Razorcup nectar buff being temporary is really lame

[erectorz]

If it's going to only last 24 hours i'd prefer the experience because at least that is useful early game. Best case scenario now you can use razorcup nectar for some really hard fights since it offers such a powerful boon. But its really really lame that for such a rare item you get to basically use another alcohol buff(obviously the nectar is stronger but alcohol is much easier to grab). The way it was worded in the changelog I thought for sure it would be a permanent buff and am pretty disappointed that it lasts such a short time.

I doubt that they will change it but a small buff like 5 Accuracy, 5 Attack/spell/sexiness would be really cool and rewarding but make it a perk so that you cannot stack if off kohaku. Potentially make it apply to only one person so that you have a reason to hunt for it?

Idk I greatly prefer the xp to this buff since at least with that you could hit power spikes faster but the new nectar falls into the save it and never use it territory. How do you guys feel about the change?

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

I prefer it being actually anything to what it was before. Ever since the update that makes all companions share the same xp, I never had use for the stuff. I was always max level before getting my hands on one. We don't hace any other items that offer such a small, intense boost. It fills that role now.
Perfect for dungeons! For the Way Walker on the go!

 

[erectorz]

You get one from arona, from gytha and a third I can't remember from where. I agree that by the time you are doing winter city there is a good chance you are level 6 and a smaller chance you are level 7. But I can't imagine being level 7 by the time you finish arona unless you are seriously putting her off.

I agree that with the level 6 cap they felt really useless but at 7 I can see myself actually using them.

Tbf I restart basically everytime there is a major patch so that might bias me towards exp a resource that has no use when you hit the cap.

 

[WolframL]

Um, you know that the content doesn't change so much patch to patch that you're really going to gain anything by restarting the entire game, right? Especially early-game content. The only thing we know is coming that might make a full restart worthwhile is going to be Tychris since that (eventually) will lead to Nareva's soulbind option and is implied to be something doable in Act 1.

Otherwise what was already said; the change to leveling means that you're going to hit the cap pretty easily before it becomes relevant and you only need to worry about one person instead of cycling through your entire companion roster to make sure everyone gets what they need, so a huge EXP influx isn't all that useful but a boon that lasts a whole day and affects multiple stats certainly is.

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

Your right, I do put off Arona for quite a while. There are other things higher on my priority list, but that's not the point. Even if I didn't I'd only get to use maybe one, and you get several. Not counting the special deal you get from kohaku from time to time.
It being a super buff means it's an item I actually desire now, as opposed to something that will save me twenty minutes of grinding. That's if I don't achieve max level simply by completing quests like normal. I don't think we need an xp item, and the new nectar fills a nice niche now that we didn't have before.

 

[erectorz]

Um, you know that the content doesn't change so much patch to patch that you're really going to gain anything by restarting the entire game, right? Especially early-game content. The only thing we know is coming that might make a full restart worthwhile is going to be Tychris since that (eventually) will lead to Nareva's soulbind option and is implied to be something doable in Act 1.

Otherwise what was already said; the change to leveling means that you're going to hit the cap pretty easily before it becomes relevant and you only need to worry about one person instead of cycling through your entire companion roster to make sure everyone gets what they need, so a huge EXP influx isn't all that useful but a boon that lasts a whole day and affects multiple stats certainly is.

I basically play this game like twice a year? Essentially when a really big update drops and I enjoy starting from fresh vs just hunting the new content and then having nothing else to do, I'm probably in the minority there but its just what I like to do.

The new razorcup nectar is more useful for like 90% of players since I doubt people restart as much as I do. But my main point is that it is really lame that such a rare item is essentially just another alcohol buff. Absolutely the new nectar has its use cases and is always useful item now vs the past where it was only useful for a short period, I just think its a really boring item. Especially since you can use things like napatha and those other boosts before combat, having a super rare item like nectar being in the same category as that doesn't feel rewarding for how few of them you get.

