Your gripes with CoC II

[Wsan]

You may not like it, but virginity loss is a fetish. Just like all the other fetish content we make.

Those cases you listed are ignored. There's no mention of it, not even a lick.

Sorry, but I can't help but address this. This is the least true post I have seen about CoC2 outside of 4chan threads. All of those things he mentioned are in the game in spades.

 

[Shizenhakai]

I actually have another gripe, something I just noticed.

I seem to miss parts of the describtion - I blame ...Keros - and so I end up with oversized breasts. =(

Edited because I was an idiot here.. =(

 

[Shion]

I actually have another gripe, something I just noticed.

I often pay not that much attention to mob battles, so I assume there lies the reason for it, but my char keeps ending with ZZ breasts.
I think your breasts should not be increased during battle, it is a hassle to buy loads of minoblood to get rid of them. =(


Unless the imps are not the cause of it.. but then I have to wonder *what* the cause of it is.. oô

That's because you're wearing the ring of infinite back pain.

 

[Shizenhakai]

That's because you're wearing the ring of infinite back pain.

Ahhh, that actually explains it. No idea how I overlooked that.. probably I was to happy about another uniqe ring to completly read the additional effect..
Welp, time to edit that gripe, thanks for your help. x_x

 

[SheepPun]

Okay yeah, incredibly dumb logic on my part which disregarded a lot of important things.
I apologize for bumping in when I really should've not.

rolls off

 

[Wsan]

Okay yeah, incredibly dumb logic on my part which disregarded a lot of important things.
I apologize for bumping in when I really should've not.

rolls off

I think you are justified in being annoyed at the hymen thing (as is any woman, really). The unfortunate reality is that rather than writers not understanding women, virginity loss content is usually targeting men who like that kind of thing -- and hymen tearing is a symbolic thing. Rather than anatomical inaccuracy, it's just fetishization. It's like someone's previous gripe about not liking overlarge tiddies and dicks. It's not dumb to hate it (or any fetish you don't like), it's just that you weren't the target audience.

Since it was mentioned, I'll say this now: everyone in the world knows a tap to the cervix isn't pleasurable IRL (and don't get at me saying you like it when it's a soft rubbing you pedants you know what I mean). We still write it because it's CoC, and that's a turn-on for people who read a lot of hentai (spoilers: most of our userbase).

 

[Emerald]

Jeebus, I didn't think my gripe would cause this much of a fuss. I hope I didn't step on any toes about the hymen thing. x.x''

 

[Anzuneth]

I think you are justified in being annoyed at the hymen thing (as is any woman, really). The unfortunate reality is that rather than writers not understanding women, virginity loss content is usually targeting men who like that kind of thing -- and hymen tearing is a symbolic thing. Rather than anatomical inaccuracy, it's just fetishization. It's like someone's previous gripe about not liking overlarge tiddies and dicks. It's not dumb to hate it (or any fetish you don't like), it's just that you weren't the target audience.

Since it was mentioned, I'll say this now: everyone in the world knows a tap to the cervix isn't pleasurable IRL (and don't get at me saying you like it when it's a soft rubbing you pedants you know what I mean). We still write it because it's CoC, and that's a turn-on for people who read a lot of hentai (spoilers: most of our userbase).

Hmm, now I'm curious as to just how much of this kind of content is an actual misconception on the creators part, versus deliberate fetishization. As most pieces give no tell as to which it is, and I'm certain that some porn out there is made by people whose only experience with sex is hentai and the shite sex ed we get in schools, and they legitimately believe that spearing the cervix is extremely pleasurable for all women.

 

[Shosela]

While not a gripe with the game itself, I do wish that the Wiki was more up to date. I'm aware that it's not exactly that important compared to all the work being done on the game itself, and despite that many pages are being worked on (which I am thankful for), but as someone who loves to do as much as possible within games I love, its really annoying that the Wiki can't even tell me if I've done all the quests in the game, or if there are hidden interactions I've yet to trigger.

