Your gripes with CoC II

[morii]

I feel like this has been talked about quite a bit, just from a quick search Bri, Quin, Azzy and Liaden, and Berwyn are topics that have popped up for a while.

Well for one thing, cry about it and two, its a cursed armour, so its a curse.

It's the gripes thread, people air their grievances here and critique the game. It's to gripe. Also, curses just make it sound way worse -- so Brint was cursed and we just stood by doing nothing hoping it would make him a woman? He needed our help to get the armor off because it was already taking root?

I justify it by saying, well, there's metagaming involved and my champion is a drifter kind of character, so it makes sense for her. But I don't think the game explains it all too well.

It's valid to have some ruffled feathers if you want Brint to be more submissive as a man. Let people critique how they want to critique and ask for content that they want to see in the game.

 

[A1teros]

There are failsafes in the game to make sure that you never accidentally turn Brint into Brienne, namely never progressing past a certain point in the transformation until you exit and then re-enter the Frosthound I believe but that's a game contrivance, given the time between stages it should be possible for you to end up with Brienne simply by taking too long in Harvest Valley.

As it is, in order to end up with Brienne without Champ coming off as neglectful or dumb in game, I have to contrive a series of events which consists of arriving back in front of the Frosthound right as Atugia shows up and I believe it also skips some time, which helps with making sure it's too late at night to see Sanders. Helping Ahmri, Zo, and the farm also helps. Atugia's intro in front of the Frosthound brings you inside without Garth mentioning Garret, and then upon waking up results in Garth immediately starting Dog Days, which considering he's your benefactor asking you to save his son, it'd be really fucked of you to put off.

That's an intricate series of events though, and the time on the armor is long so you really do need every single one of them to blow off the what, 10 days? of the armor's time. But that's just in world, in game I don't even remember if you also have to sleep on top of exiting and entering the Frosthound on top of the time, you really cannot end up with her by accident which is a good thing so good on the devs for that.

 

[CasualAntlerEnjoyer]

It's the gripes thread, people air their grievances here and critique the game.

I think you're mistaken.

This is clearly the grapes thread you blind fool. We come here to talk about fruit. Why on god's green earth would we even need a gripes thread?

Criticisms? Critique? How dare you people have opinions.

Well for one thing, cry about it and two

If complaining is the mark of someone who is about to cry, do you wish to talk about it? Because I've seen you post all of a single time since I've been here that's not just been you flying out of the woodwork to complain about someone.

And I'll give Animalistic this, at least when they do it there's genuinely some sort of point behind what they're saying, something that actually validates them participating in the discussion. Just telling people to mindlessly consume is asinine and leads to the stagnation of ideas and progress, and goes against the very point of this thread in the first place.

But hey, you act like you've got room to talk down to people, live that best life.

 

[Animalistic]

Well for one thing, cry about it and two, its a cursed armour, so its a curse.

Doesn't that sound slightly corrupt? A curse that takes an innocent man and twists him into something that he is not, all for a benefit of another individual? Seems like an evil curse to me.

There are failsafes in the game to make sure that you never accidentally turn Brint into Brienne, namely never progressing past a certain point in the transformation until you exit and then re-enter the Frosthound I believe but that's a game contrivance, given the time between stages it should be possible for you to end up with Brienne simply by taking too long in Harvest Valley.

So I am not here arguing if what champion did is evil, neglectful or nothing of sorts. What I am trying to convey is that I really can not think of a way for the game to put a positive spin on what happened to Brint. Sure, Brienne says that she is just as happy as a submissive house-wife as when she was this prime breeding-bull.

But how much of that is old him (now her) talking and how much of it is stepfords curse talking? On my end, as someone who fucked both, it seems very much in the ballpark of brainwashing.

