Nightgames Mod (v2.5.1.2) updated 2/11/17

[DarkSinfulMage]

Merging Branches with conflicts for dummies:

Resolving conflicts seems easy. I just have to delete my conflict in favor of the branch I'm merging. Most of them look like so:

<<<<<<< HEAD
            String workshop = Global.checkFlag(Flag.FTC) ? "Cabin" : "Workshop";
            Move path = character.findPath(Global.getMatch().gps(workshop).orElse(character.location));
=======
            String workshop = Flag.checkFlag(Flag.FTC) ? "Cabin" : "Workshop";
            Move path = character.findPath(Match.getMatch().gps(workshop));
>>>>>>> pr/4

So I delete my half and save over yours.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

EDIT:

Today I broke a lot of things because I'm blind and got excited to get something major done. Now I have a lot of things to fix and it's mostly my fault. I ruined my fork and I can't figure out how to go backwards. I have a backup before I started anything today but that doesn't seem to work when overwriting the project. I'll keep trying.

EDIT2:

Finally. Back to normal. I lost some work, but it wasn't much at all.

On the bright side, I learned a few useful things and wrote them down. I'm a little better equipped to handle incoming work and various crises and disasters. I guess no pain no gain. I also learned the extent of incoming changes, so that gives me an idea of places to avoid doing redundant work that will conflict. Conflicts make the merging process messy and difficult.

 

[Sacredferro]

Is there a way to skip to a certain day? I want to look at Maya, but she only appears at a certain day. Quitting matches instantly still takes too long.

Only way that I know of is to get to a save point before a match and edit the save in notepad++ to adjust the day. Then again, I don't know if the day is tracked in the save, though I'd be surprised if not. Then just load the game and when you want to move on to a new day, readjust the day again.

 

[Ryplinn]

Only way that I know of is to get to a save point before a match and edit the save in notepad++ to adjust the day. Then again, I don't know if the day is tracked in the save, though I'd be surprised if not. Then just load the game and when you want to move on to a new day, readjust the day again.

The date is indeed tracked in the save.

 

[ThatOneJester]

Out of curiosity, where could I learn about coding?
I would like to help if at all possible, but I know only things I learned myself through trial and error.
I know it could take awhile to properly learn, but I really do want to help at some point.
Also I plan to make games myself in a couple years, so the experience could help me later on in what I learn.

 

[Ryplinn]

https://www.codecademy.com/
https://www.khanacademy.org/
https://www.coursera.org/
https://www.reddit.com/r/learnprogramming/

Books are good too:
https://www.amazon.com/Programming-Language-2nd-Brian-Kernighan/dp/0131103628
http://www.htdp.org/
https://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book.html

If you have questions, there are answers:
stackoverflow.com

Game stuff:
http://gameprogrammingpatterns.com/
Extra Credits: https://becausegamesmatter.com/
https://www.youtube.com/user/quill18creates
The game you're about to start, right now, because there's no better time and doing is the best way to learn (even if it's just what not to do).

General advice:
Don't worry about your starting language. Go with what's popular, or what your friends are using, or whatever has the best name.
Don't stop at one language. Once you learn one, learning another is easy*.
Focus on the fundamentals. Languages and frameworks change every month, but the basics of computer science haven't changed since at least the 1600s (seriously), and a lot of the modern refinements date back to the 1950s.
Make sure your code is readable. Even if it's a solo project, you six months from now might as well be a different person.
Coding is hard. Keep at it.
Have a project. It will help motivate you when learning becomes a slog (which it probably will), as well as give you direction on what to learn next.
Use comments to explain why something is the way it is.

*There are a few different "paradigms" languages use, e.g., C is an imperative language while Scheme is a functional language. The first time you encounter a new paradigm it might be difficult to wrap your head around, but all languages have the same capabilities, just different strengths and weaknesses.

Things that are helpful to know:
Basic algebra
Logarithms
Trigonometry, especially if you're doing graphics stuff.
Propositional logic & Boolean algebra
Binary & hexadecimal numbers
A good text editor (vim-my favorite, emacs, nano, others I don't know about but are probably pretty good anyway). This is a significant time and brain investment and Notepad++ works if you don't want to bother.
Touch typing. Coding is done with the head, not the fingers, but the fewer barriers between your thoughts and your code, the better.
How to communicate well: clearly, concisely, and persuasively. Most coding will be done with a team and cannot succeed without good communication.
Good ergonomics. Repetitive stress injuries hurt like hell and don't need to happen.

You can ask a hundred different coders about this stuff and get a hundred different answers and they'll all be good answers. GLHF GG no re

 

[maxelich]

umm, why I couldn't find the .jar file? I downloaded it and extracted it 2 times, but there are no .jar executable.

