Think-tank: Adding new races, TFs and locations to CoC

[Stadler]

Ok, this is an attempt to describe the fur and scales of an eastern type dragon. Please help me improve this:


"While most of your body is covered in [furcolor] fur, your underbelly and the underside of your arms are covered in smooth, magical [underbodycolor] ventral scales."


Notes:
When the skin TFs, their underBody is set to UNDER_BODY_TYPE_EASTERN, their player.skinType is set to SKIN_TYPE_FUR, player.furColor is set to player.skinTone although this would still be under your fur and the underBodyColor is set to the same color, too.
However: You can still color these three parts differently later, An eastern dragon, with e. g. purple fur, green scales on their underbody and orange skin under your fur may look awkward, but if player want that, they'll get that. And they should always be able to recolor them to a single color. So I guess, I have to work on finalizing new rathazul skin oils, too later in my mod.


Code to give you an example, how their 'skinType' TF could go at the end:

if (player.underBodyType != UNDER_BODY_TYPE_EASTERN /* ... */) {
	if (skinType != SKIN_TYPE_FUR) outputText("blah");
	// [...] and so on
	player.skinType = SKIN_TYPE_FUR;
	player.underBody = UNDER_BODY_TYPE_EASTERN;
	player.skinTone = RandomChoice(['yellow', 'orange', 'green', 'red', 'whatever', 'these are just examples!!!']);
	player.furColor = player.skinTone;
	player.underBodyColor = player.skinTone; // Don't wanna chain assignments here. Would look a bit confusing/cluttered to me.
	changes++; // counts as one change, since this actually changes skinFurScales for your whole body.
}

 

[Ormael]

@Stadler Umm yeah I jsut pointed any possible future races that could use this too. As for existing ones...ahh well you got me here with salmanders. BUt still Lizans seems to be much more similar to dragons so they could have it. Now that you meantioned dracolisks I pondering if basilisks won't be bordeling fitting here. They DO exist already ingame but PC so far not have chance to transform into them (I not recall any mod having already finished basilisk TF).

 

[Stadler]

Dunno, if this deserves a new thread, but I plan to rework reptilum TF a little. I relaized, that it has a big bottleneck. Just look at the Reptilum TF table and especially at the stat changes and the changelimit rolls. If you do the math you should realize, that the chance is high, that you have stat changes only and have to drink many bottles of reptilum to gain all TFs.


One problem is, that stat gains and losses don't take ascension into account, so another thing I plan to implement for reptilum only at first is to add a new method to Creature.as:


public function ascensionFactor(multiplier:Number = 25):Number
{
return newGamePlusMod() * multiplier;
}



Obviously newGamePlusMod() has to be moved from Player.as to Creature.as


What I intend to do:

• Chance to have a higher changelimit will be slightly raised (Compare the sheets Old chanelitmit rolls and Proposed changelimit update)
  
• Your speed only gets reduced to 100 for example if you've ascended two times.
  
• Sensitivity will probably be reduced faster, if it has higher values. e.g. if (sens >= 70) sens -= 4, if (sens >= 50) sens -= 3, if (sens >= 35) sens -= 2 and the usual if (sens > 20) sens--
  

I don't want to make it super fast, but it took too long and used too many reptiliums before I started improving the transformation and with the new bodyparts, like the tongue, arms+claws and the eyes it takes even longer. In other words: I intend to make it slightly faster.


Oh and don't go into assumptions. I intend to branch that off from CoC Revamp and merge this into my dragon mod later.

 

[Ormael]

Well I not sure how it would be in future but kitteh planned to rework ascension so it may by then been some changes to PC stats changes in each new NG+ or higher. I would say orginaly in vanilla CoC stats was 1-100 and all TF was acting like it was always 100. Well with revamp and xianxia pc can go really high in stats out of combat too (since in combat spells can boost tempoaly stats).


So instead of put this change you say maybe think about changes in way I though to approach (which as usual is put under pile of other more needed changes). Make stat changes check current max stat value and then change stat if it within % range of change. Well that too veiled so I make example that make clear. Let say some TF atm checking if PC speed is below 70 and if it's then adds 1 point to it. With mod changes PC can easy get like 200 base speed so that mean after getting 70+ speed that TF effect not gonna work. But with change I talking about game would be ooking if PC speed is atm below not 70 but 70% of current max speed so in this case 140. And if it's below 140 it will trigger stat change.

 

[Stadler]

Well I not sure how it would be in future but kitteh planned to rework ascension so it may by then been some changes to PC stats changes in each new NG+ or higher. I would say orginaly in vanilla CoC stats was 1-100 and all TF was acting like it was always 100. Well with revamp and xianxia pc can go really high in stats out of combat too (since in combat spells can boost tempoaly stats).