 

[JustSomeGuy]

It's been damn near 5 years, it's not even beating a dead horse anymore. Poor thing is more terrible than I can describe. I mean when the original creator came out and flat out told ya'll you're overthinking it, they just wanted a loophole to write a cowgirl. It ain't even disagreement nomore, both sides are just shouting at a wall believing whatever they want. You can have your theories that's fine but the back and forth ain't helping none, just wait it out you'll get your answers soon enough.

But, hell what do I know I'm just a giant spider with a keyboard, wondering why those blind fellas over there keep touching up on that elephant like that. Honestly, fuck it, if you ain't stop yet you ain't stopping now. So, here's to another 5 yrs ladies n gents.

 

[ForeverLurker]

It's been damn near 5 years, it's not even beating a dead horse anymore. Poor thing is more terrible than I can describe. I mean when the original creator came out and flat out told ya'll you're overthinking it, they just wanted a loophole to write a cowgirl. It ain't even disagreement nomore, both sides are just shouting at a wall believing whatever they want. You can have your theories that's fine but the back and forth ain't helping none, just wait it out you'll get your answers soon enough.

But, hell what do I know I'm just a giant spider with a keyboard, wondering why those blind fellas over there keep touching up on that elephant like that. Honestly, fuck it, if you ain't stop yet you ain't stopping now. So, here's to another 5 yrs ladies n gents.

I read this all in my head in benders voice it made it better

 

[Acharehnus]

It's been damn near 5 years

It's weird how many people assume we've all been here as long as them...or that we'd go back and catch up on years of discussion.

 

[CasualAntlerEnjoyer]

It's been damn near 5 years,

It could of been a decade and I really wouldn't care to be honest, if it's a topic people feel strongly about they're going to bring it up now and again. This is a thread specifically for venting frustrations and giving critique, not everyone has been around the community for 5 years, and some of those that were clearly have not gotten a satisfying resolution to this topic, so I do not see the harm in it.

And to be honest, "You're over thinking it" is a bit of an ass-backwards response from the author with how extensively detailed this whole twisted little process is. Why did they even write all of this if I'm not supposed to read it?

 

[CboyC95]

I like Etheryn's old art better and I'm bummed that we can't change back to it with other characters' arts when she has a high confidence level. Etheryn's new art doesn't look believable to me, especially around the boots and her nude art. Her nude art looks like she's wearing chastity panties, not a chastity cage. Another reason why like her old art more, I especially like the boots as an added touch.

 

[Sacremas]

Yeah the panties are weird, I actually like the new art better overall, but the chastity panties seem like a bit of a misunderstanding at play there with the artist...

 

[morii]

I just assumed there was an elastic hole in the panties. shrug I was confused at first though

I like Etheryn's old art better and I'm bummed that we can't change back to it with other characters' arts when she has a high confidence level. Etheryn's new art doesn't look believable to me, especially around the boots and her nude art. Her nude art looks like she's wearing chastity panties, not a chastity cage. Another reason why like her old art more, I especially like the boots as an added touch.

If you download the game, you can change the names of the busts in its respective folder for the old bust to show when she's high confidence.

 

[Equivocate]

I like Etheryn's old art better and I'm bummed that we can't change back to it with other characters' arts when she has a high confidence level. Etheryn's new art doesn't look believable to me, especially around the boots and her nude art. Her nude art looks like she's wearing chastity panties, not a chastity cage. Another reason why like her old art more, I especially like the boots as an added touch.

Yeah, the original artwork should be available in every instance, it appears that it's an oversight when DCL did the newer art - seems that the dev team forgot to create separate instances of the art for Etheryn for her "high confidence" mode (or stipulate in the code for it to still allow for the original artwork to be used when Ryn is "high confidence"), and thus it defaults to the new art.
Weird, since they seemed to remember for Arona.

Spoiler: Showcasing the above

So first off, with the new Arona art by Moira, DCL went back and added pregnancy versions for Arona, although didn't change the face - however the devs included the original artwork twice for both the "arona_preg_nude" and "arona_preg_nude_dom" - so that the artwork didn't default to the newer version (which was Moira's newer version).
That's unlike what is observed with Ryn when she becomes "high confidence", because there's no equivalent high confidence artwork from the original DCL Ryn artwork. That would be easy to implement, as was seen in the Arona case, they could literally just copy paste the artwork twice and rename the file type - or just make sure to stipulate in the code that the original artwork is still to be an option even if Ryn is high confidence (the easier approach)...