 

[Ossa]

I do the same thing, erectorz; I just hit level 5 on a fresh save, about to head towards Winter City over the next couple days. That said, I'm also noting that it is hilariously easy to overlevel for content as things currently are. I feel no less with the razorcup changes, and am anticipating breaking those out for hard content later.

 

[Baggrin]

Well, I wouldn't call the new effect lame.
Somewhat weak for such a rare item, for my taste, but not frankly lame:
1. This Boon affects the whole party at once. Just in case, let me remind you that before that there were only 4 Boons that affected the entire party at once, and three of them increased Willpower.
2. This is a portable Boon that you can use, for example, to strengthen the guest character that joined you after entering the dungeon. Or if you explored the dungeon for too long and your Boon expired.
3. This is a very versatile Boon. No matter what your stats are, no matter who your teammates are, this Boon will be useful to any character, even if this character has the stats they need are capped. Personally, by the way, the main advantage of this Boon would not be an increase in your attacking stats, but an Accuracy bonus.
4. In any case, the old effect was of limited use, and since version 0.5.0 it has become almost useless, so I personally like the new effect much more than the old one. Yes, as I said, the effect is a bit weak in my opinion, but when was I really happy with the changes in game mechanics? Approximately never, because in addition to positive changes, I also constantly saw something that made me sad. So, for example, I'm not a fan of cutting the Resolve mechanics, also on this occasion I would notice that the UI without the Resolve bar began to look somewhat ugly.

 

[erectorz]

Well, I wouldn't call the new effect lame.
Somewhat weak for such a rare item, for my taste, but not frankly lame:
1. This Boon affects the whole party at once. Just in case, let me remind you that before that there were only 4 Boons that affected the entire party at once, and three of them increased Willpower.
2. This is a portable Boon that you can use, for example, to strengthen the guest character that joined you after entering the dungeon. Or if you explored the dungeon for too long and your Boon expired.
3. This is a very versatile Boon. No matter what your stats are, no matter who your teammates are, this Boon will be useful to any character, even if this character has the stats they need are capped. Personally, by the way, the main advantage of this Boon would not be an increase in your attacking stats, but an Accuracy bonus.
4. In any case, the old effect was of limited use, and since version 0.5.0 it has become almost useless, so I personally like the new effect much more than the old one. Yes, as I said, the effect is a bit weak in my opinion, but when was I really happy with the changes in game mechanics? Approximately never, because in addition to positive changes, I also constantly saw something that made me sad. So, for example, I'm not a fan of cutting the Resolve mechanics, also on this occasion I would notice that the UI without the Resolve bar began to look somewhat ugly.

Idk how to feel about cutting resolve, on the one hand it made the companions much more streamlined, you don't got to worry about hitting both ends of the spectrum anymore and this allows more flexibility in team composition. On the other hand one thing i really loved about coc 1 is how lust tied in with the sex, some times you were finna bust and if you didnt sex the enemies you could lose. Giving in to your urges felt like it stemmed from corruption now it just seems like every one is just a r@pe machine and even morally good pcs don't have much qualms about forcing themselves on people.

 

[Boshe]

I'd prefer it being an instant level-up as soon as you reach Gytha, that was my ticket to level 6 on day 5, but I'm fine with it being a 24hr boon. What I'm not fine is how weak the effect itself is. Garth is selling far more impactful stuff than that for 10EC and this thing not only costs thousands but competes for the same slot as maxing out Presence/Willpower/Strength?

HARD PASS

And yes, I'm aware that it's party-wide, that doesn't exonerate it in the slightest.

 

[Baggrin]

What I'm not fine is how weak the effect itself is.

You know, I have a lot of complaints about the developers (if you want, you can find my old topic where I expressed my indignation at the transfer of Vitality Reap from level 4 to level 6, without increasing the damage, by the way), but... I would not call this Boon weak. Yes, I would like this rare item to be stronger, but in general it is an adequate boon even for a character with level 10 (in total +95 to your statistics against +63 to one offensive stat and total +42 to two other stats due to the capped attribute ).