 

[Sacredferro]

Corrupt download maybe? Either that or, less likely, your AV is deleting it without saying it did. Try re-downloading it and see if it's till missing.

 

[maxelich]

Corrupt download maybe? Either that or, less likely, your AV is deleting it without saying it did. Try re-downloading it and see if it's till missing.

yes, it's still missing. I've turned off my antivirus too. Or it's in one of the folders?

 

[Sacredferro]

Don't know what to tell you. I just downloaded both the latest stable (linked in the OP) and one of the unstable releases (link below) and the JAR file is present in both.

https://mega.nz/#!BMRUSS5Y!Wp_F5NsTiLcg7r9qxnxP9g-0E9UcyGkcQk20nAALkjc

My only other recommendation is to try a different browser to download (I use Chrome), but that's a long shot in the dark and I don't actually know if that will produce any different results. Beyond that, I don't know.

 

[maxelich]

Don't know what to tell you. I just downloaded both the latest stable (linked in the OP) and one of the unstable releases (link below) and the JAR file is present in both.

https://mega.nz/#!BMRUSS5Y!Wp_F5NsTiLcg7r9qxnxP9g-0E9UcyGkcQk20nAALkjc

My only other recommendation is to try a different browser to download (I use Chrome), but that's a long shot in the dark and I don't actually know if that will produce any different results. Beyond that, I don't know.

very well then, thank you for your help

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

I'm just checking in to break some silence:

Not sure what is going on other than Ryplinn's progress seems to be continuing. I find this very valuable for the program long term and hope we can get things merged up the chain from him to me and then upwards further as soon as things are tested and polished out for use.

I've found myself out of gas and occupied elsewhere until this crucial step is finished - barring any interesting ideas I can do in the meantime that don't mess with much. LogosK's changes will conflict if merged with mine - even become useless considering the work on the program.

I've noticed some talk elsewhere about problems packaging and running something that represents the latest work with the game and then repackaging it. I'm out of my scope working on someone else's mod of someone else's game. After Ryplinn and myself are done, the game will function very differently (and much better.) I'm not familiar with packaging a project twice removed like this by myself, so it'd be a learning process for me. I think part of tasks for anyone involved will be ensuring your changes are well-documented in a way that enables people to make changes and add content easily.

I think I've done what I can around here for now - I hope I've made a good difference until the time comes I can contribute or help more.

 

[Ryplinn]

My efforts continue, but there's still a long way to go. The point of the engine changes I'm doing is to be able to add content and features quickly and easily, so if I do things right, I should be able to catch up with anything that's been added after v2.5.1.2. You can see my current progress here: https://github.com/Ryplinn/nightgamesmod/blob/stable/README.md

That said, if anyone has things they want to add, I recommend not waiting for me. Rewrites have a habit of dragging on and on.

 

[Cat boy]

this is one of the many games I cant get to play at all can someone help me get it to work so I can play it?

 

[ThatOneJester]

@Cat boy
Care to elaborate?
This is like somebody going to the ER asking for help, but not saying what the problem is.
Does the game crash?
Do you see a pop-up saying anything?
Does it just refuse to start up?
Did magical gnomes hijack your PC deciding on what games you can play?!?!?


(If that last one, make sure you have some tweezers and a bowl filled with beer).

 

[Cat boy]

@Cat boy
Care to elaborate?
This is like somebody going to the ER asking for help, but not saying what the problem is.
Does the game crash?
Do you see a pop-up saying anything?
Does it just refuse to start up?
Did magical gnomes hijack your PC deciding on what games you can play?!?!?


(If that last one, make sure you have some tweezers and a bowl filled with beer).

I cant get it to even start up the game do I need something I am missing to play it

 

[Sacredferro]

So you're running the JAR file, NightgamesMod.jar, and nothing happens? No window pops up or anything, just as if you hadn't done anything at all?

Try updating your Java, even if it says its up to date. Had a laptop that did that with another Java-based game. Maybe it was missing some assets and reinstating the latest version fixed that or something. Not to mention software in general does that sometimes, more so than you'd think, where an up date or install goes without any hitches or apparent errors, but then without any warning something eventually stops working right or at all.

https://www.java.com/en/download/ looks like that's the latest version for Java's Runtime Environment.

 

[Cat boy]

hmm no seems there is more to it then that what is the jar file run on then maybe I am not doing it right?

 

[ThatOneJester]

@Cat boy
Are you trying to play this on PC, or Mac?
Or maybe some other kind of thing?
It only works on PC from what I remember, but I could be wrong...

