A
Athena
Guest
^I don't think that's how game development works.
Last edited by a moderator:
What are your gripes/criticism of TiTs?
- Thread starter TheInfamousImmortal
- Start date
He sorted through 7-8 months of submissions in less than two months. Hiring people for solely that isn't even remotely a logistically sound decision. A more sensible approach would be Fen setting aside a few days each month solely for reviewing.
Besides, as long as there is still content to be coded the review backlog should only be the business of FenCo, creators and volunteer coders.
what needs to be done is there needs to be less emphasis on GIANT projects
there were four, count 'em FOUR, 100+ page entries that he had to sift through for quality and lore-continuous nature. not to mention the plethora of brand new characters, items, and TFs that were either accepted or rejected.
what needs to happen is the community needs to take a step back and re-assess what they're putting into the game just as much as Fen needs to step back and set a schedule for reviewing.
"oh, fen's reviewing again, time to submit a 75+ page bunnygirl that has literally 0 previous work, because we don't see enough of that in this game" or something similar to that effect crops up frequently, and it really needs to tone down. want a character to meet your fetish? work with what you've got already, there are 379 pages in the "characters" category of the Wiki. barring the ones that are labeled "do not touch" leaves roughly 300 to work with.
300 characters when we're not even halfway through the game with a tone set on TFing people, and you're gonna tell me you want MORE CHARACTERS?! it's preposterous
there were four, count 'em FOUR, 100+ page entries that he had to sift through for quality and lore-continuous nature. not to mention the plethora of brand new characters, items, and TFs that were either accepted or rejected.
what needs to happen is the community needs to take a step back and re-assess what they're putting into the game just as much as Fen needs to step back and set a schedule for reviewing.
"oh, fen's reviewing again, time to submit a 75+ page bunnygirl that has literally 0 previous work, because we don't see enough of that in this game" or something similar to that effect crops up frequently, and it really needs to tone down. want a character to meet your fetish? work with what you've got already, there are 379 pages in the "characters" category of the Wiki. barring the ones that are labeled "do not touch" leaves roughly 300 to work with.
300 characters when we're not even halfway through the game with a tone set on TFing people, and you're gonna tell me you want MORE CHARACTERS?! it's preposterous
Jesus h...
Still, theres gotta be a solution to the backlog. Like devil said, maybe fen and the gang should resort their schedules or something.
Idk, it just seems like this is something that could have been avoided with more planning and preparation.
Or maybe what the dev team chooses to write and code will just always be prioritized over submissions from the community because... you know... it's their game.
Bringing in more people to look at the submissions would cause more work.
Let's say for example that Fen gets three volunteers to go through the submissions - you'd think "That work is going to get divided 4 ways, meaning Fen has to do a quarter of the work."
Well, no. Because at the end of the day, Fen is still going to have to review the content for final approval. So that's content getting reviewed twice, possibly edited twice and no other progress on it. And that's time wasted, time that could have been spent look at other submissions. With something like this, its not always a case of many hands make light work, its just repeating a chunk of it.
Its a slow process, but then again, Fen has powered through months worth of content and has sorted it to the point where he's gotten to a specific date this month.
Let's say for example that Fen gets three volunteers to go through the submissions - you'd think "That work is going to get divided 4 ways, meaning Fen has to do a quarter of the work."
Well, no. Because at the end of the day, Fen is still going to have to review the content for final approval. So that's content getting reviewed twice, possibly edited twice and no other progress on it. And that's time wasted, time that could have been spent look at other submissions. With something like this, its not always a case of many hands make light work, its just repeating a chunk of it.
Its a slow process, but then again, Fen has powered through months worth of content and has sorted it to the point where he's gotten to a specific date this month.
Im personally super mixed on it. On one hand it really bites that not only does it slow things down, it also wears on the team from what has been said.
But on the other hand, I really dig some of the stuff that has been done lately like the rats, Roo and the Flamer.
On the third hand, I would sort of like to see more things being built on top of existing characters. I tend to favor quality over quantity when it comes to characters and I think we have a healthy spread of stuff covered atm. It would be nice to see things encouraged towards having writers add stuff to characters they particularly like as opposed to brand new stuff.
Granted, I'm not in on the process so I have no idea which of the two easier to actually get into the game.
Kinda wish I knew how to code or set aside the time to learn, love this game enough that I wish I could help out
But on the other hand, I really dig some of the stuff that has been done lately like the rats, Roo and the Flamer.
