You are very fun to debate with. I like you.
Been quite a while since I've gotten that
Thanks! I need to hear it every once in a while.
The concise way to say my opinion is that one person's free will stops where another person's starts. You can do whatever you want to yourself and to people who consent, but the minute you involve a non-consenting or unknowing individual you've crossed the line.
Note that by "consent" I mean "informed consent" which doesn't really apply to New Texas IMO because no one is informed. Everyone is basically brainwashed into thinking the Treatment is basically tits on toast BY the Treatment itself so it can be pretty difficult to inform people of the consequences. Reaha formed her view of it through observation, which is not something that everyone is going to have either the opportunity to obtain or the mind to comprehend.
One could, reasonably, argue that there isn't in fact consent at all on NT seeing as the last thing a parent does to a child during their tenure as property owners is to give them the treatment. (I wonder how big this one is gonna blow up
)
Tl/dr: You yourself have no right to FORCE the end of the Treatment/destroying it. That would make you JUST AS bad as the Society on NT. The only thing you could/should do is "force" them to make the Treatment a choice.
I REALLY do hear you here. But there's a problem. First, you are getting WAY too emotionaly about this and are using personal language and accusatory phrases. This is either a conversation/debate or I will not participate. To continue, we are GENERATIONS into this process as of game-time. NT got away with this crap because they were outside of UGC purview during it's inception. It's stated quite clearly that this could never have happened in the midst of the UGCs jurisdiction. Basically because everyone taking The Treatment would be required to consent
INFORMEDLY, and I don't care how good Mr. Bull-o-doom's cock is . . . ain't NO group of women gonna give up their mind and ability to reason through life
en masse. Some? Sure. . . but not all or even close.
Do you understand the concept of indentured servitude? Can you see that what The Treatment does is enslave 51% of the population, since they're humans I'm presuming that time hasn't changed the ratio. I'm perfectly fine with someone CONSENTING themselves into slavery, presuming their mental state at the point of consent can be reasonably confirmed and they are not acting under duress. Having personally been at the mercy of mental and emotional abuse I would ABSOLUTELY consider the things that occur on NT to be clear examples of "duress". To put it mildly. Reaha made it quite clear that she had little choice in the whole process and that she was one of few brave enough to escape rather than take the treatment. I mean just imagine for a moment, growing up more emotionally aware and possibly smarter than your own mother. Watching her being led around by the men in town, yanked on by her "sex strings". Then being told by your dad that next year you're gonna turn into a milk making sex addled slave. He'd never use those words but you've watched your mom long enough to know what she REALLY is. Children don't miss a beat, and if one thinks they do . . .they've never raised one, or have slept though the process.
I suppose that one could possibly consider raising children as brainwashing . . . but I find that to be a distasteful and narrow view of the process. I consider what parents, who try to care about the process, to be doing is much more like laying a light but guiding referential framework through which the world as it presents itself can be ingested, digested, and then absorbed into the psyche in such a way that it informs and recreates said framework. This is, of course, much easier said that done, and it wasn't all that easy to interpret reality into those words either. As any ideal it must survive the hells of reality in order to achieve some semblance of existence. Every parent at some point comes to understand that you WILL fuck up your child. I believe that this is because we all have to be fucked up to be here at all. It's highly debatable as to whether we enter the world fucked up, are made that way through life, or the process occurs betwixt the two. The point though is that a parent's "training" should be light enough that the child, when they become an adult, can question it and determine for themselves if it's right for THEM. The Treatment and the parenting that goes hand in hand with it . . . cannot by any stretch of the imagination fit into such a category. Nor could it even say it is in the same neighborhood.
Finally, saying that this stuff is a requirement of society is UTTER BULLSHIT. Society is DEFINED by it's members not the other way around. Society is not government a slow bureaucratic body incapable of seeing it's own tail. Society is amorphous and constantly changing as defined by the will of its constituent parts. Individuals may cling psychologically to the state their society was in when they crystallized their own psyche. but society moves on without them. Thus the entirety of what we call "generation gap".
I fucking love you people.
Thanks. As far as the men go, I don't really have a problem with the men doing what they do. They are not enslaving themselves. They maintain all faculties after transition, and are "enhanced" to perform the functions most men desire to perform.
I do not think you would find a majority on NT to support and uphold a system like that. In the end, even if you would manage to establish it, it would not last. Although I got to admit, Carrie in some strict pant suit or something would be my thing. And a scene where Amma or Ogram leave their sex scene, because they have to give Treatment Education to a class would be hilarious.
Oh hells no. There ain't nothing gonna change a damned thing on NT. This is all hypothetical debate and exposition on The Treatment. I do not believe that an undereducated minority of one gender's minors could stage a governmental coup. But it would certainly be interesting to see
. . . Example: is it okay for a 16 year old to have sex with a 30 year old if they are apart of a religion or culture that would consider the 16 year old an adult? What point would the law be infringing on that? I for one would be like "Of course that's illegal, they aren't 18" because I personally would hold the law over what a culture I was not apart of would consider adult. That is an extreme case I know, and probably not typical. Depending on the culture they could easily tread both ideas of a traditional rite of passage as well as the law of the land.
This is a perfect example of what is destroying constitutional values and rights in the United States of America. The free will of the individual MUST BE PARAMOUNT. The federal government, being the largest governmental body, must thereby have the LEAST power, because it is the LEAST individuated. Regulation is by it's very nature the killing of free will. It is also important to note that what you are talking about is NOT the law of the land it is legal statute operating
UNDER THE COLOR OF LAW. In the USA at least religion DOES supercede legal statute, and that is mostly because the law of the land backs it up in such. THIS is the model that we were given with our constitution and the "grand experiment" that's been heard of. It's not in process now, and may never be again. The federal government is not larger than any other body in the nation and there's little likelihood of that changing. /endrant.
Regarding Treatment, NT and UGC. I think it's pretty clear in the game that the universes society has a severe distaste for what's happening on NT and that if they could put a stop to it they would have already. My recollection is that NT has a charter or some such from the original exodus of humanity, which essentially gives them something like "grandfathered in" rights that the UGC no longer allows anyone to have for themselves. The citizens of NT could not be charged with trafficking illegal mods because it's a one time thing. The treatment isn't IN them anymore it's done it's business and is gone. Thus it's permanency and irreversibility.
TL;DR: Lots of judgements and debate regarding various things, most of which amount to little more than seeking common ground with other people in the world and maybe testing a few people's mental footing
