Man, I remember having to plot out a very specific route in order to end up with a scenario where it's acceptable for Brienne to happen, something like timing the trip back to the Frosthound so that Atugia shows up, leading to you getting inside the Frosthound without Garth talk triggering, then that scene where Brint is in heat happens because of amount of time it took to get back, then it's too late to see Sanders so you go to bed, then right after you wake up Garth asks you to go find Garret, and you can't just leave Garth's son to die that man is your benefactor, so you go do Dog Days and at that point it's been long enough that the armor should trigger. It doesn't because of anti-frustration features, so you don't end up with Brienne by accident, but with that much time having elapsed it should have.
Your gripes with CoC II
- Thread starter Narmlet
- Start date
- Status
I think it also involved using Ahmri to pad your time getting back, just overall a doozy trying to create a scenario where reasonably you would not be able to get the armor off, they really do give you quite a bit of time even before the anti-frustration feature of having to go through each scene in the process a set number of days from the previous one. Instead of one countdown it's a set of countdowns that trigger in sequence so no matter how long you take to get the first scene in the transformation, you still have a fixed number of time before the next scene.
The collar was intended to keep her under control for the immediate future as we're busy infiltrating the castle and can't leave her free to interfere for the next half hour or so; magical obedience collar was the quickest way to restrain her and it was right there to use. The fact that it ends up unremovable because we forgot to establish a safeword is explicitly an accident.
Plus Etheryn doesn't want to kill her because Jae'lyn was genuinely kind to her in the past but doesn't want to risk her pouncing on people and fucking them without consent or turning into a Demon, even if that can end up happening anyway. That's why all those extra bits get involved. I'm sure in epilogue slides she'll get a bit about how the collar came off and she and Delilah shacked up and had a bunch of elven kids or something.
Yeah, this is a setting where magical enchantments can be broken with some combination of time, power and the right knowledge, it's just that these things aren't always within the intended scope of the game. See Cait's brand for the most prominent example of 'Yes it can be broken, yes it could come up in the ending, no it's not happening during gameplay'.
CasualAntlerEnjoyer
Well-Known Member
That's honestly a pretty fair take, it is kinda straight out of left field with that sequence.
Ahahaha, no. The game forced me into enslaving her at the time, so, by all gosh darn Dallizas "sapphic" sparks, I am monopolizing that dick all to myself.
Still waiting for a threesome with Jaelyn and Arona. 2 big subs at your beck and call sounds divine.
If it doesn't feel natural to you, you haven't seen enough shit hit the fan. To paraphrase a quote I've heard somewhere but can't remember who it's attributed to:
Real life can get away with stupid shit no one would think would happen, but you can't argue with it, it's real life and it did happen. Meanwhile, fiction is held to certain standards regarding things that can and should happen because of how it seems logical and natural. The more real you make your story, the more unreal it can seem.
Personally, I had no problem with that scene. And as a writer of a story, EVERYTHING you write is in service to where you want things to go. How else are you to progress the story?
CasualAntlerEnjoyer
Well-Known Member
Eh, yeah, the unexpected and crazy perfect storm situations can and do happen in our reality, but the problem with this line of thought is that is often lacks the nuance needed to make it any more valid then the views it's put in opposition to. There's a whole literary world that has to respond to the nigh impossible occurrence you just dropped in it's lap, characters nearby would naturally acknowledge the seeming hand of fate at work in one for or another.
Hell, when you exist in a world with trickster gods and demon sorceresses, you'd probably be extra attentive of things occurring that seem highly unlikely, especially when they seem to exist solely to enable you to do some twisted sexy shenanigans.
The real issue is the characterization though. Ryn suddenly becoming a curious idiot and going 'wut dat' with the conveniently enchanted slave collar and cock ring that will handily enable you to enslave a dickazon elf in an incredibly fetishistic way, the fact that a low/no corrupt champ raises no concerns with what putting a possibly corruptive item on someone that is already on the brink of demonification might do, the fact that they instantly start flashing some strong domineering vibes with the "MY good girl" line even when they're actually enslaving someone and not just play acting in the bedroom.
Though you are in a tainted fuck palace at the time, so it's possible everyone present is being subtly influenced by ambient dark magicks into being just a wee bit more soup-brained then usual.
For a proper gripe of my own, Jael is worthless as even a slave since there isn't an option to make her compliment one's antlers. Might as well send her to wayfort and let the blue hobo merchant eat her soul since she clearly was not using it to begin with. Despicable.
My wayfort has become a wretched hive of scum and villainy; I always let Jae'lyn loose, and if there was an option to make her less subby I would. More demon chicks to break me, please.
One one hand yeah, i would definitely want more direct corruption of some character by Champ. On the other i have some extremely vague memories of devs not wanting to go in that direction or something along those lines.