On the third hand, I would sort of like to see more things being built on top of existing characters. I tend to favor quality over quantity when it comes to characters and I think we have a healthy spread of stuff covered atm. It would be nice to see things encouraged towards having writers add stuff to characters they particularly like as opposed to brand new stuff.
Granted, I'm not in on the process so I have no idea which of the two easier to actually get into the game.
Kinda wish I knew how to code or set aside the time to learn, love this game enough that I wish I could help out
Yeah, but the problem isnt with coders. It's with reviewing the submissions. You can have a million coders, but if only one guy is reviewing submissions (which is pretty much what's going on) then it wont be much different than if you had like 10 coders.Kinda wish I knew how to code or set aside the time to learn, love this game enough that I wish I could help out
Tbh, the more that I dive into it, the more this seems like a loose loose scenario.
On one hand, fen focuses on submissions, but progress on other stuff grinds to a halt. Then he gets frustrated cuz the main game isnt progressing at the rate he wants it to.
On the other hand, fen focuses on other stuff, but submissions get uber bottlenecked, and eventually he's left with an immense backlog of people eager to show him their stuff. Which is what's gonna happen (hopefully) when he give the greenlight for character submissions again. Plus, it frustrates the submitters because it takes an eternity and a half for them to find out if their stuff even got approved. A good example being Preacher and a bunch of his submissions.
Pretty much the only way this could have been prevented is if he prepared for it long before he even started accepting submissions for TiTS. Now that I'm looking at it, this was pretty much inevitable.
All we can do now is bite the bullet and pray that he can catch up and get shit sorted so things can go back to normal.
Fingers crossed that happens sooner rather than later.
On one hand, fen focuses on submissions, but progress on other stuff grinds to a halt. Then he gets frustrated cuz the main game isnt progressing at the rate he wants it to.
On the other hand, fen focuses on other stuff, but submissions get uber bottlenecked, and eventually he's left with an immense backlog of people eager to show him their stuff. Which is what's gonna happen (hopefully) when he give the greenlight for character submissions again. Plus, it frustrates the submitters because it takes an eternity and a half for them to find out if their stuff even got approved. A good example being Preacher and a bunch of his submissions.
Pretty much the only way this could have been prevented is if he prepared for it long before he even started accepting submissions for TiTS. Now that I'm looking at it, this was pretty much inevitable.
All we can do now is bite the bullet and pray that he can catch up and get shit sorted so things can go back to normal.
Fingers crossed that happens sooner rather than later.
Last edited:
And regarding this bit here...
This may sound a bit dickish on his part. But think of it like this:
Fen has poured God knows how much of his life into this. And now progress on it is grinding to a halt.
It's kinda like making your dream car with your best friend. Only hes keeping you busy doing stuff like the paintjob and the trim and whatnot, when the engine block is just sitting there half built in the corner collecting dust for God knows how long, and you maybe tighten one nut or bolt every two weeks or so.
So it's actually pretty reasonable for fen to be a bit frustrated on this and wanting to get back on track with the main stuff.
And I know that I may sound like a bit of a hypocrite cuz of what I said earlier, but I want to clarify; I'm not upset cuz fen is doing this. I'm upset cuz I personally feel like this could have been prevented. However, I understand why he is doing it, and I'm not gonna bitch and moan about it, and I will simply hope it gets resolved soon.
This may sound a bit dickish on his part. But think of it like this:
Fen has poured God knows how much of his life into this. And now progress on it is grinding to a halt.
It's kinda like making your dream car with your best friend. Only hes keeping you busy doing stuff like the paintjob and the trim and whatnot, when the engine block is just sitting there half built in the corner collecting dust for God knows how long, and you maybe tighten one nut or bolt every two weeks or so.
So it's actually pretty reasonable for fen to be a bit frustrated on this and wanting to get back on track with the main stuff.
And I know that I may sound like a bit of a hypocrite cuz of what I said earlier, but I want to clarify; I'm not upset cuz fen is doing this. I'm upset cuz I personally feel like this could have been prevented. However, I understand why he is doing it, and I'm not gonna bitch and moan about it, and I will simply hope it gets resolved soon.
Last edited:
*** Not to be bringing up old shit but I had to comment on the "write outside your comfort zone" convo that was up earlier.
My position is this: Yes everyone is more than capable of creating quality, engaging content outside their own preferences. It just requires imagination, creativity, openness and discipline... BUT ALSO no one should be required to write something they don't want to write unless there is somebody putting up some money. Yes its possible... don't ask unless you're ok with someone saying no. Don't get irritated or pissy when ppl in those situations say no, because it is their right.
