Pure vs Corrupt Hive

Gammerick

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Nov 13, 2015
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If you purify the hive, you get a new part member, with several sex scenes, including threesomes and new sleep partner content.

If you don't, you get...one threesome scene.

Am I the only one who feels like this a bit unfairly weighted? Especially since All of Azzy's partner content is already coded for her bimbo self. Is corrupt Azzy really never going to be a partner?
 

Emerald

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Jun 8, 2016
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Pretty sure that's been said many times that she won't be a companion if you push her in the honey.
 

WolframL

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That still doesn't really rectify how unbalanced the choices are.
Not everything is meant to be balanced; there are multiple options to resolve the Right of Conquest plot and most of them completely lock you out of all the post-quest warcamp content. In each case the game will give you some bolded hints that you should be really sure you want to do this because there might be Consequences. Shock and horror, it turns out the warnings are meant seriously and doing things like corrupting the hive has consequences.
 

WolframL

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If you can't figure out for yourself that pushing two people into the obviously corrupted honey and turning them into bimbos might lock you out of potential future content written for those those characters when they're untainted and able to think about more than just fucking 24/7, that's entirely your fault.
 

Tide Hunter

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May 4, 2019
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Not everything is meant to be balanced; there are multiple options to resolve the Right of Conquest plot and most of them completely lock you out of all the post-quest warcamp content. In each case the game will give you some bolded hints that you should be really sure you want to do this because there might be Consequences. Shock and horror, it turns out the warnings are meant seriously and doing things like corrupting the hive has consequences.
While things having consequences can be fun, and I do think it's fitting for the various endings of Right of Conquest to go the way they do, but of note is that Arona is still recruitable if you do the ambush, and I think that's a the main sticking point for Gammerick.
If you can't figure out for yourself that pushing two people into the obviously corrupted honey and turning them into bimbos might lock you out of potential future content written for those those characters when they're untainted and able to think about more than just fucking 24/7, that's entirely your fault.
It's fair to say that the content will be different, given that's the entire point of doing that. But companions are a major thing within the game and the story, so anything that locks you out from getting a companion will feel like an obvious and extreme downside to some people. Not that I would know if that is how Gammerick feels, but, well, to me one path entirely restricting you from having a companion as a companion basically means that that path is not worth going down at all.
 

Helia

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May 8, 2017
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Correct on all counts.
...huh...

I can't really discuss this in detail since I haven't gotten around to experiencing it for myself yet. But this seems like a strange game design choice, especially for people who might enjoy that kind of content. Why would a character being a "bimbo" inherently mean they wouldn't be able to do anything? Isn't that contradicted by the very possibility of the PC being able to transform and continue on their adventure without harm or hindrance? That seems really punitive and unfair for anyone who might be interested in that kind of writing, especially if what Gammerick said about content already being coded is true.

Why is overbearing negative consequences given precedence in a game designed around player freedom and the ability to engage in kinks and interests in a positive manner? That seems to confuse the design ethos entirely, especially if it punishes the player for trying to engage in content they might enjoy?

Will there be much in the way of any bimbo content that isn't inherently correlated with non-consent and harm?
 
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Alypia

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Will there be much in the way of any bimbo content that isn't inherently correlated with non-consent and harm?
Azyrran currently does have bimbo content that isn't inherently about non-consent and harm! :) Don't corrupt the Hive, and you can see it.
 

Paradox01

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...huh...

I can't really discuss this in detail since I haven't gotten around to experiencing it for myself yet. But this seems like a strange game design choice, especially for people who might enjoy that kind of content. Why would a character being a "bimbo" inherently mean they wouldn't be able to do anything? Isn't that contradicted by the very possibility of the PC being able to transform and continue on their adventure without harm or hindrance? That seems really punitive and unfair for anyone who might be interested in that kind of writing, especially if what Gammerick said about content already being coded is true.

