The Morality of The Seven (Heavy Lore spoilers)

[drossbots]

I think it may be fair to say we can't comprehend the morality of the seven. Or at least that judging them from the perspective of a mere mortal isn't fair. They developed emotions based off eating mortals, but they were eldritch horrors fueled by hunger that exist between the worlds first and foremost. Those experiences would have shaped them in incomprehensible ways. And they didn't stop being wraiths (I'm pretty sure) just because they achieved divinity. They're still not exactly like the the people in the worlds. When judging them, we gotta not be distracted by the boobs and realize that the boobs are an illusion to hide the gnawing tentacles of unfathomable terror. Mmmmmmmmm, tentacles. Okay we also gotta avoid being distracted by tentacles.

I don't think they even understand their own morality, to be honest. Mallach himself mentions how they're (maybe) only able to perceive the world from a certain, directed viewpoint thanks to the way they achieved sapience. Nareva also discusses how discovering new things about herself is one of the only things that keeps her going.

Speaking of hyper-focused, directed viewpoints, demons seem to be pretty similar to wraiths in that way. Most demons seem to really like sex, but they also tend to have a secondary interest they're just as obsessed with. Like Kas and science/magic, and that one shop demon and capitalism. Meanwhile, wraiths are hyper-focused on souls, and in the seven's case they're also focused on whatever their portfolio happens to be.

We know souls can be used as a consumable resource, but does the lack of a soul do something to, idk, narrow a creatures world-view?

(Like your new profile pic, btw)

 

[Lone Wolf115]

(Like your new profile pic, btw)

Second that it'll take me a bit of time to get used to but I like it @Wint3rRyd3r zoomed in with my phone and saw the monster energy drink love em.

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

I don't think they even understand their own morality, to be honest. Mallach himself mentions how they're (maybe) only able to perceive the world from a certain, directed viewpoint thanks to the way they achieved sapience. Nareva also discusses how discovering new things about herself is one of the only things that keeps her going.

Speaking of hyper-focused, directed viewpoints, demons seem to be pretty similar to wraiths in that way. Most demons seem to really like sex, but they also tend to have a secondary interest they're just as obsessed with. Like Kas and science/magic, and that one shop demon and capitalism. Meanwhile, wraiths are hyper-focused on souls, and in the seven's case they're also focused on whatever their portfolio happens to be.

We know souls can be used as a consumable resource, but does the lack of a soul do something to, idk, narrow a creatures world-view?

(Like your new profile pic, btw)

That's pretty interesting. It would fit their overall behavior. And for beings that originally didn't have a concept of emotion or morality, they probably don't fully understand it. That may very well be why Mallach makes all those different Rivers, and why Keros seems to like interacting with his followers. Even humans don't have a full understanding of psychology and morality. The secondary hyper focus could be a subconscious coping mechanism. Demons and the seven are not in their original forms. The transformation could be traumatic enough on some level that they develop it to help cope.

And thanks. It's Eerie from a series by TheKite called "How my Gardevoir Became a Pornstar." I've gotten really into the series lately and like this picture. If you're gonna read it, just a heads up: chapter 0 and 1 are sad stories that take to the end to get somewhat happy. And chapter 2 is a flashback that is depressing as hell. It's not for everyone. Art's real damn good though. I'm hoping chapter 3 focuses on fluff, healing, and romance to balance out 3 total chapters of pain.

 

[Karamaru]

I don't think they even understand their own morality, to be honest. Mallach himself mentions how they're (maybe) only able to perceive the world from a certain, directed viewpoint thanks to the way they achieved sapience. Nareva also discusses how discovering new things about herself is one of the only things that keeps her going.

Yea it must be kinda hard to understand yourself when you suddenly can perceive the world around you when you previously never had to and were just reacting to outside stimuli and looking for new ways to entertain yourself for eternity like how Mallach just binge watches mortal life.

And can wraiths even exists on the physical plane and a keep themselves from going insane from the expierence.

That's pretty interesting. It would fit their overall behavior. And for beings that originally didn't have a concept of emotion or morality, they probably don't fully understand it. That may very well be why Mallach makes all those different Rivers, and why Keros seems to like interacting with his followers. Even humans don't have a full understanding of psychology and morality. The secondary hyper focus could be a subconscious coping mechanism. Demons and the seven are not in their original forms. The transformation could be traumatic enough on some level that they develop it to help cope.

