JimThermic's Project List

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Lashcharge

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Aug 27, 2015
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 The quest I have planned will probably have an option to convert yourself or another into a 'true' vanae male by giving them the genome, but you can only do one or the other, for reasons that will be explained later. From there, it's just a question of having that one person knock up at least one vanae with male twins, and you're well on the way to solving the problem.... albeit not the *quickest* way. The genome itself should be independent of physical transformatives, so you don't have to keep a vanae body or risk losing it, just a piece of data lingering within your own, immensely complex genetics. Infinitely more satisfying if you keep your vanae male bits IMO, though.
I suggest you avoid doing the whole "only one person" and make it so that the player has to choose between "male vanae"fying himself or distributing a limited number of genomes to the Vanae.

Mostly so that the revival of the genome can result in some genetic variety in the Vanae populace otherwise all male vanae would end up being clones or too geneticly similar to that sole individual, considering what I understood how Vanae genome works.

So, milk tithing, free fruit? Sounds like a real pain in the ass when you're inheriting a gigantic interstellar mining company cheap-as-free. Plus, you know, organized slavery... probably not a good career move for Steele heir. And what goons are you going to get you to help with this? And what about the other slavery groups? A lot of obstacles that probably aren't worth figuring out how to overcome. 
From what I understood the PC will be able to become a slaver (or at least do some forms of slavery) in the future. Through I could be misremembering.

As stated above, the genome will probably only go to a singular person. And, well, this is also an incredibly dick move; forcing an entire tree to undergo forced TF. 
Yeah it was the "Be a Jerk" suggestion, and such options can be interesting (to be honest I find that the PC hogging the male vanae genome, considering his position, is also a dick move, although a significantly lesser one). I think it would be an interesting ending, doing a massive dick move to solve the entire breeding problems of the Vanae, as some these male would migrate to other clans and stabilize them.

It would also broaden the appeal(heterosexual females/homosexual males/bisexuals) of the content by allowing the player to make the gender reversed version of the "big ass amazonian harem breeding" fantasy.
 

Nik_van_Rijn

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Sep 10, 2015
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Moscow, RF
 

I suggest you avoid doing the whole "only one person" and make it so that the player has to choose between "male vanae"fying himself or distributing a limited number of genomes to the Vanae.

Mostly so that the revival of the genome can result in some genetic variety in the Vanae populace otherwise all male vanae would end up being clones or too geneticly similar to that sole individual, considering what I understood how Vanae genome works.

From what I understood the PC will be able to become a slaver (or at least do some forms of slavery) in the future. Through I could be misremembering.

Yeah it was the "Be a Jerk" suggestion, and such options can be interesting (to be honest I find that the PC hogging the male vanae genome, considering his position, is also a dick move, although a significantly lesser one). I think it would be an interesting ending, doing a massive dick move to solve the entire breeding problems of the Vanae, as some these male would migrate to other clans and stabilize them.

It would also broaden the appeal(heterosexual females/homosexual males/bisexuals) of the content by allowing the player to make the gender reversed version of the "big ass amazonian harem breeding" fantasy.
If you don't mind me intruding on your conversation with Jim, I see a few of problems with your suggestions.

1)By avoiding whatever reason Jim has planned for said genetic treatment to be a one-time/one-individual thing you make the whole choice void. If you'd be able to make several doses that would work on several Vanaes/random males, what will stop you from including yourself?

2)While PC will definitely have an option to become palls with some Black Void members during Kara's Second Quest, those are from the Myrellion branch. They are also likely to become blacklisted by another Black Void group due to the Saendra business. Lastly, PC is supposed to be a free agent pursuing his inheritance, and while atm. nothing prevents them from spending a lot of time in one place, they can't really settle down to oversee an operation like that. They have nobody to do it for them either, as Jim has pointed out.

3)I agree that forcibly transforming a tribe of  Vanae is something Hardass Steele may decide to do, but I fail to see any reason for that newly made all-male tribe to welcome PC, so it won't result in reverse-harrem.
 
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Eva

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Sep 14, 2015
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Personally, I'd prefer the 'get them teched up and into the Century of the Fruitbat' option. Vanae huntresses roaming the stars, searching for the most exotic seed possible to bring back to their clan... 

(After all, Vanae live on fructose, so there's no reason why good old fruit juice wouldn't let them survive indefinitely while they were hunting for trophy semen. Or they could just bring along some seed-salves, that's also an option.)
 