Garth is selling far more impactful stuff than that for 10EC and this thing not only costs thousands but competes for the same slot as maxing out Presence/Willpower/Strength?

As I said earlier (ok, I didn't say it directly, but I obviously meant it), you cannot carry Garth with you, in the dungeon/far from the city, only Bento Box and Pupper Pale Ale are available to you.
Let me remind you that you can get the first one only once every three days, the second costs 750 EC plus, for my taste, the place of purchase is too far away for regular visits (that's why I bought this ale only once or twice in all my time with the game ).

And yes, I'm aware that it's party-wide, that doesn't exonerate it in the slightest.

Until recently, offensive party-wide boons were only represented by a bonus to willpower... while casters usually have capped willpower, or at least close to it, so party-wide willpower boon is unfortunately not very useful as an offensive bonus.
Thus, Razorcup nectar's offensive stats buff isn't bad at all, even if you forget the Accuracy bonus (which is very useful on its own due to some companions' lack of accuracy).

Razorcup nectar also increases Evasion, but I don't have much respect for this stat (because it doesn't protect me from the most annoying enemy attacks), so I won't explain to you how useful this bonus can be for characters with Evasion builds.


P.S. By the way, are there any registered on the Wiki? I noticed an error on the Weapons page: in the "Offhand" section, the "Unique" tag is mistakenly listed for Fox Jewel instead of Fire Jade.

 

[Boshe]

in total +95 to your statistics against +63 to one offensive stat and total +42

Total bonuses are irrelevant to the discussion of optimization if the bonuses they give are ones you are not going to utilize. Accuracy grows out of its usefulness very quick, as for the other stats, I have my doubts that builds utilizing all three of them are going to be particularly optimized and even for those that use two out of three (spellblades, basically) you're likely better off getting the Willpower boon.

Also, I'm not sure if Leadership actually works as I don't believe it changes character sheets or tooltips, but I'm pretty sure each point of Leadership on the PC is meant to give a corresponding bonus to AP, SP and Sexiness, which might make the Presence boon stronger through both "total stats" and actual effectiveness, especially with the Guldring or summons like Biggus Piggus.

you cannot carry Garth with you, in the dungeon/far from the city

If you didn't bother to Ember back to town to get a boon, then you didn't need the boon. Outside of that, Garth not being very mobile is only an issue in a handful of scenarios, the only of which that jumps to mind is RQ2 and Bento is likely to win here, due to spellblades being too MAD. Lightsaber quest won't even let you use a razorcup.

Also, you forgot about Bacon, though Toughness is a joke of a stat.

Until recently, offensive party-wide boons were only represented by a bonus to willpower... while casters usually have capped willpower, or at least close to it, so party-wide willpower boon is unfortunately not very useful as an offensive bonus.

While true, that's honestly more on the fact there aren't better group boons. The concept of maxing out a single primary stat is stronger than a bunch of universal bonuses. Master of none and all that skid.

Razorcup nectar also increases Evasion, but I don't have much respect for this stat (because it doesn't protect me from the most annoying enemy attacks), so I won't explain to you how useful this bonus can be for characters with Evasion builds.

Funnily enough, I have the most respect for Evasion bonus out of them all, even if I don't really care for stacking it. I don't know much about building into Evasion, but it sounds like it's the only thing out of that entire bonus list that could truly make or break some fights for some people. If I wouldn't have known better about offense being the best defense, it could've even changed my mind about new razorcup.

 

[CourtOfTheGrayWaves]

Wait, wait, wait...So...No more insta-level up just add sleep?

 

[WolframL]

No. Bear in mind that this has been in the cards for a long while. The removal of separate EXP for companions means that only one character matters and in the long-term, allowing you to leapfrog three or four levels would completely break the difficulty by the time the game is done. In addition, Old!Razorcup was an item that you'd never need more than four or maybe five of in the completed game because once you hit the max level, it would become completely useless. The devs have to balance things for the long term, not just what would be useful to players in the short term.