 

[1234567890van]

I'm curious as to just how much of this kind of content is an actual misconception on the creators part, versus deliberate fetishization.

While generalizing is typically inaccurate, I'd like to think any writer worth their salt is well versed in the subject matter of their content and that would certainly extent to sex and the body. I've personally learned some pretty obscure things about my own body while crawling the forums during discussions similar to these. That being said, I've definitely read some hentai where the authors clearly had no idea how the female body works. I would say it depends on the community the writers come from -- such mistakes are fairly rare here since the content is reviewed by professional smut writers.

 

[Savin]

Hmm, now I'm curious as to just how much of this kind of content is an actual misconception on the creators part

Among our writers, very little. We know exactly what we're doing and how dumb it is. But boners, man.

 

[VynalDerp]

Hmm. One of the things that's been bothering me a bit recently is Kiyoko. Her scenes really rub the wrong way. They're well written, but I keep getting taken out of them. It starts off well, some nice warm body friction, tail play, something I can enjoy. But then, right afterwards, is the word "slut-wife" or "slutsune" etc. Every couple of paragraphs these two words (or similar) come up and well, I'm very much sick of it and seeing them just takes me out of any scene. I get that she's a slutty wife, yes, I can tell because of the "hunger in her eyes" and how she's "eager to make kits". I don't need her to be labelled as "slut-wife" every two or three paragraphs in order to know she is, indeed, a slut and my wife.

I was reading one of her scenes recently and I saw the line: "You can't have your lovely..." and the first thing that came to mind was "...lovely slut-wife..." and I rolled my eyes. Then I actually read it: "...lovely vixen wife..." and I was honestly rather surprised. And reading the rest of that paragraph, it did an excellent job at describing why she is a slut rather than just telling me she was one for the hundredth time.

I kinda think Kiyoko herself sums it up best: "After we've made so many kits together... is there anything we don't know about each other at this point?" Well, I'm currently at day 271 and I initially got Kiyoko's amulet on day 17... although I haven't seen all of her scenes (mostly dream scenes with event-related stuff like Mother's Day or New Years), I have seen way more than enough of her (including her talk scenes as a companion) to say that this statement is very much accurate, both for my character in-game and myself IRL.

Another bit that bothers me about her... with interactions with others and outside of sex, she's often presented as well, a character, and is well-written in that role. But it sort of creates a divide to sex scenes, where she comes off as more of a generic sexy slut with the emphasis on slut and not much else... even the line I referenced above, which out of context seems like a loving statement, is immediately followed up about how she loves recieving my character's semen which sort of undermines the more maternal loving nature of the line with a more sexual tone. Less of a wife, more of a slut. It does make me feel like she's less of a character and more of an empty vessel for sexing. Which isn't really a bad thing on it's own, it is a porn game after all. I wouldn't be playing if the sex scenes weren't there, but at least to me it creates a bit of a harsh split between her two halves that drag the experience with her down for me.

Dunno, maybe I've just seen too much of her and it's just a me thing or something. Just wanted to slot this here as it's been on my mind recently, and I would very much like to see more of her as a wife rather than a slut. More talk scenes or more substance in her talk scenes or something (rather than just a paragraph or two), idk.

 

[Ossa]

Not going to lie, I'm with Vynal on that one. It doesn't take me completely out of the scene, and it doesn't particularly bother me, but I feel like that'd be better off in Silly Mode.

 

[WolframL]

I found the retrospective backstory on him interesting, in a classic tragedy way. He had good intentions and was a good leader by orc standards but he had the fatal flaw of wanting everything to be about him and his victory and that led to his downfall. To me that feels like it's the whole point.

 

[Savin]

arona on the other hand is the orciest orc happy to rape and pillage and would probs be fine with kass corruption and demonification. she just seems like such a downgrade for the orcs.

I mean, you're not wrong.

 

[Zandar]

I mean, you're not wrong.