"arona_preg_nude.DCL.0.png" (Sub Arona) & "arona_preg_nude_dom.DCL.0.png" (Dom Arona)


"arona_preg_nude.Moira.0.png" (Sub Arona) & "arona_preg_nude_dom.Moira.0.png" (Dom Arona)


Now when comparing with Ryn:


"etheryn.DCL.1.png" & "etheryn_nude.DCL.1.png" - Original DCL Ryn artwork

These have equivalents with the new artwork DCL did for Ryn when she's low confidence


"etheryn.DCL.0.png" & "etheryn_nude.DCL.0.png" - New DCL Ryn artwork

However, with the confident versions, there's no alternative file-type, like with Arona.



"etheryn_confident.DCL.0.png" & "etheryn_confident_nude.DCL.0.png" - with no alternatives for the original artwork.

Yeah the panties are weird, I actually like the new art better overall, but the chastity panties seem like a bit of a misunderstanding at play there with the artist...

The funny thing is both sets of art were done by DCLzexon, who actually used to be the main artist for the game... not sure what exactly transpired, but Moira is now the main artist for the game, with DCL doing art semi-infrequently for the game now.
The newer art for Ryn does look better in some instances, but kind of misses a bit of the charm from the original imo (although that could just be nostalgia, because I largely prefer the original artwork in most cases, Brienne being the exception) - although Ryn's breast size definitely doesn't seem to match the description in the Appearance (as in seems larger than A-cups) - hmm, actually, Atugia's (larger than B-cups) as well (which was also a revamp done by DCLzexon from his original artwork).

Some more recent artwork that DCL has done that seems slightly off to me (imo) is the Berwyn artwork and variations (which Moira actually had to edit the head, because the originals DCL did seemingly looked too "chibi-eqsue"), and the Zo pregnancy artwork.

I just assumed there was an elastic hole in the panties. shrug I was confused at first though



If you download the game, you can change the names of the busts in its respective folder for the old bust to show when she's high confidence.

To your latter point, yeah, while that is true, kind of unfortunate that that puts the onus on the player to do so each patch - it's not exactly like it's a difficult change for the dev team to implement... not sure how they've missed it for nearly 2 years at this point (17 July 2021).

 

[morii]

This is an extremely minor gripe, mostly a question, but what's with the codex? I noticed that The Old Country quotes a character that doesn't exist in my game, Kinu, and she's not even a character that can be without my sperm... All the other codices I've picked up have characters that either exist in Savarra itself or have. I think this is intentional, but it's just a nitpick I have because it feels weird to quote an entity that won't be born

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Too much reading involved in this game, where's all the pretty pictures

 

[wery12345]

THat was fucking obnoxious to have to go through.

 

[CasualAntlerEnjoyer]

Spoiler: Don't Open

Spoiler: I Warned You

Spoiler: Why are you doing this?

Spoiler: Door Number 1

Wasn't for the newer folk, granted you're right, there ain't enough hours in the day to catch up on all that drama. Just assume the opener works like a boolean and you'll be fine. If you've been here for a while it applies. If not disregard, carry on, enjoy your stay. The rest of it is for the old timers who know who they are, know this has been beaten into the ground to hell and back and continue to carry on.

Spoiler: Door Number A

Admirable, but mistaken on pointless speculation quashed by the writer's participation, alas time's a wastin, allow one a moment of pointless enunciation.

Spoiler: Words Words Words

A bit of context: while back, someone somewhere had to go and over complicate things for shits and giggles like you do, instead of walking it back afterwards. They just left it in the air for a very vocal minority of Brint fans to cling to it like it was gospel. They in turn started blowing the whole situation out of proportion, turning a slight contrivance into a master study in corruption, and making it everyone else's problem. It's people looking for meaning where there is none or to put it simply, you're overthinking it.