They might also function on a blue and orange morality trope like they have morals but they don't have morals as we understand since they had none to begin with and do they keep themselves busy by hyper focusing on their job and the emotions and people that come with it.

Same with demons I'd like to think that Demonfication is a really effed up way to unlock one's latent powers since it removes all mental blockades and they are more powerful than the were before with consent and empathy to keep themselves in check from harming others and themselves.

 

[Starstruck]

Depends. Since Ryn is a boreal elf she has a longer potential lifespan than the Champion even if you're a Wyld Elf, so if one divine TF can change your lifespan to match that of the race you've become (and there's dialogue indicating that Keros' transformation does

It occurred to me while I was outdoors today but, Lumia doesn't exactly have a glowing record when it comes to star-crossed lovers and House Ridell. Be careful you don't don't dig yourself into the same pitfall as Atheldred with this bargain.

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

And can wraiths even exists on the physical plane and a keep themselves from going insane from the expierence.

We know Keros can walk around but he doesn't stay for extended periods so he may have that issue or he may not. I think they can though, since Nareva mentions spending a lot of time with Ria's mom. They probably just don't like it or worry it'll make them to accessible and easy to bother.

They might also function on a blue and orange morality trope like they have morals but they don't have morals as we understand since they had none to begin with and do they keep themselves busy by hyper focusing on their job and the emotions and people that come with it.

To be fair, if they aren't hyper focused then they're alone with their thoughts and that sucks.

It occurred to me while I was outdoors today but, Lumia doesn't exactly have a glowing record when it comes to star-crossed lovers and House Ridell. Be careful you don't don't dig yourself into the same pitfall as Atheldred with this bargain.

It's even worse when you consider that Ryn looks like Synneva. I wouldn't say Lumia has a glowing record at all, which is ironic for the goddess of light. Everyone else is either busy being assholes (Keros), horny (Mallach), sad and probably horny (Nareva. I refuse to believe she ain't doing anything with Ander and Ria.), making deer dommes (Praise be unto Velun), or holding the hands of giant man children and their bandits mercenaries (Looking at you Tira.).

And then there's Lumia. Who ordered and/or let her followers commit atrocities against their loved ones simply for not converting. In short, every other god >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Lumia

 

[Squirrelwagon]

You forgot Sorra, who seems content to watch two of her patron races attempt to commit genocide on the other. I mean, she might not be happy with it, to be fair, but we have no idea either way.

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

Obviously Sorra is just bored and hates harpies as much as everyone else. But Lumia beat her to gluing wings on her servants so now she has to hope everyone else gets sick of being harassed by harpies and frees her up to get new worshippers. Shar is exempt though. She's a cinnamon roll and Sorra probably tried to see what would happen if she moved the harpy wings but forgot to adjust everything else. Thus creating Shar.

 

[LonelyHydra]

I am not a backer and I'm (still sadly) basing this less on what's actually in the game and more on second-hand info. So take FWIW:

1) I'm not the biggest fan of writing off someone's morality as completely alien when they look able to communicate and interact with you just fine. Seems like it's making excuses for hurtful behavior, especially in a relationship that started out parasitic as the Wraiths to the mortals. As much as I'm disappointed that the Seven has made less progress than expected on that, it does open up the possibility for the Champ to help shape them into something resembling human morality.

Like the Hero redeeming the Heavens. Funny, it's usually the other way around.

2) I suspect one of the Endings involves Ascension to a god. You might need a Soul for that.

Aside rant: Heck, it might be how the former gods did it. Until now, I never really understood the narrative decision behind having pre-Wraith gods a Real Thing. The writers say reviving them is right out. Just having the gods be emo parasites is enough motivation to redo the "everything is a lie, rage against society" bit in CoC1. (And even then it has less impact than having your personal identity pulled out from under you.) Or maybe that was just symbolism and guilt and I'm reading too much into it.

 

[Tide Hunter]

Damn straight, that's quitter talk. We can go to a beach and make a car out of sand. We just need elbow grease, boot straps, and our hopes and dreams.

Though handing massive technological advancements before civilization is ready is admittedly a terrible idea. It'd be like that video of soldiers giving a monkey their rifle. With damn safety off apparently.

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

I love the way the monkey holds the gun up at the end like he won. Why they didn't at least put the safety on, I'll never know.