 

[CourtOfTheGrayWaves]

No. Bear in mind that this has been in the cards for a long while. The removal of separate EXP for companions means that only one character matters and in the long-term, allowing you to leapfrom three or four levels would completely break the difficulty by the time the game is done. In addition, Old!Razorcup was an item that you'd never need more than maybe five of in the completed game because once you hit the max level, it would become completely useless.

Guess I'll just sell the stuff whenever I get it then.

 

[Boshe]

Guess I'll just sell the stuff whenever I get it then.

That's legitimately the best use for it now.

 

[Baggrin]

Total bonuses are irrelevant to the discussion of optimization if the bonuses they give are ones you are not going to utilize.

This at least gives a general picture, especially since I am not comparing it with the current power of a regular boon, but with its theoretical maximum (I take 32 as the maximum, although somewhere there was a statement that at level 10 the stat limit would be 30).

Accuracy grows out of its usefulness very quick

Tell me, have you ever noticed a Power called the Sure Shot? Its description hints at one interesting point in the game mechanics: excessive accuracy is not a waste, as it is converted into a crit chance (separate check, not bonus to normal crit chance), with an accuracy of 115 (120?) higher than the opponent's evasion, your hits will always be guaranteed crits.

even for those that use two out of three (spellblades, basically) you're likely better off getting the Willpower boon.

Willpower boon will give you +45 SP. Your teammates, as I said, it will give almost nothing, +9 SP at BEST, even with 100 Leadership (80 cap if I'm not mistaken) it will only be +18 SP.
Razorcup nectar will give +25 AP, +25 SP and +10 Accuracy...not just to you, to your entire party.

Also, I'm not sure if Leadership actually works

Leadership gives a +2% bonus to stats per point.
Presence 17 only gives your party +20% of their base stats (compared to Presence 7), not much... but I've noticed that with my Presence 7, even my favorite Etheryn heals much less than I'm used to. So it really does work.

which might make the Presence boon stronger through both "total stats" and actual effectiveness, especially with the Guldring or summons like Biggus Piggus.

Here I will not argue, the high Presence really does miracles ... but:
1. It's up to the build (and the enemy) whether you need more, a bonus to party members of +30% of their base stats, or an additional plus to your own offensive stats.
2. The damage bonus may not be that important when you lack accuracy in order to confidently hit the enemy. What I'm saying is that Presence does not provide an accuracy bonus to your party (only the accuracy of your summons), unlike Razorcup nectar.
By the way, in my opinion, "Biggus Piggus" cannot boast of decent accuracy (mediocre Accuracy 30 with Leadership 75).
I'm not talking about such a possibility as the fact that even without this bonus, your Presence can be capped or close to it.

If you didn't bother to Ember back to town to get a boon, then you didn't need the boon.

Do you really not understand what I mean or are you just deliberately ignoring it? I'm talking about any difficulties with returning to the city, not about desire.
For examle, when you get to the entrance to the dungeon (quest The Ring of Fate, for example) your Rest Bonus may expire or come close to it. You can set up camp right in front of the dungeon entrance and rest... but in this case, your boon may expire.

Also, you forgot about Bacon, though Toughness is a joke of a stat.

I really forgot what it is. Perhaps I never even knew, at least I do not remember at all what item you are talking about.

While true, that's honestly more on the fact there aren't better group boons. The concept of maxing out a single primary stat is stronger than a bunch of universal bonuses.

First, I mentioned above why Razorcup nectar can be better than +1 capped attribute.
Secondly, it affects not only you, but the whole party at once, increasing the power of any of your followers regardless of their build (note: the summoning abilities of your followers are the only exception). Thus, even if your own power drops a little, you can still benefit from stronger allies.

Funnily enough, I have the most respect for Evasion bonus out of them all, even if I don't really care for stacking it.