Spoiler: Lightning Round

Now paraphrasing for the boss-man, but if you want gospel, people who work on this game ain't hard to find.

- Brint/enne is the result of the writer circumventing the 1 child policy that's the simplest answer. That's it, that's all there to it, a means to an end no more no less.

- Did the armor change the cowboy: No shit Sherlock, but nothing as malicious or insidious as gaslighting leading to character death or corruption incarnate like some folks like to believe or lead others to believe.

-Why the personality shift: in general men and women have different priorities, wants, needs, focuses, desires and so on and so forth, the change in personality is the author's interpretation of those changes to an extent and to the best of their abilities.

-Take this one with a grain of salt, plans change and I haven't heard hide nor hair of armor quest for a while: Will your relationship w/ Brienne change ? You'll be able to double down on the current relationship or break your bond and reforge it into something new together during or after armor quest.

-Now point 4 doesn't negate point 2. A change did occur, but all the brain washing, cursing, corruption, manipulation, character death bs, it's wrong, let it go, let it die. If you wanna go and figure out what the armor actually did. Go for it, the sky's the limit.

-All the extra bits when the cowboy is transforming: just signposting because for a supposed "adult " fan base playing a text game, most of you motherfuckers can't read i.e. the Hornet Ring.

Spoiler: That's All Folks

Now the harm comes from A. mob mentality B. too many great story lines and characters fall to the wayside because of vocal fans who kept shouting what they thought was right and how things should have been handled instead of just agreeing to disagree then going on with their lives. Its how we end up getting nothing at best or a spite project at worst, the real crux of the issue is when you take away all the ad hominems et ad nauseam.

When you advertise one character as the corruption of another and keep encouraging folks to actively avoid engaging in that content. Content that they're actually interested in, if not for constant reminder from the peanut gallery that you're corrupting your best bro and you're making the "wrong" choice or the evil choice or however you want to put it. When there isn't one in this situation, hell even if there was. We're all degenerates here. I digress. It's a sad sentiment I've seen pop up more often than not on here and other spheres. People who are interested, but don't go for it because they've been sold a false bill of goods that they're a terrible person for hurting a bunch of 1s and 0s allegedly.

Spoiler: For Real This Time

I'll ya what tho, a few folks want to vent about flawed but decent game, couldn't give a fuck. Ya'll wanna theorize or hypothesize, don't mean shit to me. My issue is when the same lie is being told, by the same people after it's been refuted, rebutted and rejected time after time. But eh, what do i know . Ya'll are big boys and girls, you're going to do whatever you think is "right" regardless of what I have to say or anything else for that matter besides that's all I got. If ya made it this far, congrats and thanks for coming to my TED talk if you can actually read that is, anyway pip pip da doodly doo

Don't forget Papa Nurgle loves you.

Tl;dr: It's just words, a lot of words. Did i spoil the surprise for ya?

Whilst I admire the effort, the format makes it a chore to keep track of how the text is supposed to be flowing.

If you actually want me to read that, you're going to have to rearrange it into something less ungodly. Even a demented antler fetishist has to hold onto some standards now and again.

 

[Ria Brew]

Idunno I followed it pretty well

I'm probably the only one but it sorta appealed to my disjointed train of thought.

 

[wolfraider13]

I really, really wish I had time to write Carmen but my attention keeps getting pulled elsewhere.

We understand...just also horny for the vamprix

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Whilst I admire the effort, the format makes it a chore to keep track of how the text is supposed to be flowing.

If you actually want me to read that, you're going to have to rearrange it into something less ungodly. Even a demented antler fetishist has to hold onto some standards now and again.