 

[Tide Hunter]

And thanks. It's Eerie from a series by TheKite called "How my Gardevoir Became a Pornstar." I've gotten really into the series lately and like this picture. If you're gonna read it, just a heads up: chapter 0 and 1 are sad stories that take to the end to get somewhat happy. And chapter 2 is a flashback that is depressing as hell. It's not for everyone. Art's real damn good though. I'm hoping chapter 3 focuses on fluff, healing, and romance to balance out 3 total chapters of pain.

So I've just binged this whole series because of this and wow. It's great, but also yeah chapter 2 is pretty heavy.

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

So I've just binged this whole series because of this and wow. It's great, but also yeah chapter 2 is pretty heavy.

Yeah. It is heavy. But don't worry, chapter 2 is almost over and after a break probably, it shall return. I'm hoping that with how chapter 1 ended and how the shorts have gone, that chapter 3 will be more uplifting. I just want to know what that amended contract entailed. Probably just Lou being contracted to work though, thus letting the studio get her and keep Eerie but I'm still curious. I just want characters in stories I like to be happy. Still the shorts and their implications make me hopeful. Or maybe everything else has been so heavy that I'm just being wishful. At least there will be great art and an extremely thicc gardevoir.

On the topic of the seven, wouldn't Velun be pissed that the kitsune tree is apparently affecting the forest? It's implied that their tree is what's killing the Old Wyld and creating a deadzone in the area the dryads mention. Although the dryads could be sensing the corrupted glade, I think that dialogue appearing regardless of the resolution of the Alraune means they're feeling the kitsune tree. Even though Velun doesn't rule it, I'd imagine the well being of the Old Wyld would still fall under his portfolio and he'd at least be concerned for the deer babes. The floofs may not fully realize it, but it seems they simply can't coexist with the forest they're in. But thinking this has got me wondering. If members of the seven have their domain/portfolio/fetish clash and contradict, what happens? Keros seems pretty interested in the colonies working out it seems so I doubt he'd pack up his fluff weebs and take them home. Would Keros and Velun fight? Would they send champions to fend off the other's efforts? If the kitsune's tree is an actual threat though, then doesn't that fly in the face of Keros's whole equivalent exchange? If the tree is draining life from the forest to sustain itself and house the kitsune but they also aren't benefiting the forest or its residents, wouldn't that violate Keros's own laws? Can the tree give back or form a symbiotic relationship with the forest instead of being parasitic? And if not, wouldn't most unite to attack the Kitsune to protect their natural resources and culture? Head empty from too much questions. No thoughts, put all in text. Read HMGBAPS. It good.

 

[Starstruck]

sad and probably horny (Nareva)

I'd say it's more than just probable, considering she was probably reading smut when you met her in Mallach's Dream... if her reaction to seeing you there and haste to conceal her reading material is any indication.

 

[drossbots]

Yeah. It is heavy. But don't worry, chapter 2 is almost over and after a break probably, it shall return. I'm hoping that with how chapter 1 ended and how the shorts have gone, that chapter 3 will be more uplifting. I just want to know what that amended contract entailed. Probably just Lou being contracted to work though, thus letting the studio get her and keep Eerie but I'm still curious. I just want characters in stories I like to be happy. Still the shorts and their implications make me hopeful. Or maybe everything else has been so heavy that I'm just being wishful. At least there will be great art and an extremely thicc gardevoir.

On the topic of the seven, wouldn't Velun be pissed that the kitsune tree is apparently affecting the forest? It's implied that their tree is what's killing the Old Wyld and creating a deadzone in the area the dryads mention. Although the dryads could be sensing the corrupted glade, I think that dialogue appearing regardless of the resolution of the Alraune means they're feeling the kitsune tree. Even though Velun doesn't rule it, I'd imagine the well being of the Old Wyld would still fall under his portfolio and he'd at least be concerned for the deer babes. The floofs may not fully realize it, but it seems they simply can't coexist with the forest they're in. But thinking this has got me wondering. If members of the seven have their domain/portfolio/fetish clash and contradict, what happens? Keros seems pretty interested in the colonies working out it seems so I doubt he'd pack up his fluff weebs and take them home. Would Keros and Velun fight? Would they send champions to fend off the other's efforts? If the kitsune's tree is an actual threat though, then doesn't that fly in the face of Keros's whole equivalent exchange? If the tree is draining life from the forest to sustain itself and house the kitsune but they also aren't benefiting the forest or its residents, wouldn't that violate Keros's own laws? Can the tree give back or form a symbiotic relationship with the forest instead of being parasitic? And if not, wouldn't most unite to attack the Kitsune to protect their natural resources and culture? Head empty from too much questions. No thoughts, put all in text. Read HMGBAPS. It good.