Why tho
There's nothing wrong with the Champion - the viewpoint character - taking on a more active role in the story as an unscrupulous bastard. I would find that very entertaining, and it would be our choice as a player.
Last I knew it was more corrupting options would start to appear during the later half of the game otherwise if you just corrupted everything at the start there's a lot of spots where the story just kind of wouldn't work so you can't really run counter to your own story goals right now.
Regarding champ being the one to cause the downfall of an NPC, the most active case is definitely Milly in Khor'minos. Champ drugs her, pushes her boundaries, takes advantage of her, and eventually causes her to manifest signs of demonic corruption. So if that's what you're looking for, look for a baker in Khor'minos.
There's also Nihara in the Undermountain, though it's more of an inadvertent thing. She's a watercatte who takes in influence from liquids, so if a corrupted champ keeps giving her liquids she becomes corrupted.
There are obstacles to champ corruption content - whatever happens, it needs to be justifiable in universe that your companions don't all leave you and you don't get kicked out of the essential story hubs. If you do something so corrupt they kick you out of Khor'minos for example, either the story breaks completely or they have to write a whole separate story path for the narrative to continue. Also, finding people to actually write it, and questions over whether the paying audience would support more direct corrupt content. If champ corrupting people doesn't boost paying subscribers, it's much harder to justify putting time and money into developing it.
There's also Nihara in the Undermountain, though it's more of an inadvertent thing. She's a watercatte who takes in influence from liquids, so if a corrupted champ keeps giving her liquids she becomes corrupted.
There are obstacles to champ corruption content - whatever happens, it needs to be justifiable in universe that your companions don't all leave you and you don't get kicked out of the essential story hubs. If you do something so corrupt they kick you out of Khor'minos for example, either the story breaks completely or they have to write a whole separate story path for the narrative to continue. Also, finding people to actually write it, and questions over whether the paying audience would support more direct corrupt content. If champ corrupting people doesn't boost paying subscribers, it's much harder to justify putting time and money into developing it.
Hey question: why does the upcoming BriHaus expansion consist of 500 pages? That's so many sheets of paper that even if you went double sided you could fit two movie scripts, a monologue and an enormous book of poetry.
Variables.
Just off the top of my head,
-Brint/Brienne
--Romantic/Platonic
---Has Kids Yes/No
-Rina Romantic/Platonic
--Champ Has Dick Yes/No
-Cassia Romantic/Platonic
-if Brienne, Family Matters Yes/No
--Rina Family Matters Yes/No
---If Rina Family Matters Has Dick, Regular/Lesdomme
--Cassia Family Matters Yes/No
Probably going to be an unpopular opinion, but I almost feel like if the corruption parts should have been just left out of the game, considering player interest as well as what seems to be the interest of most of the writers. That's not to say I don't like it, rather the opposite, I just feel that if this was just a straight up champion story with a more traditional heroic fantasy story but with a lot of naughty stuff (Kas romance etc included) added, in more than a few ways this would have been a better game. Those wanting corruption elements wouldn't have been left hanging and looking at those stumped corrupt quest solutions, and writers could focus on what they most wanted to, and not have to devote time to elements only a minority seem to care about, and not have to devote time to "what if the Centaur village/Hornet Hive is still corrupt" etc when writing future content, and instead just focused on expanding what's there already, with the assumption it's always going to be saved/purified, and just let the player instead do as with the Wayfort, decide how much they want to slut up locations rather than "corrupt" them.
I kinda hope the next game by the theme once we get to the end of COC2's dev will go that route, just as well. Maybe even break from "COC" juast as well while at it for a new IP, since as it is the connections are tenous at best and only expressed by Kas and Aileh really. I'd still be here for it regardless, as I like the rest of the game and what the team has done with it, quite a lot at that, I just feel those elements feel like a bit of a miss, for now at least.
I kinda hope the next game by the theme once we get to the end of COC2's dev will go that route, just as well. Maybe even break from "COC" juast as well while at it for a new IP, since as it is the connections are tenous at best and only expressed by Kas and Aileh really. I'd still be here for it regardless, as I like the rest of the game and what the team has done with it, quite a lot at that, I just feel those elements feel like a bit of a miss, for now at least.
Partially what drew me to this game was the corruption aspect (among other things) and it doesn't seem like the writers want anything to do with it. I mentioned before that I really enjoyed Renegade in Mass Effect, and in SW:TOR it shows that being a villain can be just as fulfilling as being a hero, if not more fulfilling than being a jedi or republic soldier.
Here it's like the writers have zero interest in making an interesting path for DK champions, and all I can think of is, why even bother to put it in the game if it just leads to a dead end? I'm genuinely curious as to what the deal is with that. I want to do the corrupting, not handing it over to someone else. If that's not going to happen, then why bother making a corrupted path in the first place? I'm confused about that.