That was the point, short version Briennebros stay winning

 

[CasualAntlerEnjoyer]

That was the point, short version Briennebros stay winning

I'm not quite sure I see the wisdom in making something as obnoxiously annoying to read as possible, and then bragging about 'winning' when you've intentionally made it difficult for the other participant of a conversation to respond properly.

That's like tying cinderblocks to someone's legs and then acting like it's some impressive shit that you beat them in a foot race.

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Does this clear it up and that's a waste of good rock.

Spoiler: Pretentious

How boring this world would be, if everyone thought like me, to enjoy an activity so similarly without the same degree of lunacy.

To the point now, the original comment, just the inane rambling of an irritated arachnid drunk on insanity that has been here far too long. At this point I should either start writing psychological horrors or rush off to greener pastures. Now is the information in said post valid, credible, and backed by testimony, yes, to the best of my limited knowledge. Which raises the question: if it's meant to be informative, why make it so obtusive. Simple, it was fun that and if you lurk for any amount of time and you'll notice there's a handful of folks here always eager to play the moral adjudicator, always with something to add but rarely anything of substance. I find them particularly irksome.

However, if you put in a little work into your ramblings, not much mind you. Often they don't bother to give it a cautionary glance or even acknowledge it, except the particularly loquacious ones, but they serve to further prove my point, in a way only someone who's socially tone deaf can. Honestly if all it takes is a few extra button presses to break your train of thought and give up before the gettings good. Did you really care what the other person had to say to begin with?

The other post, I'm just eager for things to come. It has nothing to do with being a braggart, On one side Brienne’s family content is coming back sooner rather then later, what's not to love about that. On the flip side if you know you know and if not, well that's unfortunate. But to those who do, of all the circles I've swam in and of all the sycophants and sociopaths I've seen. You were my favorites and I want you to know, wherever you are.

Now I've wasted enough of these good people's time and my own respectively, I'm sure someone's probably eager to gripe about Cait's grooming temple or lia n azzy's relationship or how quinn's an unapologetic rapist or why titties big or how armor bad or how Kas doesn't really love you or how Kinu hates you now or how cats and foxes are actually the same thing or what have you, the list goes on and on, but ya'll have a good day now.

Spoiler: Simple and Clean

Honestly it's just me venting on the venting thread, imagine that. Nothing to take seriously besides, there's no winning not here on the furry porn forum. Now could I go back and edit what I wrote, sure, try to make it cohesive, coherent, and concise without a doubt. I could but I won't. People ain't gon read it, they've already made up their minds. We got some smart cookies here, they'll figure it out on their own one way or another. If I can do it anybody can just gotta be willing to look.

Besides it's just a shit post and a bad one at that. One you've read far too into it seems, if you've even read it at all, either way I love ya for it. So, if I owe anyone the gist of it, it's you. Thing is some people like Brint, others Brienne and sometimes some jackass for some reason likes to stir the pot and gets on their high horse, to preach to the rest of us. How if you like one you're a monster and if you like the other you're a cu ck. (See what I mean, you can't even write the whole word anymore that's how bad it was) So, if nothing else fuck that guy, don't be that guy. You do you, I'll do me and we won't do each other probably.

 

[CasualAntlerEnjoyer]

You do you, I'll do me and we won't do each other probably.

Imply there's even a remote possibility of us fornicating again and I'll find the means to shove a cheese grater through this screen and straight into your groin.

I don't care if it's a shitty joke, I am personally not alright with that sort of thing.

As for the rest of it, you soured my mood nice and early with:

Often they don't bother to give it a cautionary glance or even acknowledge it, except the particularly loquacious ones, but they serve to further prove my point, in a way only someone who's socially tone deaf can. Honestly if all it takes is a few extra button presses to break your train of thought and give up before the gettings good. Did you really care what the other person had to say to begin with?

I have a neurological disorder that makes certain things hard to follow or retain, but I appreciate this and you editing the previous post to make it seem like I'm some idiot who doesn't like to read.

As it turns out, I would of been all the better off for just not reading anything you've said in the first place, right you were.