I'm pretty sure that most people who have really thought it through understand that Arona is probably the worst leader that any group could possibly have, even worse somehow then Argosh, but that is completely fine because she doesn't actually do anything at all. She just sits on the thrown getting blowjobs while Hretha actually, you know, leads. Especially when Arona is just fucking around in the frostwood with the PC (eventually tm.)

Of course that could all be bullshit but we won't know until Arona's chief content progresses further past "Hey {pcname}, hows it going? [leave tent]".

(Holy fuck I just realized Arona's post-quest interaction is identical to the Rhenworld CEO on the Uveto satelite...)

 

[Zandar]

Arona is definitely a unique take on the "Savage-race companion" archetype. Usually you have the barbarian who is part of a group of savages that are destroying everything and they are like "I need to stop this, this will lead to the end of our people", or "I know there is more to life then simple raiding" or some bullshit like that. Like any non brainlet super-mutants in fallout games.

Arona is the literal exact opposite. Argoth has brought his tribe to this land because he somehow knows something world shakingly important is coming, and he is right because of Kasyrra, the wraiths, or some combination of both. I don't remember if he decided what side he was on, but he wanted his people to take part in something that would reshape the world as we know it.

And then Arona is his shithead sister who wants him dethroned as chief because she is bored. Not because she thinks he is crazy, or because their tribe is getting killed off by the Frost march natives. She is literally just bored, because considering they are raiders and there is no one around the marches worth robbing that won't slaughter them if they try. She wants to beat up her brother and take over so that they can all go home or at least somewhere that sucks less... which she doesn't do (yet).

TLDR: this is the opposite of a gripe, it is genuinely cool to see Arona be a new inverted take of the Token Barbarian/Enemy-turned-companion character.

 

[Shizenhakai]

I'm pretty sure that most people who have really thought it through understand that Arona is probably the worst leader that any group could possibly have, even worse somehow then Argosh, but that is completely fine because she doesn't actually do anything at all. She just sits on the thrown getting blowjobs while Hretha actually, you know, leads. Especially when Arona is just fucking around in the frostwood with the PC (eventually tm.)

Of course that could all be bullshit but we won't know until Arona's chief content progresses further past "Hey {pcname}, hows it going? [leave tent]".

(Holy fuck I just realized Arona's post-quest interaction is identical to the Rhenworld CEO on the Uveto satelite...)

Weeell, Hretha basically spells it out for us - but she also reminds us that it was only a matter of time before a Thane challenges him.
And even if he would win via Troll, that would massivly weaken his power, more desertions, less recruits etc etc.

Here is my view, which could be completly off, of course:

Argosh did not try to make more out of the Orcs, he tried to make himself into a living legend or elevate him to nigh-divine levels.
Arona is a brute, he is a brute with delusions of grandeur - which is also the reason why we can not side with him.
He thinks he can win this epic clash. Not the Champion and his allies, not even his tribe, he himself.
The tribe is there to fight the trash mobs, he will slaughter a bunch of them and then defeat the enemy in glorious combat.

His entire "plan" was not realistic. He did not try to form an army for a second Godswar, he did not create alliances to strengthen himself.
He thought himself ready to become a legend and waited for fate to arrive.

The moment he interpreted his sisters vision, the tribe was doomed.

 

[Mad Dog]

Not really a gripe, but it's kinds sad to think that the champion will die decades before Kiyoko. We also never learn the lifespan of a kitsune or even have a codex log for them.

 

[Balaknightfang]

Surely you're joking

Spoiler

 

[WolframL]

Especially when Arona is just fucking around in the frostwood with the PC (eventually tm.)

Figuratively or literally?

..come to think, I'll bet the forest Kitsune would love Arona and her stamina. Either that or she'd write checks her body couldn't actually cash and then we'd have to drag her comatose ass back to camp/the Frost Hound.

Not really a gripe, but it's kinds sad to think that the champion will die decades before Kiyoko.