I remember saying a while back, but I feel like the next game after CoC2 will probably be to CoC what Sekiro was for Dark Souls. Whole different ip with many of the customization and variables for the player removed to focus on a more specific narrative experience, where the writers can actually have a defined player character to work with rather than a blob.
Next game is a next game, but let's not excuse CoC2 incompetentce at providing the corrupt champs with adequate content and rewards for the seeming unpopularity. And while we could use other, more popular games as an example for why doing evil-leaning content is unadvised (although frankly there is more to that discussion then what stats present...),this is a porn game and porn game audience have diverse set of fetishes that are perfect for corrupt champ.
Rape, mind break, enslavement, slavery, infidelity, cheating, moral degradation and all that fun stuff. Hell, dedicking a futa is pretty popular request that seems tailor made for a champ that likes to impose their will onto others.
Or let's look at Hive for example -- well, Corrupt Azzy and Liaden are already there, and they both are more than willing to serve the champ. I think a lot of people would be more than happy if they got expanded on with more scenes, and maybe even pregnancy content that they both tease. Or make the champ honorable King/Queen of the hive and see where you go from there.
Or maybe just have content that can be only be accessed by the corrupt champ.
Moral corruption of pure-virginal paladin (male).
Let us fuck someones loved one behind their back.
Or let us become true King/Queen of the elves while we use Ryn as a figure head.
I just don't like giving the game a free pass when, frankly, it has never tried. CoC is remembered for a lot of its corrupt content (amoung many things), and I think it would do the sequel plenty of good if it embraced it's prior legacy.
Last edited:
CasualAntlerEnjoyer
Well-Known Member
A reasonable predication, they're honestly just missing the IP change for that to be effectively the case as it is. The biggest challenge would be finding a name as blessed as CoC or TiTs
Can't go all in on corruption or being a pure ball of holy whoop ass and smite evil(when it's needed), your PC acts entirely how the narrative of the plot bubble you're in dictates they should leading to high corrupt champs often being too soft and low corrupt champs seeming apathetic, neglectful and downright cruel at times, and that in turn means your PC generally has a more defined personality in most scenes regardless of if they're Champ or Dark Knight(or bimbo).
I was honestly prepared to drop a full rant on the topic, but I've decided against it for now. At the very least I can wait to post that till it's not going to pinged directly to someone as a reply, no one wants a random text wall appearing on their doorstep uninvited. Plus to be true I'm a wee bit too tired today to really get into it with anyone, and big text walls invite adversity no matter how they're worded.
Damn. I see.
I wouldn't suggest anyone try writing a quest with so many variables unless the game they're writing for is the next Mass Effect or Dragon Age. All this seems like too many variables for porn.
This feels like a point where the first game accidentally screwed over this one by making it so Corruption content was expected even though almost nobody working on this game actually wants or is even willing to do it. Even sex with Kasyrra only results in an amount of Corruption that you can burn off with a visit to the Cloister.
They'll probably do that. I mean this isn't exactly Star Wars or Game of Thrones. Not like there's a massive fanbase wishing for tightly integrated sequels full of callbacks and continuity.
Yeah even a lot of Paragon players like to pick some of the funnier Renegade interrupts or persuasion options. "Hey, everyone! This store discriminates against the poor!" LOL
I'm not sure, but it reminds me of Anton Chekhov's famous quote that gave rise to the term "Chekhov's Gun": "If you say in the first chapter that there is a rifle hanging on the wall, in the second or third chapter it absolutely must go off. If it's not going to be fired, it shouldn't be hanging there." In this case, maybe they shouldn't have put in the Corruption content unless there are much greater plans for Dark Knight players down the line.
There is dedicking futa content in the game right now, but it's not corrupt since the dick was forced upon her. True Corruption content might be more in the veins of CBT.
Wouldn't Queen Nyzerrah have to die for Champ to take control of the Hive? Or another Hive have to be built elsewhere?
Funnily enough, I wouldn't be surprised if that last one became the subject of a quest or rumours floating around the Winter City or something given Ryn's initial low confidence. Maybe Alissa has loyalists somewhere and Ryn has to deal with them at some point.
I dunno, definitely seems like they're not too pushed about honouring the first game beyond some continuity nods. They might reference a character or two (I mean Aileh is like a combo of Helia, Kiho and to a lesser extent Ember and this game's version of Raphael is a thumb in the eye to the original) but besides that, this game is its own thing.
This is going to be a stupid and petty gripe that everyone is free to just utterly ignore;
I hate that all companions and most important NPCs in the game are by default stronger than the Champion in terms of ability scores and the like. Let's start as a Wyld Elf White Mage, +3 to initial Willpower, great! Except Cait has the same Willpower, as well as +1 to her Toughness and Presence and a +2 to her Agility. You meet Brint, he has higher strength than it is possible for the player to ever get (and numerous abilities like Frenzy likewise always unavailable, when you'd think Lupines and Orcs should be able to go as batshit crazy as some cow seeing red). And this repeats for every single companion basically, including temporary ones like El and Hethia, and don't get me STARTED on Calise and some other characters.
