Your gripes with CoC II

Status
Not open for further replies.

Zerva

Well-Known Member
Mar 25, 2016
120
39
These decisions have been discussed in the past at considerable length, and are unlikely to be revisited any time soon. While I'll never say never, I wouldn't hold my breath for changes, especially since we just looked at reworking the tutorial and some basic systems not too long ago.
I sincerely hope if they are looked at the first one is looked at especially. That's the big one. I can respect the intentions behind the decision but I would not say there was any success. The core idea is good. The result however is that a warrior is actively punished for using half of their skillset because, unlike Arona for example, them being overpowered physically or mentally results in a total loss and that's what drawing massive aggro is inviting to happen pending RNG. To quote Savin themselves: "Warrior is the tank class. The *only* tank class. Their entire job is to draw aggro." I just wish that this archetype wasn't, in this respect, inferior to its peers.

I will mention there is now a dedicated button to auto combat and a dedicated toggle to auto combat and let it lay from here. My point has been made and I don't want to go on and on.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tendril

Savin

Master Analmander
Staff member
Aug 26, 2015
6,238
10,179
It's always confused me why you guys launched with only autocombat

Geddy thought that was The Way to Go, since it makes combat a lot faster. I wanted party control combat from the get-go but we'd ultimately decided on just player control to start with, for brevity's sake.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gooch and Fleep

Zandar

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2015
226
374
It's a bother when you can't choose to avoid certain unique NPCs when they're not even related to any sorts of quests. Let the player decide if they don't care about the NPC or events the NPC leads upto and allow the player to avoid them indefinitely.

what are you talking about. What character are you incapable of avoiding?
 

Azulrus

Member
Sep 11, 2020
7
3
24
what are you talking about. What character are you incapable of avoiding?
Well for one, Cait. Can't choose to ignore her first scene and just figure things out without Cait, you just get a game over if you try.

Personally I dislike the player character personality railroading. I guess it would take a lot more writing for the PC to be anything but incredibly-horny-champion tho (speaking of, characters started calling me champion before I really did anything heroic which seemed odd). If it was possible id like to see more of an reserved / anti-hero type to go along with it.
I haven't explored corruption and I don't know where that goes but if it doesn't already I'd also think it'd be interesting to become a sort of villain too
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Azulrus

Member
Sep 11, 2020
7
3
24
It's always confused me why you guys launched with only autocombat. Personally, the game was unplayable until manual control was added (props to whoever convinced mr boss man to add this)
Yeah, as soon as I saw it was an setting I haven't toggled auto combat back on. Consequently some abilities that increase aggro to a certain target seem outdated, like "Mark for death".
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Violyn

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2017
400
376
Mark for dead

I honestly would love this skill to add some sort of weakening debuff to the target, either lowering their defenses like one of Kiyoko's skills (also like marked for death from skyrim which lowers the targets armor points and drains health), or just straight up be a debuff that increases any damage said target takes, like 20% or more.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Azulrus

WolframL

Well-Known Member
Feb 12, 2020
3,610
5,140
42
<stuff in godawful blue text>
Oh god, my eyes, they're bleeding! Seriously, that is painful to read.

And boo-hoo, you're forced to interact with the head honcho's (first) character in the tutorial and immediately afterwards because her arrival in Hawkethorne literally drives the plot. If you want to ignore her from the very start, go ahead, you just won't be playing the rest of the game. You're free to avoid her any time after the intro if you're so determined to.
 

Azulrus

Member
Sep 11, 2020
7
3
24
And boo-hoo, you're forced to interact with the head honcho's (first) character in the tutorial
Wasn't my complaint, just giving an example for a character you cant avoid.
her arrival in Hawkethorne literally drives the plot.
Though I am sure that the PC could notice the area around the place they are staying is being corrupted without Cait telling them.
 

Rear Admiral Chimera

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2017
208
212
Perhaps, but without meeting Kasyrra in they way that they do during the introductory sequence, the primary antagonist might not have a reason to use "kid gloves" with the PC considering how she could easily overpower them (barring the possibility of cheesing the Winter City fight). This would drastically alter the main story since it requires that Kas goes relatively easy on the champ.
 