Nik_van_Rijn

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Sep 10, 2015
2,415
506
Moscow, RF
Personally, I'd prefer the 'get them teched up and into the Century of the Fruitbat' option. Vanae huntresses roaming the stars, searching for the most exotic seed possible to bring back to their clan... 

(After all, Vanae live on fructose, so there's no reason why good old fruit juice wouldn't let them survive indefinitely while they were hunting for trophy semen. Or they could just bring along some seed-salves, that's also an option.)

-1 internet cookie point for not seeing Vanaes' flawed breeding system as a problem, +1 for wanting to help those poor savage by sharing technology, +100 for a spot-on Pratchett reference.

Where'd you like them to be delivered?
 

JimThermic

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Aug 26, 2015
383
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The whole point of having the genome transferable to one individual increases the specializes of it, and by extension, the feeling of awesomeness that you, PC Steele, can fix the problem with your dick. Which is the preferred route of solving shit that most players like. Alternatively, the option to give someone *else* said power and ride their cock, or send them off to knock up vanae huntresses independently of you, is not ruled out. The whole fantasy is utterly ruined the moment you allow it to be a free-market thing, meaning cock-wielders can come in and be *just* as special as the PC. While it's high minded to get help with the cause, it's a real kick in the boner fuel tank, which is sort of the point of the whole game, really. I'm certainly not going to fuck with said setup just to make room for a nonsensical slaver fantasy that can be catered to in other ways and places.
 

Couch

Scientist
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Aug 26, 2015
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The more interesting solution that involves the "creation" of multiple male vanae would be to discover their origins, go to their homeworld and reintroduce the divergent races to each other.  This is, of course, a ludicrous amount of work even for you, but might be worth looking at for a long-term project while this provides a fun solution in the short term.
 

JimThermic

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Aug 26, 2015
383
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The more interesting solution that involves the "creation" of multiple male vanae would be to discover their origins, go to their homeworld and reintroduce the divergent races to each other.  This is, of course, a ludicrous amount of work even for you, but might be worth looking at for a long-term project while this provides a fun solution in the short term.

I like how you put 'even for you' after that. :3

And yeah, I'd rather go to a ludicrous amount of effort to do the Octalia homeworld than do it trying to make a square peg fit in a round hole, so to speak.
 

Lashcharge

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2015
706
137
If you don't mind me intruding on your conversation with Jim, I see a few of problems with your suggestions.

1)By avoiding whatever reason Jim has planned for said genetic treatment to be a one-time/one-individual thing you make the whole choice void. If you'd be able to make several doses that would work on several Vanaes/random males, what will stop you from including yourself?

2)While PC will definitely have an option to become palls with some Black Void members during Kara's Second Quest, those are from the Myrellion branch. They are also likely to become blacklisted by another Black Void group due to the Saendra business. Lastly, PC is supposed to be a free agent pursuing his inheritance, and while atm. nothing prevents them from spending a lot of time in one place, they can't really settle down to oversee an operation like that. They have nobody to do it for them either, as Jim has pointed out.

3)I agree that forcibly transforming a tribe of  Vanae is something Hardass Steele may decide to do, but I fail to see any reason for that newly made all-male tribe to welcome PC, so it won't result in reverse-harrem.

The problem and why i'm so insisting on more than one is that it would doom the race to incest in subsequent generations that would result from having only one male parent. Specially considering the weirdness of Vanae genetics.

The solution is pretty simple. There is a limited amount of genome and not all transformations are the same. I assume that a gender reassignment transformative for a specific races takes considerably less resources to make than a racial reassignment transformative, even for someone like Steele with his special nanomachines. In one you'll just have to change one chromosome, while in the other all of them.

The essence of what I'm suggesting is that the players would bring the Vanae Genome key to different geneticists, to get different options based on their expertise:

* Mischievous: Julian Haswell or whoever Jim was thinking. Use the genome to make a transformative to yourself, that only works because of the PC's nanomachines. This solves the problem of the cum-hunts by forcing vanae to have sex with you if they want to have male babies.

* Nice: Byron McAllister. Use the genome to make 10 doses of vanae-specific transformative and distribute it to vanae that are willing to go through that process. This solves both the problem of incest and the cum-hunts by creating a healthy gender for the race, but still limited in number.

* Hard: Maybe Dr. Lash(convincing him by claiming that it's to punish sexual predators would have be hard work, but possible). Use the genome to create a transformative disease that only affects Vanae and infect the Sky Tree with it, slowly converting all Vanae that eat from that tree into dudes. This completly solves any problem by sending out these males to the clans around the M'henga.