Quick edit: Also make sure you are using "Java(TM) Platform SE Binary".
It's what I use when I play the game.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

I feel like programming lately. I just did quite a bit.

While I'm in the mood: Anything immediately interesting I could add or change for anyone? My most recent game is as a slime, which has been interesting. Making starts is pretty easy. Are there any new starting conditions you guys would be interested in?

 

[Amygdala]

I feel like programming lately. I just did quite a bit.

While I'm in the mood: Anything immediately interesting I could add or change for anyone? My most recent game is as a slime, which has been interesting. Making starts is pretty easy. Are there any new starting conditions you guys would be interested in?

I'd like to see an Angel or goddess starting condition. There's already a succubus start so it seems appropriate and could probably follow the same premise.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

I'd like to see an Angel or goddess starting condition. There's already a succubus start so it seems appropriate and could probably follow the same premise.

Well, there should be some sort of goal to reach. There's no way to gain momentum against the more powerful characters since Divine Charges only do recoil damage. (and damage with a stat the player can't really change) Draining gives you momentum during the entire night.

To be really honest I wish I could isolate the Divinity mechanics into things that are more easily managed or checked. I'd rather wait to tackle stuff like that until after we get to the other side of the program overhaul.

 

[Amygdala]

Yeah, that's fair. Divinity has always been a bit of a finicky stat. Other than that though, I can't imagine what other starting conditions that could be made that isn't already being tinkered with in the overhaul. All I can imagine is maybe adding things to already existing conditions or starts that give some of the other characters special traits to you. Like being able to use some Mad-scientist skills from the get-go for an example.
Emphasis on some and not all so it isn't too easy.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

Some Polls for everyone:

Which character is the most powerful right now?
https://strawpoll.com/7hh5dfpx

Which Attribute do you understand the least?
https://strawpoll.com/xhde7254

Which character has the strongest addiction?
https://strawpoll.com/swre681s

Which Character would you like to see made into a standard one the most?
https://strawpoll.com/ad858ykw

What mechanical part of the game needs the most work?
https://strawpoll.com/41agfeb4

Yes, I know. I forgot about Kat. Kat fans can feel free to speak up.

Like being able to use some Mad-scientist skills from the get-go for an example..

That's a good one. Although I'd like to save that for Science and Cunning providing passive defenses against some things.

 

[Bronzechair]

Well... I voted on the polls (except the addiction one because I don't even remember what the addictions are), but I can't think of any points of discussion to bring up. The last update was something like seven months ago, and I didn't really play the early release that added the focus skills. I don't know how functional the project is right now, but perhaps it's time to consider some kind of release to reinvigorate interest.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

I'd like to tackle turn order.on the map:

One of the problems you guys might observe is that it's not clear what order the map is resolved in, how many turns combat takes, or who gets the jump on who. This results in a lot of strange behavior right now, especially concerning what happens during an encounter, what happens when someone enters a space, and what happens when you decide what to do.

This means the turn system needs to be rebuilt - that means we need to design a new turn system.

Let's start with the basics: The night consists of some amount of total turns in which all the characters can move around the board, do actions, get into encounters and fight. During this - a lot of things may happen to any given character, and the order of turns is tremendously important as the player is the person controlling all of the action.

It's highly likely that Speed will influence who goes first when it comes to when the player gets to choose a button to push.

The characters will exist in some data structure and need to be sorted by speed. This may change during the match, so this structure will require the ability to update and resort every turn.

Other questions to consider:

How long does it take to do some actions on the map?
How long does a combat stay on the map?
What happens in the space of time YOU are in combat on a map? Does time freeze for your combat are do you process X turns while the player is away or even in combat?

Just food for thought.

 

[Bronzechair]

Can you describe some of this "strange behavior"? From the perspective of a player and not a dev, I don't remember noticing any problems that relate to turn order in v2.5.1.2 (aside from dueling NPCs being locked in a fight indefinitely if the player doesn't intervene, but I believe the following pre-release fixed that). Are traps not triggering, or are triggering but for the wrong people? Are consumables not taking effect if someone moves into your space when you use it? What, exactly, is the issue here?

Speed determining the first action is fine; that's how it works in combat. Though if memory serves, the ability to improve the PC's Speed attribute was once removed in anticipation of a rework that was never completed, so right now I believe the player always has a Speed score of 5 (possibly adjusted by some clothing) and each NPC has their own Speed score that scales up as they level, in addition to being adjusted by clothing (but they only change clothes if the player gifts it to them)? Correct me if I'm wrong.