Zandar

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2015
226
374

I mean... ok? I don't really understand why not being able to go around Cait is such a problem, especially because her dragging us to the portal is the only reason we are the main character, we would just be some dude in town who has no fucking clue what is going on as the world gets fucked.

You are right though, you are incapable of completely avoiding her, but the second the tutorial is over you can pretend she doesnt exist and just make due with the fact that you don't have a healer. Following that logic you also are forced to interact with Brint and Etheryn because they are both placed in the 1 block wide path north. Regardless, they are not combat encounters so the second you see them you can just pretend they don't exist, except Ryn because of the Elf dungeon.

The only character, that you are actually going to be forced to constantly interact with throughout the game is Kasyrra becasue she is the main antagonist.
 

Azulrus

Member
Sep 11, 2020
7
3
24
dragging us to the portal
Kas goes relatively easy on the champ
Hey, good points, I was just thinking in terms that the PC might be some scummy adventurer who will still do things for their own benefit around the area without even caring about Cait's problems, but i forgot about the whole portal thing, and how they wont be all magical and transformation / laystone attuned, and that not meeting kas might mean that she is just inclined to beat them down on first meeting.
barring the possibility of cheesing the Winter City fight
<.<
Is that possible? That fight is insane.
 

Rear Admiral Chimera

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2017
208
212
Is that possible? That fight is insane.
I didn't attempt it since my champ has been intimate with her from the beginning (He's not even a corrupt character, he's just a horny dipshit). Though if I recall correctly, should the PC defeat her, she will accuse you of cheating.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Azulrus

WolframL

Well-Known Member
Feb 12, 2020
3,610
5,140
42
Is that possible? That fight is insane.
Technically yes, but only by cheating right now. The game has the coding to account for a player winning the fight though, since at some point the level cap will be such that it's possible an extremely persistent player will legitimately grind enough to be able to beat the fight. But it won't actually change the outcome of the story.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Violyn and Azulrus

Violyn

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2017
400
376
Technically yes, but only by cheating right now. The game has the coding to account for a player winning the fight though, since at some point the level cap will be such that it's possible an extremely persistent player will legitimately grind enough to be able to beat the fight. But it won't actually change the outcome of the story.

I'll literally create a whole new character just for this.
 

GEESE

Well-Known Member
Sep 27, 2018
191
210
32
Kiyoko references "gunboat diplomacy" even though the world is at least a thousand years away from inventing guns.
Kiyoko's kids all refer you as dad even if you're a lady. wish there was a feminine honorific for them to use.
but worst of alll...
You can pet a lot of the kitsune, but you cant pet all of them
 

WolframL

Well-Known Member
Feb 12, 2020
3,610
5,140
42
Because it precisely describes the situation in a way that the player will get it immediately. Tobs is clearly using the term deliberately. If you're not going to bat an eye at a fantasy culture just happening to be Japan with the language and everything, an anachronistic term shouldn't be too much to deal with.
 

GEESE

Well-Known Member
Sep 27, 2018
191
210
32
oh I was batting so many eyes at the existence of "totally not japan," but thats happened so many times in fantasy stuff that its harder and harder to give a flock.
Hey, if the response to people griping over something is just "deal with it" then people will keep griping about it, and thats something you'll just have to... Deal with :V
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kesil

Paradox01

Well-Known Member
Feb 8, 2020
1,817
2,479
USA
Hey, if the response to people griping over something is just "deal with it" then people will keep griping about it, and thats something you'll just have to... Deal with :V
Anachronisms. Neutral since 1617.

For those that missed the point, anachronisms aren't inherently incorrect or wrong. Read the definition. Examples like this "gunboat diplomacy" in a pre-gunpowder setting aren't fuck-ups, they're a conscious writing style. So like it or don't but quit calling it out like it's a mistake, deal with it, and move the fuck along.
 