Well, the Old Wyld is considered to be a god-like entity, right? And the Seven are a pantheon. If the Fox Den kills the Old Wyld, then: The Kitsune get a new colony, Lumia gets more followers from the druids that lost their religion (at least some of them will convert, probably), and Velun... well... he kinda gets screwed a bit in this deal, but he's a part of the pantheon, so sometimes you gotta take one for the team. The Old Wyld dying removes competition from the overall god-game thing.

As for the whole equivalent exchange thing, I'm sure it can be justified somehow. The plants are still alive, they're just fox plants now, or something. idk. A nation violating it's own sacred laws for the sake of profit isn't really a new thing, right?

 

[TheShepard256]

Another potential conflict I foresee is Lumia vs Keros: chances are, the Winter City is going to want to reclaim their former lands once this whole demon situation is resolved and they can get their population back up, which means re-expanding into where the kitsune colony currently lives (or at least intends to also expand into). Unless Etheryn and Komari can work out some sort of formal agreement (with or without Champ's help; probably with), that's going to lead to conflict, and both sides might try to drag their respective gods into it. Then again, given Lumia's actions both past and present, she might not care that much about the Winter City...

Also, I've been thinking about souls being used as a source of magical power, and it kind of reminds me of how mass can be converted into energy, like with real-life power sources. The thing is, mass-energy equivalence works both ways i.e. energy can be converted into mass; by the same logic, would it thus be possible, under the right circumstances, to convert magical power into souls?

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

Well, the Old Wyld is considered to be a god-like entity, right? And the Seven are a pantheon. If the Fox Den kills the Old Wyld, then: The Kitsune get a new colony, Lumia gets more followers from the druids that lost their religion (at least some of them will convert, probably), and Velun... well... he kinda gets screwed a bit in this deal, but he's a part of the pantheon, so sometimes you gotta take one for the team. The Old Wyld dying removes competition from the overall god-game thing.

Less "taking one for the team" and more Keros asking for forgiveness rather than permission. I don't know if the Old Wyld count as gods or more like spirits in harmony. And I doubt Lumia's getting new followers. The druids aren't immediately living in the city and there's a lot of bad blood still. Elthara's apologist behaviour for Aetheldred's BS and pushiness won't help. At best, they'll coexist. At worse it'll be Schism 2: Forest Boogaloo.

As for the whole equivalent exchange thing, I'm sure it can be justified somehow. The plants are still alive, they're just fox plants now, or something. idk.

That still sounds like a recipe for the formation of the Anti-Floof Forces. If it continues, then the tree may become noticeable and end up on everyone's shit list. Or maybe it has a set range on its death field and will just make people uncomfortable. It better. I've helped Orlaith make too many deer babe seeds to risk their wellbeing. The forest must grow for my tree children and the dommy deer mommy.

I'd say it's more than just probable, considering she was probably reading smut when you met her in Mallach's Dream... if her reaction to seeing you there and haste to conceal her reading material is any indication.

I'm shocked that you would accuse good, wholesome Nareva of reading smut. Next you'll be claiming she's doing something perverted like holding hands and cuddling with someone she loves. She was definitely just reading a book on the art of math and magic and not reading kinky fan-fic Mallach has written about his favorite mortals and Rivers.

 

[The Observer]

The Old Wyld is not a god per se, but a collective name for various pagan animistic spirits of widely varying forms and degrees of power. In D&D terms, they might rise to the degree of a warlock patron at best, like the original concept of the Fey Queen that got vanished when that writer ghosted. Many of their "gods" are gods inasmuch as an occasionally helpful kitchen brownie or local earth spirit is one.

Mortals do what they're going to do. Mallach implies that Cait's temple is in part a beachhead for expanding his influence into this portion of the world and Lumia doesn't have much cause to complain if he's not overtly helping them with direct intervention.