I know, I know; it gets evened out by equipment, as while their initial starting gear is much better than the good old Comfortable Clothes that stop being the case pretty fast, and the Champion's ability to learn a stupid amount of powers and customize per encounter likely more than evens it out. And completely non-player characters shouldn't matter, they are only as strong as the scenario requires them to be, anyone who's ever DMed D&D would know that!
But damnit if that initial inequality just hurts my inner power fantasy gamer heart in ways I have issues describing...
Now excuse me while export this new save and fix those issues in the save editor... Which has the sideways consequence of me never even giving a shit about combat in this game and just leaving it on Story mode for most of the time, making my initial gripe completely pointless beyond the "looking at stats" part basically. But that's another matter entirely.
I hate that all companions and most important NPCs in the game are by default stronger than the Champion in terms of ability scores and the like. Let's start as a Wyld Elf White Mage, +3 to initial Willpower, great! Except Cait has the same Willpower, as well as +1 to her Toughness and Presence and a +2 to her Agility. You meet Brint, he has higher strength than it is possible for the player to ever get (and numerous abilities like Frenzy likewise always unavailable, when you'd think Lupines and Orcs should be able to go as batshit crazy as some cow seeing red). And this repeats for every single companion basically, including temporary ones like El and Hethia, and don't get me STARTED on Calise and some other characters.
I know, I know; it gets evened out by equipment, as while their initial starting gear is much better than the good old Comfortable Clothes that stop being the case pretty fast, and the Champion's ability to learn a stupid amount of powers and customize per encounter likely more than evens it out. And completely non-player characters shouldn't matter, they are only as strong as the scenario requires them to be, anyone who's ever DMed D&D would know that!
But damnit if that initial inequality just hurts my inner power fantasy gamer heart in ways I have issues describing...
Now excuse me while export this new save and fix those issues in the save editor... Which has the sideways consequence of me never even giving a shit about combat in this game and just leaving it on Story mode for most of the time, making my initial gripe completely pointless beyond the "looking at stats" part basically. But that's another matter entirely.
It's not really right to say that a game screwed over it's sequal by being what it is. Rather if you take on an IP your taking on all of the expectations that were set by it, If they aren't ready and willing to do that it begs the question as to why they took it on in the first place. If they wanted to make their own thing why not just do that instead of trying to overwrite an existing IP.
really not bothered by this given how bad their AI is and especially after I've figured out how to solo most of the game. The game does a fairly decent job in displaying how much more capable the pc is compared to everyone else around them and I think companions benfitting from pc's leadership really reflects how great of a leader they are. I personally find the combat to be interesting enough to keep me engaged as well as test and prod every facet of it. It's certainly much better than CoC1 or TiTS where you can get by by mashing the attack button and healing every so often.
CasualAntlerEnjoyer
Well-Known Member
Yes, but Unbreakable is more precious because you could survive a space station falling on you from orbit and still survive with 1 HP assuming the planet is still there.
On the subject of ults, I really feel like most of them suck. Like they just aren't good in practice even if in theory they should be. Except for Inspiration and to a bit lesser an extent, Revive.
For example, by the time I'd usually use Unbreakable, there's almost never enough healing to actually come back from 1 health unless I had both other party members spam heals if they were even alive themselves.
Assassinate I've never understood... I'm not sure how attack power is actually used in this game, but almost every time I've ever used it, even with the supposedly great weapons (like Galon's Griefmaker) it seems to only increase my damage output by like 50-70 points of inflicted damage. Which is barely more than using that one skill that gives you an extra 200 (IIRC) attack power on hit, and roughly the same as the damage done by the Influence power you can learn from Zo. And Influence is an encounter power, not even an ult.
As for the others I know of, I'd say they're honestly too niche. It's hard for me to ever think of a use for them.
Maybe I've missed something but they just don't seem good.
For example, by the time I'd usually use Unbreakable, there's almost never enough healing to actually come back from 1 health unless I had both other party members spam heals if they were even alive themselves.
Assassinate I've never understood... I'm not sure how attack power is actually used in this game, but almost every time I've ever used it, even with the supposedly great weapons (like Galon's Griefmaker) it seems to only increase my damage output by like 50-70 points of inflicted damage. Which is barely more than using that one skill that gives you an extra 200 (IIRC) attack power on hit, and roughly the same as the damage done by the Influence power you can learn from Zo. And Influence is an encounter power, not even an ult.
As for the others I know of, I'd say they're honestly too niche. It's hard for me to ever think of a use for them.
Maybe I've missed something but they just don't seem good.
May I recommend my post on Banishment right here?
- Status