We don't know if the tribe would know that the PC was responsible for this action, and if it did the player can give a hard but honest answer, kinda like Bess/Ben requirex to progress through their story but stronger. There's a multitude of possible answers that could explain this.

The whole point of having the genome transferable to one individual increases the specializes of it, and by extension, the feeling of awesomeness that you, PC Steele, can fix the problem with your dick. Which is the preferred route of solving shit that most players like. Alternatively, the option to give someone *else* said power and ride their cock, or send them off to knock up vanae huntresses independently of you, is not ruled out. The whole fantasy is utterly ruined the moment you allow it to be a free-market thing, meaning cock-wielders can come in and be *just* as special as the PC. While it's high minded to get help with the cause, it's a real kick in the boner fuel tank, which is sort of the point of the whole game, really. I'm certainly not going to fuck with said setup just to make room for a nonsensical slaver fantasy that can be catered to in other ways and places.

Some female Vanae could become the enforcers themselves under the promise of getting free babies. But I don't particularly care for the Slaver suggestion, it was just a suggestion for setting up a brothel.

The more interesting solution that involves the "creation" of multiple male vanae would be to discover their origins, go to their homeworld and reintroduce the divergent races to each other.  This is, of course, a ludicrous amount of work even for you, but might be worth looking at for a long-term project while this provides a fun solution in the short term.

The PC doesn't necessarily have to go to their homeworld. A Octalian could just as well come to them at later levels and give a quest. Maybe a diplomat that wants M'henga to be declared a Octalian colony, so they can pressure the UGC to let them in the UGC or borrow a gate so they can connect to the rest of the UGC to their homeworld. They would need to convince a few Vanae clans to consider themselves colonies, kinda like the Terra and Embry species thing Jim wrote.
 
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Nik_van_Rijn

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Sep 10, 2015
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I like how you put 'even for you' after that. :3
And yeah, I'd rather go to a ludicrous amount of effort to do the Octalia homeworld than do it trying to make a square peg fit in a round hole, so to speak.

Is Octo-peeps being non-native to M'henga supposed to be a common knowledge or even an established canon, because it caught me completely off-guard. I guess one could read their origin myth that way, but that raises far more questions that it answers. Suddenly, it's like History channel up in here.
 

Lashcharge

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2015
706
137
Is Octo-peeps being non-native to M'henga supposed to be a common knowledge or even an established canon, because it caught me completely off-guard. I guess one could read their origin myth that way, but that raises far more questions that it answers. Suddenly, it's like History channel up in here.

Common knowledge no it isn't, but it's was decided early on by Jim. Becoming common knowledge by the people of the UGC(scientific publication, extranet blog or others) could be the result of player completing the Genome quest.
 

cazadore

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Aug 31, 2015
146
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what about the sacae they came from octalians would you have it work for them to if they get in game
 

Eva

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Sep 14, 2015
211
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-1 internet cookie point for not seeing Vanaes' flawed breeding system as a problem, +1 for wanting to help those poor savage by sharing technology, +100 for a spot-on Pratchett reference.

Where'd you like them to be delivered?

Given that just about everywhere in the TiTs universe is filled with aliens that are only too happy to fuck, I dispute your premise. With the necessary resources for spaceflight, the Vanae could quite feasibly support themselves on consensual sex. (After all, New Texas must sell all that collected semen to someone.)

(There is the issue with Vanae treating males as about as smart as plants, but I would think the existence of hermaphroditism out in the galaxy at large would go a long way towards helping with that. It's a cultural attitude, not something dictated by Vanae biology.)

((Just stick them anywhere. :p))

Is Octo-peeps being non-native to M'henga supposed to be a common knowledge or even an established canon, because it caught me completely off-guard. I guess one could read their origin myth that way, but that raises far more questions that it answers. Suddenly, it's like History channel up in here.

Here's a link for you.

http://wiki.smutosaur.us/Codex:_Vanae:_History
 

EmperorG

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Sep 6, 2015
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Wasn't it that the Octalians sent the ship as a sort of "last gasp before collapse" of their civilization? Also judging by the fact that you need to get something called "DiscoveredAncientData" done for anyone to even know the Vanae are from another planet, would suggest that there probably aren't any Octalians in the UGC.

So I highly doubt you could have a diplomat just show up out of nowhere, no its more likely for Steele to go to Octalia and bring contact between the Vanae and their original home.
 