Yeah, plans ... Actually I plan to this now rather than muuuch later. Anyway: ascensionFactor() would be a good start to modify more TFs in terms of stats to take player ascension into account.

So instead of put this change you say maybe think about changes in way I though to approach (which as usual is put under pile of other more needed changes). Make stat changes check current max stat value and then change stat if it within % range of change. Well that too veiled so I make example that make clear. Let say some TF atm checking if PC speed is below 70 and if it's then adds 1 point to it. With mod changes PC can easy get like 200 base speed so that mean after getting 70+ speed that TF effect not gonna work. But with change I talking about game would be ooking if PC speed is atm below not 70 but 70% of current max speed so in this case 140. And if it's below 140 it will trigger stat change.

Nope, using max stat value is a bad idea. Note, that monsters get +25 per ascension to all max stats and players get +25 per ascension.
And using percentages for these calculations is even worse. Maybe its because I'm playing pen&paper RPGs to for almost 20 years now, but you should never be required to get a calculator to calc stat changes. And I don't intend to make coders or players to look on graphs to see, how their TFs would alter their stats. Do you want to work out curve graphs and complex mathematic formulas  to finetune stat gains and losses? I doubt that.

 

[Ormael]

Nope, using max stat value is a bad idea. Note, that monsters get +25 per ascension to all max stats and players get +25 per ascension.
And using percentages for these calculations is even worse. Maybe its because I'm playing pen&paper RPGs to for almost 20 years now, but you should never be required to get a calculator to calc stat changes. And I don't intend to make coders or players to look on graphs to see, how their TFs would alter their stats. Do you want to work out curve graphs and complex mathematic formulas  to finetune stat gains and losses? I doubt that.

Well not know how Kitteh will change it but my quite fast aproaching ascension rework in Xianxia will totaly cut out +25 to stats by moving to next tier of NG+. It's...just not best soultion. Putting under the same stat grow for all monsters across the game leads to some weak ones been massively buffed between each NG tier while those on endgame are...barely different. Simple case of imp lvl 1 and then Lethice. Ip with +25 stats will be much tougher to fight than Lethice that will be slight harder as having already high base stats in NG. Not know even if Revamp of it will keep also PC getting max stats +25... I think it would be made into perk that rise them by 5 points for each new rank in this ascensin perk. So it's about if you not work now hard and do all on account PC and monsters will be always getting +25 stats in each new NG+ and also monsters getting +30 lvl's while PC keep leveling higher or gamble and prepare for possible changes of those in Revamp in future.


About complicated mathematical formulas...en I though if it work replacing flat value for ex. 70 with 0.7 * max(name of stat) would be still simple and do it work. But that I will know if it not blow up whole code when I do it and test.

 

[Stadler]

Uhm, we're getting slightly off topic here. I'm talking about widening a bottleneck of a single TF for now. We could later pimp more transformations that have a similar bottleneck but AFAICS reptilum has the thinnest bottleneck. I have a savegame, that only lacks the dragon claws to lizard claws transition and the tongue from reptilum TFs and if I'm out of luck it takes 10+ reptilum to gain both of them. And for starters I'd go for speed reduced to 50 + times_ascended*25 the other stats just have to raise or fall a bit faster and changelimit should be raised slightly.


Sorry, I don't intend to turn the ascension-system and stat gains upside down to rework the system 'almost' from scratch. This is probably for mid to long term.


To get back off topic:
First off, you can't raise your speed cept using stored stat points from leveling. No running laps in the gym. No running laps around your camp and no Agility tincture from Giacomo so I'll stick with speed -= 1 for reptilum for now.
Another thing about leveling up is, that at some point, especially if you maxed out all 4 base stats leveling up is nearly pointless IMHO since you're only stockpiling more stat points and get +15 max HP per level.

 

[Liadri]

Im currently seriously considering writing Nekomata as a tf revamping tanuki and making catgirl and raccoon girl something


Ill also see if i can add a Odanata/full dragonfly tf to the game expending upon trap oil

 

[Stadler]

Im currently seriously considering writing Nekomata as a tf revamping tanuki and making catgirl and raccoon girl something

Had to google for a MGE pic of it: http://monstergirlencyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Nekomata


In other words, you intend to implement a monster-girl/-boy alternative for cat-tf? Well, sounds neat, but that would probably require a new set of NPCs (and monsters?) and a new transformative, since cat girl would be basiclally a cat TF with less fur, I assume? Would be nice, if you'd start a new thread or better: a google doc about this and link us to it.