In terms of lifespans I'd worry more the Champion and Ryn. Even a Wyld Elf's average lifespan is almost a century below Ryn's expected lifespan given in the Codex and this post by The Observer suggests that Ryn's actual lifespan is likely to be a hell of a lot longer than that, so depending on which number is more correct we have a character who's likely to outlive everyone else in the game who isn't literally immortal by an enormous margin. Which would kinda suck for her if that's the case, but I imagine that the elves would have long-since gotten used to it.

Actually, I should probably ping @Savin on this, since it's a pretty big difference in those numbers.

 

[Savin]

since it's a pretty big difference in those numbers.

The average lifespan is perhaps 200 years, though some individuals may grow far older.

No difference detected, move along citizen.

 

[Mad Dog]

Surely you're joking

Spoiler

How'd you unlock that? Normally just encountering another race unlocks the codex log. But I've talked to literally every kitsune in the game and haven't unlocked that log entry or even the harpies.

 

[WolframL]

No difference detected, move along citizen.

So... is that a nobility thing then? Because a 200 year average and this are really different, quoting from The Observer's post I linked before.

Foxen don't have the lifespan of thousands of years the boer'alvar might expect barring illness, misfortune or violence

 

[Mad Dog]

Figuratively or literally?

..come to think, I'll bet the forest Kitsune would love Arona and her stamina. Either that or she'd write checks her body couldn't actually cash and then we'd have to drag her comatose ass back to camp/the Frost Hound.

In terms of lifespans I'd worry more the Champion and Ryn. Even a Wyld Elf's average lifespan is almost a century below Ryn's expected lifespan given in the Codex and this post by The Observer suggests that Ryn's actual lifespan is likely to be a hell of a lot longer than that, so depending on which number is more correct we have a character who's likely to outlive everyone else in the game who isn't literally immortal by an enormous margin. Which would kinda suck for her if that's the case, but I imagine that the elves would have long-since gotten used to it.

Actually, I should probably ping @Savin on this, since it's a pretty big difference in those numbers.

I just checked. And if you accept Keros' offer to become his champion you become a kitsune and can grow old by Kiyoko's side. The dialogue even changes accordingly.

 

[Mad Dog]

What specific dialogue changes in what scenes?

Keep asking Kiyoko about the situation. Eventually she'll mention living out the rest of her natural lifespan.

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

My first character was a pure presence build and while I initially thought reducing the enemies resolve would be much more effective than their HP since it's almost always the lower stat and harder to restore, it never worked in practice because my companions very rarely, if ever, used resolve damaging attacks. So I wind up caressing my rippling abdominals or Thicc Titties ineffectually while Cait and Brint fireball and smash their way to victory. Maybe that's the point, since the purpose of prescence is to increase companion effectiveness, but I rarely encountered situations where touching myself was more effective than just "hit dude with stick". I think if enemies received more and more debuffs as their resolve/HP got lower it would incentivise mixing damage more. Usually fights just ended with a dead Drider Queen or something with 46 resolve and 0 HP and I'm just imagining all the shit talk my companions must be heaping on me just sitting there touching myself while their busy actually getting work done.
That being said I haven't tried a charisma build since that first character so it's definitely possible I was just doing something wrong, let me know if that's the case. Otherwise I'll just be here ORKO'ing everything with Garrote.

The lack of neat catalysts kind of dissuades me from using magic, I've never liked the idea of having this secret unnatural power but I need to be holding a stick or roll of parchment to use it effectively. It makes it seem less like magic, something separate from the natural world, and more of a science, manipulating the natural world, if i'm using a tool to accomplish it. It's like if Tetsuo could only use his sick ass mind powers if he was holding a wooden spoon. Something along the lines of for example psionic or biotic implants from Starcraft or Mass Effect would feel much more gratifying cause that's like "hey you have the power in you already but you need to focus it with this to avoid destroying yourself." as opposed to "take this pinch of cilantro and bat shit and hit the rock with the stick to activate the spell" which sounds more like baking pastries. More of a personal, philosophical gripe that's frustrating cause it has no practical solution. Even if everyone else agreed and you have like some oven mits or some sick tatoos or a stack of divorce papers that act as power limiters you would still have to explain why every other mage doesn't need one that would require overhauling the whole way magic works. But, you know, gripe thread.