 

[Karamaru]

On the topic of the seven, wouldn't Velun be pissed that the kitsune tree is apparently affecting the forest? It's implied that their tree is what's killing the Old Wyld and creating a deadzone in the area the dryads mention. Although the dryads could be sensing the corrupted glade, I think that dialogue appearing regardless of the resolution of the Alraune means they're feeling the kitsune tree. Even though Velun doesn't rule it, I'd imagine the well being of the Old Wyld would still fall under his portfolio and he'd at least be concerned for the deer babes. The floofs may not fully realize it, but it seems they simply can't coexist with the forest they're in. But thinking this has got me wondering. If members of the seven have their domain/portfolio/fetish clash and contradict, what happens? Keros seems pretty interested in the colonies working out it seems so I doubt he'd pack up his fluff weebs and take them home. Would Keros and Velun fight? Would they send champions to fend off the other's efforts? If the kitsune's tree is an actual threat though, then doesn't that fly in the face of Keros's whole equivalent exchange? If the tree is draining life from the forest to sustain itself and house the kitsune but they also aren't benefiting the forest or its residents, wouldn't that violate Keros's own laws? Can the tree give back or form a symbiotic relationship with the forest instead of being parasitic? And if not, wouldn't most unite to attack the Kitsune to protect their natural resources and culture? Head empty from too much questions. No thoughts, put all in text. Read HMGBAPS. It good.

I don't know if the public build has the crowning of the champion of Hawkthrone yet.

Spoiler

but after talking to Carmen I might suspect that Evergreen is behind it. Carmen reveals they were both students of Komari at one point but left her tutelage because of differences in opinions. And reveals that Evergreen is into some major dark stuff other than getting stuffed.

Less "taking one for the team" and more Keros asking for forgiveness rather than permission. I don't know if the Old Wyld count as gods or more like spirits in harmony. And I doubt Lumia's getting new followers. The druids aren't immediately living in the city and there's a lot of bad blood still. Elthara's apologist behaviour for Aetheldred's BS and pushiness won't help. At best, they'll coexist. At worse it'll be Schism 2: Forest Boogaloo.

If the Champ or Etheryn don't intervene and start a dialogue, it will be a problem probably somewhere down the line. And if the Champ becomes a vassal of the winter city, the foxes will be be even more boxed in.

That still sounds like a recipe for the formation of the Anti-Floof Forces. If it continues, then the tree may become noticeable and end up on everyone's shit list. Or maybe it has a set range on its death field and will just make people uncomfortable.

The foxes are pretty much already on everyone's shit list that know they exist it's probably why they are so paranoid of outsiders. And that nobody noticed the giant pink blossom tree in the middle of the woods is still hilarious to me.
With the Champ marrying Kiyoko or become the champion of Keros, it will hopefully help to create a peaceful relation between the foxes and the other races of the Marches.

The Old Wyld is not a god per se, but a collective name for various pagan animistic spirits of widely varying forms and degrees of power. In D&D terms, they might rise to the degree of a warlock patron at best, like the original concept of the Fey Queen that got vanished when that writer ghosted. Many of their "gods" are gods inasmuch as an occasionally helpful kitchen brownie or local earth spirit is one.

Mortals do what they're going to do. Mallach implies that Cait's temple is in part a beachhead for expanding his influence into this portion of the world and Lumia doesn't have much cause to complain if he's not overtly helping them with direct intervention.

That's too bad would have been interesting to see differences in spirituality and what effects the seven have on other so-called "deity" like creatures of the old world.

 

[Starstruck]

If the Champ or Etheryn don't intervene and start a dialogue, it will be a probably problem somewhere down the line. And if the Champ becomes a vassal of the winter city, the foxes will be be even more boxed in.

That depends on how influential the Champion is in either or both of the communities tbh, and on how far the borders of their lorded lands extends if they are a Winter City vassal.

My Champion of Keros also happens to be a Marcher-Baroness of the Winter City, and I like to imagine she as such would as such have enough clout with both peoples to act as something of an intermediary between the Boer'alvar and the Foxen, and if the tree is within the borders of her lands, she could take them under her protective aegis as citizens of her lands. At least such was my reasoning when I accepted the vassalage.

 

[Karamaru]

That depends on how influential the Champion is in either or both of the communities tbh, and on how far the borders of their lorded lands extends if they are a Winter City vassal.

My Champion of Keros also happens to be a Marcher-Baroness of the Winter City, and I like to imagine she could and would act as something of an intermediary between the Boer'alvar and the Foxen, and if the tree is within the borders of her lands, she could take them under her protective aegis as citizens of her lands. At least such was my reasoning when I accepted the vassalage.

I had similar reasons for accepting the vassalage to protect the foxes and my floof children and our den and though I highly doubt I have much of a voice in the Fox community as a human and consort, I'd probably be able to advise Kiyoko and Komari but that's probably as far as my influence goes as a simple consort and husband.

The Champion of Keros probably has more of a voice, but I don't know how high the champion of Keros ranks is in Kitsune society.