Ill also see if i can add a Odanata/full dragonfly tf to the game expending upon trap oil

In other words a non-MGE TF? with skinType == SKIN_TYPE_INSECT_CARAPACE (won't be just SKIN_TYPE_CARAPACE, since there are different flavors of carapace e. g. for crabs with their thick and hard shell)

 

[Ormael]

I been giving lately some thoughts about nekomanta. Well technicaly easiest way is to recycle whole cat-morph code of Tf with adding chance to trigger additional tail grow. But I though about making some additional physical changes some along lines making nekomants more...feral cat-like than casual cat-morphs. And ofc giving them ice magic ^^

 

[Liadri]

Werent nekomata fire user who delighted in arson? And no im realy talking about the classic nekomata yokai wich existed since way before mge. Althrough yea you could be a nekomata witheout the cat fur and face to. Essantialy a nekomata is a large cat with two tail standing on its hindleg its suposed to be very fond of fireballing people and as general rule quite larger then normal cats


http://yokai.com/nekomata 

 

[Ormael]

Eh so many races got affinity to fire :/ And not recal any cool one that got one for ice...well yuki onna is interesting but that just one and they naturaly are all females so hard to make on this race with both genders.

 

[Liadri]

Ice? Fenrir would.


just make a very large hellish looking frost wolf  with a breath that freeze foe solid and youl have it. (Yea dogs...) could also be a new encounter in Glacial rift.


if you want me writing fenrir i could


main addition involve wolf paw/icy back spikes/ glowing blue eyes/wolf maw (ice bite)/ wolf tail a severe increase in size to up to 10 feet/ a pelt jagged with ice shards and a deadly ice breath causing ennemy hits to be frozen solid for a few rounds (similar to dragon with a huge cooldown instead of a daily use)


additionnaly this tf could be tied to a spiked collar with a large chain (lost collar of Fenrir) as a requierment to finish. Likely some sweird ritual to a slain evil deity of mareth.the collar itself is an accessory that cannot be removed when worn.


yea its on im writing this thing!


tf part done but ill have to do the collar as well as battle text and description in charview screen

 

[Ormael]

We got more than few fire races but since I made ice as other element relevant it should be somehow get something related to it from new races concept thread. Well seen how you get worked up there Liadri I would gladly give you green light to write it. Well sue gargoyle gdoc for now


Now I hope some not half bad idea for another ice-themed race bloom in this thread in near(er) future ^^

 

[Liadri]

Im more then pumped up about it im blasting like a meteor xD

 

[Ormael]

*put on anti-meteor helmet* Bring it on


Anyway due to certain stars coniugations and changes in some threads on forum I could say in next few weeks I would do some work to make some of ideas from this thread into reality of Xianxia mod xD

 

[Liadri]

Sent you a share on gdoc ormael for some silly reason i can't post sites link on my phone its stupid.


The fenrir tf will be obtainable using the chilly pepper dropped by winter wolves in Glacial Rifts. Winter wolves will be similar to hell hounds albeith having but a single head and breathing ice


Well Savin seems to disagrea new tf should have their own discution page so that chat exclusively talk about said tf and not out of topic stuff. Well regardless ill be posting the doc here

 

[Ormael]

yeah i think posting link here would be more safe. Would look on this gdoc after this Hexakill amtch...I promise *cross fingers ^^*

 

[Liadri]

Fenrir TF


https://docs.google.com/document/d/19uchzhofolix9hCYmt4bWxqMMZzrfeX62LiNyeeKReo/edit?usp=sharing

 

[Ormael]

Oh my seems I will reconsider much about actualy adding more than I planned for 0.7c seeing this gdoc ^^


Also well since that thread is about races I would say about plans of mine to include Hobgoblins. Found anywhere where goblins would show up normaly and as race name suggest been better and in theory more dangerous version of typical goblin (but not like mge suggesting more dumb than goblin... they would have similar if not tiny higher inteligence than their smaller green-skinned sisters - smaller since typical hobgoblin I would say would be size of normal human with all body proportions scalled up to their new height ).

 

[Stadler]

Fenrir TF


https://docs.google.com/document/d/19uchzhofolix9hCYmt4bWxqMMZzrfeX62LiNyeeKReo/edit?usp=sharing

Ok, added that to the top of the list:

• Fenrir (TF and race)
  
  
  Idea: @Liadri
  
• Google docs document: Fenrir Tf (Chilly Pepper)
  

 

[Liadri]

Back for more im currently working on adding the Winter Wolf encounter

 

[Liadri]

Tf finished only needs to be coded now lol

 

[ThatPeon]

Can people who have no coding experience have a say in this?