The swift sword took a real long time for me to get, not sure if it's intentional or if I just have bad luck but I spend all evening after work the other day save scumming in between taking breaks to go sleep and sex harpies before kohaku offered to sell me one.

Also personally think attribute bonuses on character creation should be chosen independent of character race/background since TF items practically reduce those options to starting stat boosts anyway, and this will allow me to keep min/maxing separate from my RP background, but that's the power gamer in me talking.

That's really it, everything else in this game is fantastic.

 

[TheShepard256]

My first character was a pure presence build and while I initially thought reducing the enemies resolve would be much more effective than their HP since it's almost always the lower stat and harder to restore, it never worked in practice because my companions very rarely, if ever, used resolve damaging attacks. So I wind up caressing my rippling abdominals or Thicc Titties ineffectually while Cait and Brint fireball and smash their way to victory. Maybe that's the point, since the purpose of prescence is to increase companion effectiveness, but I rarely encountered situations where touching myself was more effective than just "hit dude with stick". I think if enemies received more and more debuffs as their resolve/HP got lower it would incentivise mixing damage more. Usually fights just ended with a dead Drider Queen or something with 46 resolve and 0 HP and I'm just imagining all the shit talk my companions must be heaping on me just sitting there touching myself while their busy actually getting work done.

Try using manual combat flow; then, you'll be able to make your companions use Tease attacks (and Ultimates). And for companion choice, from most to least suited: Quin's power set is built around dealing lots of Resolve damage, all of Atugia's attacks (including her basic one) deal both physical and Resolve damage, and Berwyn has one ability that deals Resolve damage. You might also want to pick up some of the Charmer and/or Black Mage spells that deal Resolve damage.

Keep in mind that some enemies are immune to Tease, Pheromone and Drug damage, but none of them are immune to Mental/Mind damage, so a party built around dealing lots of Mental/Mind damage specifically is theoretically capable of taking out any enemy party so long as you can survive long enough.

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

Try using manual combat flow; then, you'll be able to make your companions use Tease attacks (and Ultimates). And for companion choice, from most to least suited: Quin's power set is built around dealing lots of Resolve damage, all of Atugia's attacks (including her basic one) deal both physical and Resolve damage, and Berwyn has one ability that deals Resolve damage. You might also want to pick up some of the Charmer and/or Black Mage spells that deal Resolve damage.

Keep in mind that some enemies are immune to Tease, Pheromone and Drug damage, but none of them are immune to Mental/Mind damage, so a party built around dealing lots of Mental/Mind damage specifically is theoretically capable of taking out any enemy party so long as you can survive long enough.

I'll definitely give this a try, thanks for the tips.

 

[The Observer]

I think if enemies received more and more debuffs as their resolve/HP got lower it would incentivise mixing damage more.

This is fundamentally an idea we don't want as it results in a "lose more" situation where one party becomes less and less able to win as they begin to lose. Combat quickly becomes decided midway, and prevents not just the player coming back from bad situations, but enemies as well, preventing surprise moves on the part of enemies. It also heavily favours burst damage builds instead of sustain.

You chose companions that had dysynergies with yourself; splitting damage is not meant to be a good thing and is not something we want to encourage.

The lack of neat catalysts kind of dissuades me from using magic, I've never liked the idea of having this secret unnatural power but I need to be holding a stick or roll of parchment to use it effectively. It makes it seem less like magic, something separate from the natural world, and more of a science, manipulating the natural world, if i'm using a tool to accomplish it.

A lot of magic in this setting is basically approached in the same way as science is -- it's just that the natural laws of Savarra differ from ours, that's all. Given her speech in the winter city, it's clear that Kasyrra openly considers herself a scientist, in spirit if not necessarily in name.

Magic is not considered secret or unnatural; the extent of this depends on culture, but even Ivriss operates openly.