The problem with Evasion is that it only protects against weapon attacks, which doesn't bother me too much. What REALLY bothers me is things like silences, disarms, knockdowns and stuns... things that physical (sometimes magic) resistance saves from, so (unlike many players) I've never been excited away from Royal Leathers and other high evasion gear, preferring instead Lamellar Armour (which is also good at dampening the hits that landed on me) and other high defense gear.
Fortunately, Equilibrium reliably protects me from disarming and knocking down, problems only start when I want to copy enemy Powers and therefore put Mirror Stanse as my At-will ability.

offense being the best defense

YES! That's why Razorcup nectar is my new favorite boon... or rather it would be if I could buy it regularly.
So it's more of a "hard quest-only" boon than my regular one.

Guess I'll just sell the stuff whenever I get it then.

What to do with this item on you, but I would note that this is a good temporary booster for your entire party at once, and the lower your level, the more noticeable the effect will be.

 

[Boshe]

Tell me, have you ever noticed a Power called the Sure Shot? Its description hints at one interesting point in the game mechanics: excessive accuracy is not a waste, as it is converted into a crit chance (separate check, not bonus to normal crit chance), with an accuracy of 115 (120?) higher than the opponent's evasion, your hits will always be guaranteed crits.

Just tested it out and that explains why I crit so much (all the time) in the endgame. Guess it is useful.

Do you really not understand what I mean or are you just deliberately ignoring it? I'm talking about any difficulties with returning to the city, not about desire.
For examle, when you get to the entrance to the dungeon (quest The Ring of Fate, for example) your Rest Bonus may expire or come close to it. You can set up camp right in front of the dungeon entrance and rest... but in this case, your boon may expire.

I did say that this IS an issue, but only a handful of scenarios, primarily RQ2, as that one spends several days on big boats which gives one ample opportunity to practice sobriety AND actually lets you use a razorcup, as opposed to Lightsaber quest, where you don't get to use your inventory out of combat. Ring of Fate doesn't take that long from what I remember, you should be able to fit in both the rest bonuses and Garth's boons, especially if you don't dally with ending local wildlife for pretty gems for best girls.

First, I mentioned above why Razorcup nectar can be better than +1 capped attribute.

See, the whole point is that an incredibly rare (2-3 instances without Kohaker) and expensive (with, for some, but potentially even without Kohaker, money not made is money lost) buff is still easily beat mathematically by a 10EP mug of beer in a good amount of cases. It shouldn't compete with it, it should be an equivalent of dusting off ye aul turbo-skullsplitter when going after big game.

By the way, just read the title of this thread and got an idea for the buff being actually a permanent +5 to offensive stats, per cup. Obviously would have to confiscate all remaining razorcups from the fox yakuza first.

I really forgot what it is. Perhaps I never even knew, at least I do not remember at all what item you are talking about.

Don't worry, I don't think even SKoW remembers what it is. I remember Tobs admitting to not even knowing about Blank Scroll.

By the way, in my opinion, "Biggus Piggus" cannot boast of decent accuracy (mediocre Accuracy 30 with Leadership 75).

lies and deception (I very rarely use summons as I like nuking things more)

 

[Baggrin]

I did say that this IS an issue, but only a handful of scenarios, primarily RQ2

If I'm not mistaken, there are at least 3 such moments, in addition to RQ2, I also had problems in the RoF quest and when Brint became a winter knight. Also, as I said earlier, it's useful when you want to buff guest party members...

Ring of Fate doesn't take that long from what I remember

As far as I remember, my rest bonus expired around the time of the meeting with tomb robbers.

See, the whole point is that an incredibly rare (2-3 instances without Kohaker)

I have hoarded five or six nectars, but I don't think I bought any of them.

still easily beat mathematically by a 10EP mug of beer in a good amount of cases.