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Lashcharge

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Aug 27, 2015
706
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Wasn't it that the Octalians sent the ship as a sort of "last gasp before collapse" of their civilization? Also judging by the fact that you need to get something called "DiscoveredAncientData" done for anyone to even know the Vanae are from another planet, would suggest that there probably aren't any Octalians in the UGC.

So I highly doubt you could have a diplomat just show up out of nowhere, no its more likely for Steele to go to Octalia and bring contact between the Vanae and their original home.

I don't know if they did sent it for that reason, but since the survivors of that crash had enough time to evolve into, at least, a different sub-species, I'm pretty sure the Octalians had time to rebuild if they could. More than a thousands years I would guess.

It could just be really old data, that no Octalian remembers. (something supported by a collapse of civilization)

It also depends on where the homeworld is. The Vanae History codex defines it as being neighbouring sector, which means it had to be part of a previous rush for the player to be able to visit(since last I heard it's one sector per rush?), otherwise it would take a really long time to get there.
 
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JimThermic

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Aug 26, 2015
383
6
The problem and why i'm so insisting on more than one... (Insert long pitch here)

Clearly, I was not blunt enough the first time. That's my fault for being diplomatic and expecting it to work. Let me take a leaf out of Magic Ted's book.

Your ideas are terrible. They're not happening. Period. 

They have eyes, thank you very much. 

(They might not be able to see anything with them, though. :p)

What Eva said. Vanae have vestigial eyelashes and eyes, because IMO not having these makes them look a tad gross. I'm a sucker for girls with pretty eyelashes, particularly the natural eye-shadow vanae girls have. Probably a little known fact, though it's in the codex, is that their eye color is always the same as their markings. They *can* open their eyes, they just choose not to, because there's really no point. 

Wasn't it that the Octalians sent the ship as a sort of "last gasp before collapse" of their civilization? Also judging by the fact that you need to get something called "DiscoveredAncientData" done for anyone to even know the Vanae are from another planet, would suggest that there probably aren't any Octalians in the UGC.

So I highly doubt you could have a diplomat just show up out of nowhere, no its more likely for Steele to go to Octalia and bring contact between the Vanae and their original home.

I wrote 'neighboring sector', but that was back when I had a layman's understanding of the whole galactic rush thing. The whole Octalian thing is in game, but the codex entry on it is gated behind a quest that doesn't exist yet. That's because I wrote up the codex entry but not a way for the PC to obtain such knowledge. The Octalia are not a part of the UGC, their civilization lies in unexplored rush space. So yeah, the whole diplomat thing won't work. 

Their exploratory efforts were similar to the lunar landings. They were sent out to see if they could do it. Unfortunately, at least with the Mhen'gan expedition, things went hideously wrong. They probably didn't notice the big red flashing button in the cockpit when they were coming in to land. :3

You'll most likely find out about the whole Octalian thing around the same time you obtain the male 'Vanae' genome.

the sacae link goes to synth sap

Fixed!
 
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Noob Salad

Captain Shitpost
Aug 26, 2015
4,372
1,560
doom the race to incest

You say that like it's a bad thing. Being the Vanae's sole male is, well, just see: Vanae Stud Ending

Jim handwaving the inbreeding concern away (hey, it doesn't need to be that realistic) was one of the best things he's ever done. ty 4 incest boner
 
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Nik_van_Rijn

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Sep 10, 2015
2,415
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You say that like it's a bad thing. Being the Vanae's sole male is, well, just see: Vanae Stud Ending

Jim handwaving the inbreeding concern away (hey, it doesn't need to be that realistic) was one of the best things he's ever done. ty 4 incest boner

Amen to that, my brother! Incest is the way of big G, the righteous way! 
 

JimThermic

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Creator
Aug 26, 2015
383
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Amen to that, my brother! Incest is the way of big G, the righteous way! 
There's... 

tumblr_nnqzvqfmNf1uu3fsio1_500.png
 
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Decanter

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2015
101
8
What Eva said. Vanae have vestigial eyelashes and eyes, because IMO not having these makes them look a tad gross. I'm a sucker for girls with pretty eyelashes, particularly the natural eye-shadow vanae girls have. Probably a little known fact, though it's in the codex, is that their eye color is always the same as their markings. They *can* open their eyes, they just choose not to, because there's really no point.

...I understand that what I said could be taken to mean that I wanted to give Vanae ornamental eyes that stare yet do not see, but I'm slightly creeped out that you chose that interpretation as the likely one.
 

StarcraftJunkie

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Aug 29, 2015
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...I understand that what I said could be taken to mean that I wanted to give Vanae ornamental eyes that stare yet do not see, but I'm slightly creeped out that you chose that interpretation as the likely one.