I can't imagine most actions taking more than five minutes. Maybe ten minutes for a select few complicated (and/or high powered) actions like setting up the spiderweb trap or mind control trap. Combat + a brief rest after could reasonably stretch to ten minutes, though I feel like that's more of a balance consideration that involves figuring out how many fights you want to happen per night, primarily for the purpose of determining the speed of leveling and money rewards. I think time should not freeze when the PC is in combat, because as it stands now the NPCs will rapidly fall behind when the typical night ends and shows the player has 10-12 wins and the NPCs have zero to six wins each. This example is obviously skewed, because I personally know the game really well, but the point is that the PC can pull far ahead of the competition if the latter isn't able to fight enough.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

Can you describe some of this "strange behavior"? From the perspective of a player and not a dev, I don't remember noticing any problems that relate to turn order in v2.5.1.2 (aside from dueling NPCs being locked in a fight indefinitely if the player doesn't intervene, but I believe the following pre-release fixed that). Are traps not triggering, or are triggering but for the wrong people? Are consumables not taking effect if someone moves into your space when you use it? What, exactly, is the issue here?

Nope - still happens on my branch. I don't think anyone snuck anything in on me in the meantime.

Speed determining the first action is fine; that's how it works in combat. Though if memory serves, the ability to improve the PC's Speed attribute was once removed in anticipation of a rework that was never completed, so right now I believe the player always has a Speed score of 5 (possibly adjusted by some clothing) and each NPC has their own Speed score that scales up as they level, in addition to being adjusted by clothing (but they only change clothes if the player gifts it to them)? Correct me if I'm wrong.

Shoes can affect speed, but the thing is that we're talking about the MAP, not combat. I'd probably leave combat alone since it works well enough. The thing is that timekeeping and action taking on the map is creating problems for all game modes. It needs to be strictly ordered for anything in the future to work correctly together.

I can't imagine most actions taking more than five minutes. Maybe ten minutes for a select few complicated (and/or high powered) actions like setting up the spiderweb trap or mind control trap. Combat + a brief rest after could reasonably stretch to ten minutes, though I feel like that's more of a balance consideration that involves figuring out how many fights you want to happen per night, primarily for the purpose of determining the speed of leveling and money rewards. I think time should not freeze when the PC is in combat, because as it stands now the NPCs will rapidly fall behind when the typical night ends and shows the player has 10-12 wins and the NPCs have zero to six wins each. This example is obviously skewed, because I personally know the game really well, but the point is that the PC can pull far ahead of the competition if the latter isn't able to fight enough.

I agree - I was thinking of that problem. The thing is we would need to determine WHEN in a combat the other NPCs are progressing about the map, and include the functionality to intervene in your fights. Meaning - a lot more of your fights would be interrupted. (sexfights should really be one on one...we should talk about the basic rules of the nightgames because it's making things difficult.) How do we track what's going on in the background? Otherwise, we have to decide if there's a simple solution to this or not.

 

[DarkSinfulMage]

So - it's been about a day. Let's see how we did:

Which character is the most powerful right now?

30 % (9 votes)Kat
23.33 % (7 votes)Angel
20 % (6 votes)Reyka
13.33 % (4 votes)Mara
10 % (3 votes)Airi
3.33 % (1 votes)Jewel
0 % (0 votes)Cassie

30 total votes.

Kat is very strong because she seems to have endless endurance and locks you in a particular state. I can understand people believing she's very strong.

Angel is a complete joke sometimes. By around level 50 to 80 she can easily start ramping up hundreds and thousands in temptation damage based on feedback and growth of her next temptation ability. I have logs of high level games where she can do 25000+ damage and even more. It's funny. Combine this with the several traits she takes with her addiction or her pets and you have an out of control character that bodies most builds except demonic or someone immune to temptation.

Reyka is also very strong because she can lock you into different states and addict you to fluids. The thing is that Addictive fluids don't work the same way as addictions or auras, so this mishmosh of things makes it so the player doesn't develop any particular strategy to beat her other than toying her. Wing Wrap and Succubus Embrace are both very powerful.

Finally, Mara: The player often finds themselves looking into her eyes, but between her addiction and her devices, I'd say her devices are the real reason people probably vote for her. The way Stun works and the way addictions work are two reasons Mara is a pain despite having honest weaknesses.

I'm surprised more people haven't picked Jewel because of her addiction features. Jewel has honest weaknesses to exploit, though.

Which Attribute type do you understand the least?

40.74 % (11 votes)Nymphomania
33.33 % (9 votes)Slime
11.11 % (3 votes)Divinity
7.41 % (2 votes)Ki
3.7 % (1 votes)Darkness
3.7 % (1 votes)Arcane

27 total votes.