GEESE

Well-Known Member
Sep 27, 2018
191
210
32
I wasnt talking about the gunboat diplomacy there. "The word gets the exact meaning across without any confusion" is a perfectly reasonable explanation.
Yeesh, whats the deal with the fenoxo fandom and responding so venomously to any kind of criticism. Chillax!
 

Alypia

Well-Known Member
Apr 22, 2016
1,374
3,617
I wasnt talking about the gunboat diplomacy there. "The word gets the exact meaning across without any confusion" is a perfectly reasonable explanation.
Yeesh, whats the deal with the fenoxo fandom and responding so venomously to any kind of criticism. Chillax!
That's fair. It's the usual message-board thing where the regulars have seen a revolving door of fresh faces show up and all complain about, ask for, or demand the same things. For the new person, it's just a thing; for the grognards, it's a Whole Thing, inextricable from a long parade of people and the memory of arguments past, none of which the new person knows about.

And yeah, a lot of the regulars, myself included, are...pretty enthusiastic. Makes troubleshooting and guides pretty easy, but also means that we - not to speak for anyone else - can get a bit overzealous, too.
 

Tide Hunter

Well-Known Member
May 4, 2019
887
1,189
Okay, so. In this, I have a new gripe, and a few old gripes.
First is my new gripe: Several TF items have TFs that are tied only to the raw version. And like, certain effects, I could probably understand tying them to only the raw form (Especially height, as it seems that height changes are only tied to raw for any tf item that changes it and I'm fine with that), but there are so many effects which target a specific part but which are only available for the raw form. For example, the Bovum Sherry ties femininity, butt/hip rating, and lip mod to the raw version, and Minoblood Wine tied femininity, cum multiplier, and lip mod to the raw version. Why is this? Femininity can be changed with pink and blue eggs infused with Soft Mud, so why is it that these items can not change it with Soft Mud? Why is it that lip mod is also not affected by a Soft Mud-infused Bovum/Minoblood, considering that it is affected by a Soft Mud-infused Cackle Berry or Wolfsboon/Lycanthorn? Why is it that the Bovum's butt/hip modifier can only happen raw, rather than with the Juicy Peach, given that Minoblood can change the butt/hip rating with a JP infusion? Why can Minoblood can't affect the cum multiplier with the Chestnut infusion, when the Virility Booster can?

It's not just the two minotaur tfs, there's also Cat's Tongue Berry having its cock, breast size, and hip ratings all tied to its raw form, the Carrot Cumpcake has thickness and hip rating tied to raw, Gold Eggs have femininity and Fertility tied to the raw form, Brute Beets have cup size, cock size, ball size, femininity, tone/thickness, butt rating, hip rating, and ear length all tied to its raw form, Root of Man has its femininity, cock size, and breast size tied to the raw form, and there are several others. Why are there so many aspects to these TFs tied exclusively to their raw forms?


Second: Why is it that you still fall asleep when you masturbate? I almost never use the masturbation options anyway, given that you have to be in camp or at the tavern to be able to masturbate, but why is it that jacking off or even milking yourself has you conking out until the next morning? This gripe has been said before, and given that Savin's said there's a strong possibility of getting rid of sleep-on-fap, I'm wondering why it still is the way it is.


Third: I've said this before, but why can we only fuck Etheryn monstrously with a cock larger than 12 inches? I do understand that there is, I think, a mechanic that lets you train Etheryn's ass to take larger cocks, but since she starts out being unable to take larger cocks, that effectively limits me to either having a cock below 13 inches long (what I currently do, even though I'd rather make it larger), not fucking Etheryn (which I don't want to do because she is one of my favorite characters), or being an absolute asshole when fucking her (The game does not warn you before selecting the assfuck option that you must fuck her in a corrupt manner if your cock is too large, outside of the first scene where Etheryn needs to cum, and if you don't have a cock larger than 12 inches at the time and grow it later or if you just don't look at/select that option at the time, then you'll suddenly be told after you've selected the assfuck sex option that you must do so monstrously, with no option to go back and select something else.)