 

[Acharehnus]

Just click his profile and ignore. When someone admits right to your face they're amusing themselves by being a troll it's simplest just to believe them.

 

[TVGuru]

"So, yeah... I know that this was meant to be a date, and we haven't actually done any touchy-feely stuff like what someone might expect out of a date..."

Pointing out that it wasn't really much of a date doesn't make up for the fact we didn't get to do an actual date.

 

[Lakka]

I was really surprised to find that golden eggs don't give you a bird tail

 

[Kingu2]

Was going to post this on another thread that got me thinking about this but thought it would be better here.

On second look back the whole kinu storyline is actually pretty bad. It's like a puzzle piece that's from an entirely different puzzle and way bigger than the other pieces that someone just decided to cram in there, fucking up a bunch other pieces to do so. For instance in order for the attack to have happened in the timeframe that it did, the story has to completely diseregard the possibilities that 1. the champion goes to Kiyoko's den on a regular or semi regular basis and 2. that Kiyoko might be a regular fixture in the champions party. It's a real stretch to believe that the champion wouldn't show up at some point during the event or the aftermath to notice all the blood and fire damage.

Barring that, with the torii sealed and them needing to get to Komari's den they would have had to walk through the wayfort to get there which begs the question why did no one stationed or living there say anything to the champion about the 50+ kitsune led by your wife that came through and if you're the Baron of the fort why they didn't shelter them for a while.

Barring that, how did the people Hawkthorne or the inhabitance of the forest not notice the massive fire going on only 100 meters away. you'd think these townsfolk would be concerned about a forest fire and at least send someone to check it out.

Barring that, Kinu was out for a couple of days after that fight which circles back around to how could this have happened without the champ noticing. Seriously the champ being a regular visitor at Kiyoko's leaves a massive plot hole in this story. All of these elements together reeeeeeally pushes the limits of suspension of disbelief at best. basically the rest of the world including the champion themselves have to just stop existing for a few days for this to work.

 

[WolframL]

The same explanation for everything related to pregnancy and how it's biologically possible to have the Champ's children* even be born when the story takes place in the span of a few months: The day tracker is essentially a handwave to allow X amount of time to pass between scripted events but canonically doesn't matter. In other words 'Repeat to yourself 'It's just a show, I should really just relax!'.

* Kiyoko's kits and Freja excepted, because they have a different handwave.

 

[wolfraider13]

The same explanation for everything related to pregnancy and how it's biologically possible to have the Champ's children* even be born when the story takes place in the span of a few months: The day tracker is essentially a handwave to allow X amount of time to pass between scripted events but canonically doesn't matter. In other words 'Repeat to yourself 'It's just a show, I should really just relax!'.

* Kiyoko's kits and Freja excepted, because they have a different handwave.

I get it. But like @Kingu2 was saying it's emersion breaking for me. I actually do enjoy the rest of the kitsune content, just not that particular portion of it so I usually just skip it, I haven't seen where it impacts my games in any meaningful ways if later on with an update it does I may go back and do them until then Raphael can suck it...

 

[WolframL]

And I'd respond that there are certain things you need to do to tell a story and if that means handwaving that there was a sequence of a few days that passed in the Casa de Kiyoko when you weren't present even if the player is capable of visiting it, then so be it. The alternative would be to set a period where you can't access it (or in the second one where Kinu just vanishes for a few days) for people who absolutely must have Muh Realism, but then people would complain about that too.

 

[wolfraider13]

And I'd respond that there are certain things you need to do to tell a story and if that means handwaving that there was a sequence of a few days that passed in the Casa de Kiyoko when you weren't present even if the player is capable of visiting it, then so be it. The alternative would be to set a period where you can't access it (or in the second one where Kinu just vanishes for a few days) for people who absolutely must have Muh Realism, but then people would complain about that too.

Fair point. I was simply stating My views and preferences. If the sequences become relevant down the line I'll go back and slog through them, I did half of it on one of my characters maybe I'll finish it to see...