I don't even understand Nymphomania, and I've been CTRL-F ing around the project to learn why it exists against the trait. I'll tell you this - In some about of time we're going to open a discussion about what Attributes like the above are supposed to do and what they can and can't govern. Given the poll below, I think there's honest interest in well-defining what some elements of this game are supposed to do.

Most of these stats govern what skills your character can use in combat. Everyone has all the skills in the game in a sense, but they can only use the ones they have the stats for and can afford to use, and are in the position to use. The thing is - several stats also govern defenses and damage types. This isn't equal for all stats.

Which Character has the strongest Addiction?

29.63 % (8 votes)Reyka
25.93 % (7 votes)Angel
18.52 % (5 votes)Cassie
18.52 % (5 votes)Mara
3.7 % (1 votes)Jewel
3.7 % (1 votes)Airi

27 total votes.

Reyka demonizing people while all their stats are converted into darkness is pretty horrifying after a night or so. It's definitely broken, and between the temporary and permanent aspects of who gets transformed how much for any reason are unknown to me - I'd like to see us find out and decide on how often or serious should changes made in the games apply to outside the games.

Angel's addiction is also very strong as it forces you to do things and subverts your choices. I think this is actually mostly fine and would love to add to it, but I'd like to hear some more opinions on what exactly people think is unfair about Angel's addiction considering the conditions it gets stronger. (There's no way to naturally weaken it - I'd like to see that for all addictions)

Cassie was a surprise - I didn't think her addiction is so bad but perhaps - combined with the way addictions and status effects work, that the stunlock is a little unfair.

Which Character would you like to see made into a standard character the most?

38.46 % (15 votes)Eve
23.08 % (9 votes)Samantha
23.08 % (9 votes)Rosea
15.38 % (6 votes)Maya

39 total votes.

Well - that's unfortunate for me. Maya didn't win. I'm interested in building out Eve, but she has no pictures. I can't do anything about that. Draw her set and I'll see if I can get it in.

As I've posted before, I'd be personally most interested in building out Maya and Eve. I'm working on Maya first. If you are a brave soul, you might want to try your own hands at Samantha, Rosea, or even Kat.

What mechanical part of the game needs the most work?

35.14 % (13 votes)Addictions
18.92 % (7 votes)Attribute Specific Mechanics
13.51 % (5 votes)Counters
10.81 % (4 votes)Traps
8.11 % (3 votes)Pets
8.11 % (3 votes)Status Effects
5.41 % (2 votes)Traits

37 total votes.

I agree - Addictions are one of the most interesting additions to NGM but also have broken the game in several places. Unfortunately, we gotta wait until some things are rebuilt to finally fix addictions, but I DO want to make a post soon(tm) to well-define addictions and ensure all the characters' current addictions are balanced out and don't add so much difficult bloat to the game. Addictions are very clsoely linked to traits and status effects, so this will need to really be thought out well.

I also agree with attributes requiring more work - they directly relate to building characters and core to the game mechanics in many places.

Counters I'd actually save for a time when we want to discuss how reliable some skills are for controlling the match. Invitations, Counters, Stuns, and Mind Control are all parts of the same issue.

 

[ThatOneJester]

@DarkSinfulMage

Some thoughts:
1. I didn't pick her, but I'm kinda surprised that Cassie didn't get any votes.
Late game she can seriously mess you up if you picked her breast and dominant focus's.
I personally picked Reyka, since she was the only one my strategy didn't help against to fight the girls?

2. Maybe for Nymphomania it could increase minimum arousal after orgasm for each level, but increase temptation damage?
It would give another tree you could take for strategies in each fight, thus increasing the amounts of branches available to your characters skills.
There already is a Nymphomania debuff you can pick when making your character right?
The attacks associated could be straight up sex based attack (intercourse).
Would be a good way to implement some new positions or sex attacks during the act itself right?

3. I may have misunderstood what you meant by making one a standard character.
I thought you meant making them one of the starting NPC's that can be fought.
So from the list I picked Samantha, since she seems the least troublesome early game to deal with?

4. I'm kind of surprised that Kat wasn't on the addiction list at all.
Also I wanted to make sure it was fixed, but there is a bug with Kat's Breeder addiction.
It makes it not possible to get rid of it on version 2.5.1.2?

5. Cassie's addiction problem was that when she either counters you or really anything that knocks you down.
She tends to grab you quickly, then use let's say breast smother or forced feeding.
Then *Bam*, you have the addiction.


(I don't know if any of this will even help, but at most I was putting my thoughts to paper since I feel they would have been wasted if I forgot them after 15-30mins as per usual what with the short attention span...)