He didn't take it as that. He just pointed out that that's what they already have.

If what you wanted was to make their already-existing eyes functional, you should have said that.
 
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Decanter

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Aug 27, 2015
101
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He didn't take it as that. He just pointed out that that's what they already have.

If what you wanted was to make their already-existing eyes functional, you should have said that.

I was under the false impression that they didn't have them at all, so it would not have made sense to say that. I'm saying that it's weird to assume that I wanted them to have nonfunctional bits just because I didn't explicitly say the bits should be functional.
 

Karretch

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Aug 26, 2015
2,068
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You say that like it's a bad thing. Being the Vanae's sole male is, well, just see: Vanae Stud Ending

Jim handwaving the inbreeding concern away (hey, it doesn't need to be that realistic) was one of the best things he's ever done. ty 4 incest boner

Doesn't even need handwaving. Maybe it would take a bit of help, but genetic degradation can be avoided with planning of breeding partners of subsequent generations. Hell, most of the problems we associate from inbreeding is what we've taken from European royalty and aristocracy. They bred within special families no matter what bad things came up just for the sake of "purity". I'm pretty sure the Vanae, even without the inevitable uplift thanks to the Rush, would avoid breeding defective traits. When life depends on being able to survive dangers it's a bad idea to let imperfections set in. Royalty and aristocracy didn't need to fear for that, they had other people die for them and lived in pampered luxury.
 

JimThermic

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Aug 26, 2015
383
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I was under the false impression that they didn't have them at all, so it would not have made sense to say that. I'm saying that it's weird to assume that I wanted them to have nonfunctional bits just because I didn't explicitly say the bits should be functional.

I, uh, just said they have eyes already because your statement implied they didn't have eyes. I didn't give any thought as to whether you were asking for them to be seeing or not. In terms of giving the vanae eyesight, you're probably not doing them a favor by giving them it. It's not like they're beings who suffer from lack of sight, or they yearn for it, much like humans don't feel lacking because they don't have echolocation. Sure, one or two might be curious in having it, but it's not like a disability not to have this sense.

In terms of it being creepy to like the idea of people with eyes but no sight and a blank stare, I'd disagree. I actually designed the vanae eyes when I was thinking of Lilly Satou from Katawa Shoujo, who as a blind girl, has her eyes closed most of the time but can open them. At first I was reluctant about the concept, but I actually found the execution quite endearing, so I nyoinked it and threw it into the vanae.

tumblr_inline_msggqh66El1s49ans.png
char_lilly.png


KatawaShoujo61.jpg~original
 
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Decanter

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Aug 27, 2015
101
8
In terms of giving the vanae eyesight, you're probably not doing them a favor by giving them it. It's not like they're beings who suffer from lack of sight, or they yearn for it, much like humans don't feel lacking because they don't have echolocation. Sure, one or two might be curious in having it, but it's not like a disability not to have this sense.

Not all senses are created equal. Eyesight is far and away our most useful sense. You can make up for lack of echolocation with a flashlight, but you can't really make up for lack of sight with anything, which is why you see deaf people claiming they're an "alternate lifestyle" but blind people not so much. This is less like not having echolocation and more like not having ESP. Oh, and everyone else has it and they've structured civilization around people having it.

If you don't wanna write it because it'd come out all sappy, that's fine. It's not like the game goes out of its way to make us think about the issue, since the question of uplifting the vanae is never raised. This just isn't a good justification.
 

Eva

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Sep 14, 2015
211
0
WUT? You mean like Daredevil?

"Diagnosed with retinal cancer at the age of two, American Ben Underwood had his eyes removed at the age of three.

He taught himself echolocation at the age of five. He was able to detect the location of objects by making frequent clicking noises with his tongue.  He used it to accomplish such feats as running, playing basketball, riding a bicycle, rollerblading, playing football, and skateboarding." 

...(in another case)...

"Kish reports that "The sense of imagery is very rich for an experienced user. One can get a sense of beauty or starkness or whatever - from sound as well as echo". He is able to distinguish a metal fence from a wooden one by the information returned by the echoes on the arrangement of the fence structures; in extremely quiet conditions, he can also hear the warmer and duller quality of the echoes from wood compared to metal."

Yes, you can teach yourself to echolocate. I don't know if it's possible in people who aren't blind already - studies have shown that it actually uses some of the areas of the brain we normally use to process vision.

Edit: As of a 2013 study, it's been shown that even sighted people can learn to do this.
 
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