To ppl who know me that sounds weird. I personally am an oddball... I have written several female characters for FenCo and I'm super duper gay. It is important to me to improve and one of the ways I sought to do that as a writer was to be able to write things I don't find sexy in a sexy way. It takes A LOT more effort but as long as I am willing to do it and have people look at it, take feed back and be open... it isn't a problem. It is all a process.
*** On the subject of males gettting into the game there are several factors at play. We could just say the Devs need to drop their pants and take one for the team... but in reality there is no one single thing to look at and say "this is the problem" because it is a complex issue.
1. Submission quality, for one, is a very common factor in male submissions no one wants to talk about. When it comes to others writing I've noticed that the gay centric community here will encourage the fuck out of a baddly written project like we're a bunch of people dying of thirst looking at a bottle of only slightly radio active water. Criticism is hard for some to take but it is necessary sometimes because when you build something from the ground up you are sometimes too close to the work to even try to be objective. I know personally that an ancient male follower I wrote WAY back as my first submission to TiTs was sub par... not at the time considering we didn't know about the game but the moment Fen emailed me and I read what he said I agreed... the follower's cybernetics were just too OP for the world that had been established after i made the original concept.
2. Also, while FenCo has always had a very warm gay community and an open minded heterosexual community, we gays have been jumping ship for a while. There were some prolific writers, friends of mine that used to encourage me and helped me get my submissions together, who just aren't around anymore. Some fell out with the devs, others were tired of their content getting what they felt was unfairly harsh criticism, and A LOT of us who got shit in got sick of hearing "well you should be able to kill Akbal since he isn't my kink" like I didn't have to deal with Tamani/Ceraph/the Gnoll's/Bee women. We're not overly sensitive and this isn't a gay male issue but sometimes some of us get frustrated and... leave.
3. Coders man... They have their own issues, kinks and likes and the bulk of our community is hetero. I really wish I had the time to dedicate to learning to do that shit simply so I could hand Fen something that ALL HE HAD TO DO was read it and make suggestions then i could code it in and boom... more guys because that's the bulk of what I write.
and those are just off the top of my head. Can't forget that since the bulk of the content for TiTs is hetero-centric some gay writers out there in the either might not even know they could be writing for this game, haven't even picked it up or even thought about it even though it might align perfectly with the things they'd want in a game like this. So i get what everybody is saying but I don't think it's a simple as some of us have implied it is.
Lastly I know its been said but MOAR GUYS FOR ZE GAME
-------
Also I feel like I have to remind all of us, myself included, at least once a month that this thread is literally the place for ppl to come complain about shit. Complaining about people complaining in the complaining thread is fine but creates a negative feedback loop. If you gotta disagree lets try to be as respectful as possible and not just do the bare minimum.
-------
My position is this: Yes everyone is more than capable of creating quality, engaging content outside their own preferences. It just requires imagination, creativity, openness and discipline... BUT ALSO no one should be required to write something they don't want to write unless there is somebody putting up some money. Yes its possible... don't ask unless you're ok with someone saying no. Don't get irritated or pissy when ppl in those situations say no, because it is their right.
To ppl who know me that sounds weird. I personally am an oddball... I have written several female characters for FenCo and I'm super duper gay. It is important to me to improve and one of the ways I sought to do that as a writer was to be able to write things I don't find sexy in a sexy way. It takes A LOT more effort but as long as I am willing to do it and have people look at it, take feed back and be open... it isn't a problem. It is all a process.
*** On the subject of males gettting into the game there are several factors at play. We could just say the Devs need to drop their pants and take one for the team... but in reality there is no one single thing to look at and say "this is the problem" because it is a complex issue.
1. Submission quality, for one, is a very common factor in male submissions no one wants to talk about. When it comes to others writing I've noticed that the gay centric community here will encourage the fuck out of a baddly written project like we're a bunch of people dying of thirst looking at a bottle of only slightly radio active water. Criticism is hard for some to take but it is necessary sometimes because when you build something from the ground up you are sometimes too close to the work to even try to be objective. I know personally that an ancient male follower I wrote WAY back as my first submission to TiTs was sub par... not at the time considering we didn't know about the game but the moment Fen emailed me and I read what he said I agreed... the follower's cybernetics were just too OP for the world that had been established after i made the original concept.