Only at level 10, and only if the attribute limit is 32 (with an attribute limit of 30, it will be a total of +85 stats vs. +95 stats for nectar).
At lower levels, Nectar is one of the best booons available to the player (there are a couple of other options, but I won't give any dev looking in here an idea that might be in dire need of an urgent hit with a nerfhammer), especially since most booons only affects the player character.

it should be an equivalent of dusting off ye aul turbo-skullsplitter

Well, the developers care a lot about such a semi-mythical thing as game balance ... as far as I understand, any super bonuses do not seem to them a great idea, it is much more appropriate to expect from them to nerf something "excessively strong" than to buff something that is on weak side.

idea for the buff being actually a permanent +5 to offensive stats, per cup.

You know, first Corruption of Champions came out, then Trials in Tainted Space, then Corruption of Champions 2...
If you're familiar with all these games and know the differences between them, it's not too hard to see that the developers aren't thrilled with the idea that the difference in stats between two characters of the same level can be huge...
Why am I saying this? Any permanent stat boosters that allow you to match with a higher level character is a big no-no for the devs of C oC 2, they even abandoned their original idea that turning into a kitsune (irreversible transformation!) will give you a bonus to stats (I don’t remember the details, but judging by the words of some developer in one of the old topics, the original plan was to give the kitsune a total of +12 or even +15 to attributes and +50 to blight resistance ).
Infinite stat boosters (even +0.1 to offensive stats, I'm not even talking about +5) are, of course, also non-negotiable.

lies and deception

Of course, you can say that it's a decent number... but in my opinion, it's more on the low side than the average.
Also, a Leadership of 75 is very high, usually my Leadership is something around 50 (I think in this case this boar's Accuracy would be 22 or something like that).

P.S. By the way, I didn't even notice it until I took the screenshots, but my experience reached the cap, very quickly, given the fact that after the level-up I completed it in only four quests or so.
Yeah, the old Razorcap Nectar effect is really obsolete and you can easily do without it...

 

[Boshe]

I have hoarded five or six nectars, but I don't think I bought any of them.

I believe there's only 2-3 of each of the rare consumables so far available through questing/exploration so far.

Only at level 10, and only if the attribute limit is 32 (with an attribute limit of 30, it will be a total of +85 stats vs. +95 stats for nectar).

Again, it does not matter if it gives all three stats, when most use only one and for those that don't a simpler boon would grant an easy 45 against nectar's 25+10. I also don't care for party boons, but this is subjective.

Well, the developers care a lot about such a semi-mythical thing as game balance ... as far as I understand, any super bonuses do not seem to them a great idea, it is much more appropriate to expect from them to nerf something "excessively strong" than to buff something that is on weak side.

Balance should be thrown out the window for something that is meant to be an occasional thing like nectar.

You know, first Corruption of Champions came out, then Trials in Tainted Space, then Corruption of Champions 2...
If you're familiar with all these games and know the differences between them, it's not too hard to see that the developers aren't thrilled with the idea that the difference in stats between two characters of the same level can be huge...
Why am I saying this? Any permanent stat boosters that allow you to match with a higher level character is a big no-no for the devs of C oC 2, they even abandoned their original idea that turning into a kitsune (irreversible transformation!) will give you a bonus to stats (I don’t remember the details, but judging by the words of some developer in one of the old topics, the original plan was to give the kitsune a total of +12 or even +15 to attributes and +50 to blight resistance ).
Infinite stat boosters (even +0.1 to offensive stats, I'm not even talking about +5) are, of course, also non-negotiable.

You misunderstood. I'm talking about making razorcups very finite (3-5) and be distributed evenly across the game's progression (which is actually pretty good as is). They already kind of do what I've tried to outline when you finish Act 1 and get a resolve buff.

Of course, you can say that it's a decent number... but in my opinion, it's more on the low side than the average.

I was joking, I haven't even used it, I don't like summons.

 

[Baggrin]

I believe there's only 2-3 of each of the rare consumables so far available through questing/exploration so far.

I haven't played in over a year, so I could be wrong here, but I would still say it's very unlikely.

boon would grant an easy 45 against nectar's 25+10.