And finally, to revisit the thing that Puffy_Princess said two and a half weeks ago: Why does Cait offer her ass to the Drider Queen? As she says when you give it a kiss after fucking her pussy, "I'm saving that, you know." She's an anal virgin, and has apparently been saving her anal virginity, but why is she saving it if she's just going to freely give it away to a random spider-lady? Sure, she's doing it for our sake, but so what? What if we want to get egged, or don't want her to get egged? We don't get the option to say "no, actually, just egg me and not her," if you're in the loss scene the game does not let you spare Cait, it just automatically has her get egged. And it's not even some important character story moment, to show that she and the Champion has grown in terms of trust and she's willing to sacrifice something precious to her to save him/her. Instead, some random enemy who we can never even learn the name of gets to take her anal virginity and she acts like it's no big deal despite how she's been saving her anal virginity, and also given that, according to her in the "children" talk option after you've cum in her pussy "I don't need to be getting all knocked up while there's demons trying to steal my friend's soul and my sister's missing. Got more pressing things on my mind than breeding." Despite both of that, when doing the "Eggs?" talk option with Cait afterwards, she acts like it was totally fine, like she didn't loose something that she's been saving for a while (her anal virginity) and that the fact that she's also been impregnated doesn't matter since they're technically not her children. I do think it is pretty neat that the "chaste kiss" tooltip and scene no longer mention her being an anal virgin afterwards, but still, it feels really weird that she'd just easily give it away to a completely unimportant character who she has had no interaction with beyond getting into a fight with her. And then she doesn't even let the PC fuck her ass now that she's no longer an anal virgin. Also if the PC has been egged the Drider Queen will normally not egg them again but if Cait is there then she'll get egged despite the PC already having eggs in them, so Cait doesn't even have a reason to sacrifice her anal virginity for the PC to avoid getting egged there.

I did check the scenes. The Drider Queen egging Cait says that it was written by @BubbleLord , the writer for the Drider Queen, rather than Savin. The "Eggs?" discussion is also written by BubbleLord, rather than Savin, and same with the random scene where the eggs in Cait's stomach will sometimes make a loud sound. Not to try to put down anyone's work, as all of the authors working on CoC2 are great, and I really like the Marked Mercs, Sugo, Ninian, and the Drider queen, all of which were written by BubbleLord. But it feels almost like, with the Cait eggings, he simply forgot that Cait is an anal virgin and is saving her ass, presumably for somebody special. I say almost, because he demonstrably did not. The scene where Cait gets egged mentions her "unspoiled butthole", and also it says
Your friend throws her head back and tries to moan as her anal virginity gets conquered by the powerful ovipositor, yet she can't get out more than a peep before the queen wrestles her back into the kiss. Cait is no longer an anal virgin!
So the scene explicitly mentions her anal virginity, and thusly, that means that he know that she's a virgin. But in the scenes following, it gets treated like the fact that she lost her anal virginity is of absolutely no consequence whatsoever, despite explicit statements.

Though perhaps, Cait's anal virginity isn't quite intended to be taken seriously, given that the writer for the Chaste Kiss scene was written by SomeKindofWizard rather than Savin. Still, it seems odd that Cait would be explicitly saving her anal virginity despite having a profession and faith which largely center around sex, meaning that it must actually hold some importance to her as otherwise she almost certainly would have lost it long ago.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Zawarado

Emerald

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2016
2,167
2,834
Not to try to put down anyone's work, as all of the authors working on CoC2 are great, and I really like the Marked Mercs, Sugo, Ninian, the Wyld Elf band, and the Drider queen, all of which were written by BubbleLord.
The Wyld Elves are mostly Garde's thing. :U
 

kinkshamer

Well-Known Member
Feb 8, 2016
107
47
what are you talking about. What character are you incapable of avoiding?
Vari, for instance. No offense but I don't care for her or anyone/anything she is a gateway to. So I'd love it if I could just avoid her entirely while I'm trying to beat up NPCs up north.
 

Kamidel

Well-Known Member
Sep 18, 2020
52
36
51
Kinda small gripe is when you visit Vari to see the kittens it makes it seem like an hour or two but jumps through to the next morning.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Doeber and Violyn
Status
Not open for further replies.