 

[Liadri]

yea what is your say?

 

[ThatOneJester]

I can think of 3 on the spot.


1. A female version of the Imp.


2. A Cyclops.


3. A male Bear-Morph.


Since I'm tired as all hell, I can't think of locations really.


Maybe a place in the sky???


Or that underwater place that never went anywhere a long time ago, in the last forums before they were taken down.

 

[Stadler]

Or that underwater place that never went anywhere a long time ago, in the last forums before they were taken down.

Do you mean something, like this: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Fq9zjXPIBbMA1a_1Le4OCRWF2kLiQ4JTxV3mQpV6kGo/edit#heading=h.p6ivxbpt64bi?

Tf finished only needs to be coded now lol

For the Back spike TF I'd suggest to use the following I've implemented for my dragon mod:


// rearBody
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_NONE:int = 0;
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_DRACONIC_MANE:int = 1;
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_DRACONIC_SPIKES:int = 2;
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_BEHEMOTH:int = 3; // NYI, Its just there as an example.


and I suggest you or Ormael to name it:
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_FENRIR:int = 3;
would replace REAR_BODY_TYPE_BEHEMOTH or course. Its NYI anyway.


The property name is rearBody and I assume, that its irreversible once you put on the collar and if you lost the spikes for whatever reason they'll regrow in a player event aka time passing ingame, right?


If you or Ormael need more details, please tell me. I'd look forward to have one more reason to introduce this body-part.


[Edit:] Found a pic on dA: http://chaos-draco.deviantart.com/art/Fenrir-305143796
Is this the pic, that inspired you?

 

[Ormael]

Cool pic you found there Stadler.


And as it's now - well you can also see it in this gdoc that is linked to fenrir/winter wolf that this back stuff will be taking wing slot. Well at least now it's set to be using wing slot not rear slot. So any changes to this matter aren't mine to do but up to Liadri decision.


Ohh and later on today I would paste my proposition of beach discovery scene to beach/ocean gdoc for you to look over it. Probably would put if it not yet some enemy enc I would plan to have there n Xinxia mod (with note it's for xianxia mod so noone should think it will be also happening in revamp).


ANyway some other randomn thing I hope you not mind I ask: Does rear body part could work with kraken 'hood'? I mean this thing she got on rear of her head that Liadri calling as hood ^^ I know that to make scylla and kraken futher different outside 2 more tentalegs this body part would be also needed but...I still had trouble which body type put it in? on head it not fall under ear part andnot much sense for horns or antenne slot. So somehow I got this wild idea now if it maybe fall under rear body section you included recently.

 

[Liadri]

Do you mean something, like this: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Fq9zjXPIBbMA1a_1Le4OCRWF2kLiQ4JTxV3mQpV6kGo/edit#heading=h.p6ivxbpt64bi?


For the Back spike TF I'd suggest to use the following I've implemented for my dragon mod:




// rearBody
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_NONE:int = 0;
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_DRACONIC_MANE:int = 1;
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_DRACONIC_SPIKES:int = 2;
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_BEHEMOTH:int = 3; // NYI, Its just there as an example.


and I suggest you or Ormael to name it:
public static const REAR_BODY_TYPE_FENRIR:int = 3;
would replace REAR_BODY_TYPE_BEHEMOTH or course. Its NYI anyway.


The property name is rearBody and I assume, that its irreversible once you put on the collar and if you lost the spikes for whatever reason they'll regrow in a player event aka time passing ingame, right?


If you or Ormael need more details, please tell me. I'd look forward to have one more reason to introduce this body-part.


[Edit:] Found a pic on dA: http://chaos-draco.deviantart.com/art/Fenrir-305143796
Is this the pic, that inspired you?

Can people who have no coding experience have a say in this?

I indeed got inspired by this pic and few animes/game where fenrir is featured as THE ice wolf


as for back slot. truthfully i only copied the idea from shark morph. I never liked the fact shark couldnt get wing and back piece at the same time either but that was how CoC was coded so i dealth with it and tried to make fenrir simple. If you want to add a back slot option go ahead.

 

[NamelessandAccursed]

Obviously new here as I just made an account. But I had a question that I am not sure was ever really answered. If I write up a new transformation item+race descriptions ect using others as a template to ensure I provide all the necessary information would people be willing to do the coding portion to add it in? I have approximately no experience with coding so I doubt I could write the code to add something myself. Thanks in advance for the answer.