2. Also, while FenCo has always had a very warm gay community and an open minded heterosexual community, we gays have been jumping ship for a while. There were some prolific writers, friends of mine that used to encourage me and helped me get my submissions together, who just aren't around anymore. Some fell out with the devs, others were tired of their content getting what they felt was unfairly harsh criticism, and A LOT of us who got shit in got sick of hearing "well you should be able to kill Akbal since he isn't my kink" like I didn't have to deal with Tamani/Ceraph/the Gnoll's/Bee women. We're not overly sensitive and this isn't a gay male issue but sometimes some of us get frustrated and... leave.
3. Coders man... They have their own issues, kinks and likes and the bulk of our community is hetero. I really wish I had the time to dedicate to learning to do that shit simply so I could hand Fen something that ALL HE HAD TO DO was read it and make suggestions then i could code it in and boom... more guys because that's the bulk of what I write.
and those are just off the top of my head. Can't forget that since the bulk of the content for TiTs is hetero-centric some gay writers out there in the either might not even know they could be writing for this game, haven't even picked it up or even thought about it even though it might align perfectly with the things they'd want in a game like this. So i get what everybody is saying but I don't think it's a simple as some of us have implied it is.
Lastly I know its been said but MOAR GUYS FOR ZE GAME
-------
Also I feel like I have to remind all of us, myself included, at least once a month that this thread is literally the place for ppl to come complain about shit. Complaining about people complaining in the complaining thread is fine but creates a negative feedback loop. If you gotta disagree lets try to be as respectful as possible and not just do the bare minimum.
-------
That was basically the idea I had in mind. Passive buffs in exchange for ranged damage.
I’ll have you normies know that my main focus has/always been pushing for expacks on old stuff. This is why I reworked Alex a bit back.Im personally super mixed on it. On one hand it really bites that not only does it slow things down, it also wears on the team from what has been said.
But on the other hand, I really dig some of the stuff that has been done lately like the rats, Roo and the Flamer.
On the third hand, I would sort of like to see more things being built on top of existing characters. I tend to favor quality over quantity when it comes to characters and I think we have a healthy spread of stuff covered atm. It would be nice to see things encouraged towards having writers add stuff to characters they particularly like as opposed to brand new stuff.
Granted, I'm not in on the process so I have no idea which of the two easier to actually get into the game.
Kinda wish I knew how to code or set aside the time to learn, love this game enough that I wish I could help out
I’d love to do more but there’s no telling how that’s going to shake out. Rather than act like the gay content can’t get in, I plan to just write it and make errybody read it.
There is. He took it.
Y'all making a mountain out of a mole hill on this one. Basically every publication has periods of open/closed submissions. Go look at any major fiction magazine; they may only be open for submissions for half the year. Some less, some more. Fen's had open submissions constantly for like 4 years. The floodgates are just gonna close for a couple months while he finishes sorting through everything.
People keep griping about their stuff sitting in backlog for years -- this is how you solve that problem too.
Hey, i said i was cool with it all. Besides, I think i meant something like keeping it from happening at all in the first place. I think. I cant reslly recall what was going through my head at the time....
Whatever. no point in making the mountain any bigger. Like i said, lets just sit back and hope this gets resolved quick.
Last edited:
Honestly FenCo does spoil the fuck out of us.
Most games don't do submissions and those that do only do so periodically or throw out 90% of the shits
Being brutally honest, 90% of submissions are definitely thrown out.
Well, we estimate that there's between 7 and 8 million words in TiTS. I've written about 1.2 million; let's generously say that Fen's done the same and round up to 2.5 million words by staff to account for Geddy and Adj poking at stuff like Jerynn or BadgerQuest plus whatever Wsan's written since he came on staff. We'll count commissions/purple names as submissions since they follow the same rules as everyone else (and submissions are how they got purple names and the ability to take comms anyway).
So... probably about 4 to 5 million words, or ~2/3 of the game. Could be as low as half if our total wordcount estimate isn't conservative enough. Because legitimately who the fuck actually knows how many words are in this game.
It has always been my experience that, except in cases of absolutely bad quality/concept and incompatable lore, FenCo always at least nudges prospective content creators in the right direction with their submissions. I've had submission that have been sent back with different comments multiple times but still, in the end, Fen helped make sure that what I wrote was good enough for the game.
Can't speak for everybody but Fen has absolutely no reason to treat me different from anyone else
So like I said they really do spoil tf out of us.
Yes, but the important thing will be that we survived.
I wonder how it will be when its done?
How far along are we in the main story? Like a third? Half? Two thirds?
How far along are we in the main story? Like a third? Half? Two thirds?
Who cares? It's like how many people even remembered who Shaun was when playing Fallout4? If I could play sidequests forever, that'd be a great thing.
Im a story man myself, I only do sidequests if i like the characters.
F