I would say that it is rather 25+25+10. After all, nectar increases both AP and SP.
As for "pure" classes that use only one offensive stat... such characters usually have the main attribute capped or close to it, so a normal boon (unlike nectar) won't do much.

You misunderstood.

My bad. In my defense, I can only say that English is not my native language.

distributed evenly across the game's progression

Well, I could be wrong, but it looks like the only permanent bonuses we can get are only in the mainquest and only at the end of each of the three story arcs. Due to this, I suspect that no other permanent bonuses are planned.

I was joking, I haven't even used it, I don't like summons.

I am also not a big fan of summons due to their uncontrollability and often lack of survivability (however, the latter has lost its relevance since version 0.5.0), but due to the lack of alternatives for a pure caster, sometimes I had to use them.
Therefore, I am very happy that a really powerful (and at the same time versatile) alternative to them has finally appeared...

 

[DB_Cooper]

This whole change was pointless and stupid. The only function was to stroke someone's ego because "change" is exactly the same as "improving" when you're an idiot. Nobody asked for it, but it technically required effort, so it's something for a talentless moron troll to be proud of. You know, of putting in the minimum amount of effort necessary to just piss people off, because that's all they're capable of.

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

This whole change was pointless and stupid. The only function was to stroke someone's ego because "change" is exactly the same as "improving" when you're an idiot. Nobody asked for it, but it technically required effort, so it's something for a talentless moron troll to be proud of. You know, of putting in the minimum amount of effort necessary to just piss people off, because that's all they're capable of.

Whoah. Whoah!? Wot? Damn, Samuel L. Jackson why you gotta be so fuckin' aggressive!? Yo, you ever seen a cat give birth? It's fast man, faster than you think. It's like a rocked ship or something.

 

[DB_Cooper]

Whoah. Whoah!? Wot? Damn, Samuel L. Jackson why you gotta be so fuckin' aggressive!? Yo, you ever seen a cat give birth? It's fast man, faster than you think. It's like a rocked ship or something.

That's just how software works now. That's why Apple took continuous play out of their podcast app in iOS 11, then didn't put it back until 14. Nobody asked to make the app less functional. The problem is, when you have a shareholder kind of situation, you need to show continuous, steady, (if not rapid, geometric) improvement. This is because most people are less than dumb animals, and require patterns and rhythms, like an infant. So you end up making changes nobody wanted, since it technically counts as effort, and that's automatically good in the eyes of the dumb "shareholders". The whole XP thing has reeked of that.

And it sucks because I genuinely love this game.I love it so much that I wish there was a clean version I could turn my vanilla friends on to. It really seems obvious when they're spinning wheels and avoiding a major code overhaul, or whatever, so they put out weird updates just to keep the rhythm.

You know what? I could also just be a humongous asshole who is completely wrong. Or I could be right, but still an asshole.

 

[Ravengem]

If it's going to only last 24 hours i'd prefer the experience because at least that is useful early game. Best case scenario now you can use razorcup nectar for some really hard fights since it offers such a powerful boon. But its really really lame that for such a rare item you get to basically use another alcohol buff(obviously the nectar is stronger but alcohol is much easier to grab). The way it was worded in the changelog I thought for sure it would be a permanent buff and am pretty disappointed that it lasts such a short time.

I doubt that they will change it but a small buff like 5 Accuracy, 5 Attack/spell/sexiness would be really cool and rewarding but make it a perk so that you cannot stack if off kohaku. Potentially make it apply to only one person so that you have a reason to hunt for it?

Idk I greatly prefer the xp to this buff since at least with that you could hit power spikes faster but the new nectar falls into the save it and never use it territory. How do you guys feel about the change?

I'm one to agree. It went from being one of the most coveted items to one of neglect. I understand that there's plenty of opportunities to level in the game, and that it was a pretty powerful boon, but I would at least enjoy that the buff was permanent, or at least very long lasting.