 

[Starstruck]

The Champion of Keros probably has more of a voice, but I don't know how high the champion of Keros ranks is in Kitsune society.

Quite high I should think, at the very least the Champion of Keros commands nothing but the highest order of respect among the foxen and should be able to bend the ears of many influential people. Though due to the unprecedented nature of the station it's probably more a place of honor than a position with actual authority on official matters, especially where directives from Kitsuhon is concerned

 

[Savin]

I suspect one of the Endings involves Ascension to a god.

It will not. This is not that kind of power fantasy experience.

That still sounds like a recipe for the formation of the Anti-Floof Forces.

That's a very real possibility. Likely highly dependent on the player's actions or lack thereof.

 

[Kizrah]

This is not that kind of power fantasy experience

 

[Wint3rRyd3r]

I don't know if the public build has the crowning of the champion of Hawkthrone yet.

Spoiler

but after talking to Carmen I might suspect that Evergreen is behind it. Carmen reveals they were both students of Komari at one point but left her tutelage because of differences in opinions. And reveals that Evergreen is into some major dark stuff other than getting stuffed.

It do got that crowning. If that's the case then that's one more reason to look forward to the day we get to remove Evergreen for her evil creepy BS. Though I don't know what her motives would be. It's a bit too long a game and gives Komari time to figure it out and stop it. Plus it carries the risk of being discovered and then Evergreen would be on the shit list. And if she wanted to go that far to antagonize Komari, why not just blame the kitsune for something serious or hire mercenaries to burn the tree and make them run back home? I don't need more reasons to hate Evergreen. I already put her in the same camp as Badger.

If the Champ or Etheryn don't intervene and start a dialogue, it will be a problem probably somewhere down the line. And if the Champ becomes a vassal of the winter city, the foxes will be be even more boxed in.

The foxes are pretty much already on everyone's shit list that know they exist it's probably why they are so paranoid of outsiders.

The foxes will keep getting boxed in if they continue their extreme isolationism. Their refusal and aversion to having any interaction with others and not stopping that group wandering the frostwood from attacking people will only continue to make their situation worse. Carmen already hired bandits thieves idiots mercenaries to deal with the harpies and orcs. If the Kitsune keep it up, they'll be lumped in with them and the Winter City will want to deal with them. Especially if trade finally starts back up and that group of floofs attack caravans. It's not handholding if Keros tells them to remove their heads from their communal asses and at least try not to antagonize others. In short they're on everyone's shit list because to everyone who isn't the player, they act like every other hostile bandit group outside of the towns and their outsider paranoia will only make their situation worse.

 

[LonelyHydra]

It will not. This is not that kind of power fantasy experience.

Oh no, that's right. I hope my reasoning is still valid.

It IS hard not to be told on how special the Champion is, and not have them develop a god complex. If being successful at it would be a different story you want to tell, there may be room for a more "lore-friendly" Bad End where they try but fail in a burst of glory.

Especially if you tease the reader with it until the end.

 

[Greyfox643]

Oh no, that's right. I hope my reasoning is still valid.

It IS hard not to be told on how special the Champion is, and not have them develop a god complex. If being successful at it would be a different story you want to tell, there may be room for a more "lore-friendly" Bad End where they try but fail in a burst of glory.

Especially if you tease the reader with it until the end.

I mean, considering the only way (afaik, from Mirrors) to ascend yo godhood would involve near-genocide levels of death and soul consumption, I think even ATTEMPTING such a thing would get the PC killed almost immediately. Eleven if you take no deals, Keros, The Baroness, Mallach, Lumia, Nevy-boo, and Kas all have their eyes on the PC.

Kas may not recognize the significance of their "Pure Soul" going off the deep end, but you best your [Preferred Tail of Choice] off your ass that the 7 DEFINITELY would, and would immediately act to stop it.

 

[Gothic Purple Goblin]

"Nevy-boo" needs to get more than just her eyes on the pc cough. Ahem but yea as the 7 are concerned I see them as separate entities from the wraiths they were. Feels like comparing ebola to a child.

 

[Lone Wolf115]

I thought about making a thread called if Kas succeeds but I thought it would go nicely here. Considering this is about their morality.
If Kas actually gets Savara to Mareth were travel takes like 30 minutes and kids are teenagers within weeks or days and defeats the seven she won't get souls from them unlike the gods and godesses from Mareth. So what would happen to the seven? Would their old nature come back or would their attitude come back?