed a rain cloud over us when spending time with Inari Kinu. She just likes gardening. And unlike Hime, actually seems to like spending time with us. I must encourage my daughter to be swole and Inari has a head start. Kinu training montage when my dudes?
I mean the PC is told to fuck off because lets be honest, if we were allowed to intrude on KinuQuest it would be over pretty fast, PC is abit bullshit remember that. Its more so to allow Kinu to come into her own without the absolute brick shithouse of power her father(mother in some cases) helping her.
So you mean how the PC handles everything.
I get that, and I'm not saying I want to just solve all their problems from a story perspective. It's just that we're bystanders to our children and possible friends being attacked and being told off for wanting to help. And we're not outsiders in this case. We're Kinu's parent, Kiyoko's one and only consort, friends with some people in the tree, and possibly the person strong enough to solo the tree. It's doable but time consuming. We're not traditional outsiders and our immediate family is under attack. So not even so much as being able to train out kids makes the whole thing weird.
I raised her well. Unfortunately I fear the Frost Marches may be swarmed in floof if she's too similar to the champ. At this rate, the land will be ruled by a diverse council of my children who rule by sheer numbers alone.
The two stories/quests we get with Kinu up until now are being told after the fact, so at least during those of course the champ is going to be mute and inactive.
As for the rest of the Kitsune content, this whole disconnect that exists due to the Kitsune culture being largely insular is largely intentional. IIRC, it was the author's intention to keep the PC almost always at arm's length. As was the emotional arm twisting of the PC missing at least ten years of growth of all of their children that were in the astral plane.
I'll agree though, being told to eff off when being concerned about the attacks on Kinu "because she is the princess and the folks in the den will take care of it without the need of the outsider" was the most grating part. But, even making the player feel affronted by this might have been intentional too. They're REALLY insular.
So insular, that they seem not to recognize the cosmic coincidence that it was the Champ finding the amulet, and actually braving the Den to free Kiyoko among other things. Not to mention that she was stuck there in Keros' dream realm for 200 and he did jack squat to help.
LOL, I seee that this made the jump from the Discord server to over to here in the forums
The Kurokawas own a ghostlight which is the closest it gets for now. Savin is apparently contributing a floof who 'made a deal for a dong', but that was supposed to be out last year so who knows where she is in the pipeline. And that's assuming Hana isn't Kas in disguise...
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