EDIT: Or just make the item more available

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

I don't think what the item does is the point. I think the point is that it doing anything other than what it did before is an improvement.
Experience systems are designed to give the player a sense of progression. Progressing through it should be fun. If you desire to skip that grind, then the system isn't implemented correctly. Before the shared xp update, this was the case. Now, it isn't. If an item exists that allows you to skip one of it's mechanics, it can't be desirable. Unless the mechanic is bad, in which case it should be altered or removed. So it was, and then razorcup nectar needed a change by extension.
This idea is the entire reason why modern video games offer xp boosts and other items designed to "save time" and "skip the grind." Because the progression is intentionally designed to be problematic so that you can "solve" it with your wallet.
If you don't like the new razorcup nectar, that's fine, and also irrelevant. Because even if all it did was make your semen taste like orange juice, it would still be an objective improvement over the old nectar.

 

[YEsManKablaam]

so in the new system i'ts good the nectar was changed. I guess if we wanted to keep it's immense value i would almost suggest it giing you one stat point. But if we're avoiding items like that in the game for balance reasons this is fine too. Basically most of the argument i saw here against it was "The stats it gives are ones i don't like so it's the worst" when if you don't personally use an item in game doesn't mean other people don't it's like saying the revive items and ley grenades are dumb and useless cause just don't die and use character AOEs more. At least it has a use now when before even then the game leveled fine my razorcup nectars just sat in storage in case i got a really late game character that needed levels and now they would have just sat there forever.

 

[DB_Cooper]

I don't think what the item does is the point. I think the point is that it doing anything other than what it did before is an improvement.
Experience systems are designed to give the player a sense of progression. Progressing through it should be fun. If you desire to skip that grind, then the system isn't implemented correctly. Before the shared xp update, this was the case. Now, it isn't. If an item exists that allows you to skip one of it's mechanics, it can't be desirable. Unless the mechanic is bad, in which case it should be altered or removed. So it was, and then razorcup nectar needed a change by extension.
This idea is the entire reason why modern video games offer xp boosts and other items designed to "save time" and "skip the grind." Because the progression is intentionally designed to be problematic so that you can "solve" it with your wallet.
If you don't like the new razorcup nectar, that's fine, and also irrelevant. Because even if all it did was make your semen taste like orange juice, it would still be an objective improvement over the old nectar.

Wow, what a whole bunch of words to approximate a wet fart sound. You're a meistro of the onomatopoeia.

 

[Dr. Bootytaste]

Wow, what a whole bunch of words to approximate a wet fart sound. You're a meistro of the onomatopoeia.

I think we're three for three now on you adding nothing to the conversation. I get you don't like the change, but I've already explained why that's irrelevant.
As to whether or not you're an asshole, I don't think that matters either. All that matters is whether or not you have the charisma to make people overlook your bad qualities. And I gotta tell ya, bud...... You're not that guy.

 

[Boshe]

I've already explained why that's irrelevant.

To be honest, you didn't explain it, you gave an opinion on it.

I have issues sticking with a single save, even if I don't change a whole lot between them. I've replayed the game several times over and definitely enjoyed my starting up ritual of dealing with Fluffhaus and Gytha both on day 3, getting enough XP to get to level 5 between the both of them (and maybe a bit of silk farming), then popping a reward for the toughest battle so far (and the entire game, if we're perfectly honest) to avoid spending several more days to actually max out on XP and equip Vitality Reap. There are no battles that really require it until Khor'minos and I'm definitely not going there before Brint is undone for my own amusement, but it was still very nice to have switched out to an actually worthwhile Encounter power and a loadout of AoE blasts in every slot.

I know I'm in the minority here and I certainly don't think the game is in any way grindy (outside of maybe getting a ghostlight early without getting dicked by a weird raccoon-lich), but it did cut out that moment of all puzzle pieces coming together perfectly for me and I'm thus hesitant to call the matter of whether or not it was a definite improvement so cut and dry.