Why is overbearing negative consequences given precedence in a game designed around player freedom and the ability to engage in kinks and interests in a positive manner? That seems to confuse the design ethos entirely, especially if it punishes the player for trying to engage in content they might enjoy?
This is essentially a criticism of a Choose Your Own Adventure book that's only half way through the story. The writers can't possibly write for every single kink or reader's wishes, not to mention the whole plot of the story revolving around a CHAMPION saving the land. You know, being the good guy. Sure, you can be a dick but there are consequences, only some of which we've seen so far. It's been said repeatedly that the Corruption mechanic will only really kick in towards the latter half of the story.

Would a Corrupted Companion be cool? Sure, but that would either mean a) writing an NPC twice - one normal and the other Corrupted, from the point they join your party ad infinitum - or b) creating a whole new NPC that's Corrupted from the get-go but then you'd create a whole NEW problem; Pure players would be salty about losing out on that NPC. Now we've got the exact same problem, only it's a different group of people who are disappointed.

Either way, it's a shit-ton of writing, and who's gonna do it? If you really want to see a Corrupt Companion, post in the What content would you like added? thread. But be prepared for the writers to say "no thanks".
 
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The Observer

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This basically boils down to what I mentioned in a previous thread -- false choice. It's something that in my experience goes all the way back to when I was writing for Fall of Eden and Lukadoc+Quietbrowser writing the burrows where the player could suggest various options as to what to do with the defeated Lagon, and Vena would shoot them down one by one until you picked the one she wanted. But in this game there are numerous false choices -- not saving Cait, hornets, not making Arona chieftain, not corrupting the centaur village, etc, etc, etc. That's one way of doing it; rather than give players false choices, I've just removed them altogether.

I'm not going to pretend to know SKoW's decision to effectively make this a false choice, but I do know firsthand from writing two versions of Kinu that yes, it does double the workload.
 

Lukistr

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Mar 18, 2019
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there are numerous false choices -- not saving Cait, hornets, not making Arona chieftain, not corrupting the centaur village,
I mean personally I did corrupt the centaur village and the only reason why I don't corrupt the hive is because I hate bimbos and I did have a save where Arona was not chieftain . I get what you mean but the fact that there is less content behind a choice does not automatically make it false.
 

Fleep

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There are lots of choices in the game, it's obvious that not all of them are gonna lead to the exact same number of scenes or paths. The choices the developers like more or the ones people are more likely to chose (like purifying the hive) are gonna have way more content than the choices just a small number of players will pick. Why? Because working on some path you don't enjoy and people are barely gonna see instead of working on the opposite just doesn't make sense at all.

If it's just about content quantity you can always write content for the Corrupted Hive path or commision someone if you don't feel like writing yourself. If it's about having bimbo Azzy as a companion just save the hive and change her set.
 

Helia

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May 8, 2017
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they only think about sex and sex, I see no reason to want anything more with them besides that
I don't like this assumption, not everyone enjoys a kink in the same way, and there is a strong precedent already set in Trials (and I'll see soon if it's in this game) that bimbofication doesn't inherently impact intelligence and free will. I personally think it is far more likely that the corruption is the actual cause of suffering, since I definitely recall writer discussion that bimbos aren't inherently corrupt.

I love smart bimbos, consent, positive portrayals of femininity, talented women in sex, and a tonne of writing that is very specifically associated with bimbos in Trials. I don't intend to demand or require any of sort of content specifically for my interests, but there was a big deal made about there being a fairly substantial amount of "bimbo" content in COC2 (heck it is an entire personality branch), so I am hopeful as a fan to be able to experience it in a meaningful way, without being guilted by the game.

Azyrran currently does have bimbo content that isn't inherently about non-consent and harm! :) Don't corrupt the Hive, and you can see it.

Thank you so much for telling me!

This is essentially a criticism of a Choose Your Own Adventure book that's only half way through the story. The writers can't possibly write for every single kink or reader's wishes, not to mention the whole plot of the story revolving around a CHAMPION saving the land.
I personally have no interest in non-consent or "corrupted" content, but if that isn't going to be written, presenting the illusion of choice is extremely bad game design. You can't assume the majority of your players will be reading forum posts or aware of writers predilections, the majority of gamers are completely unaware of what goes on behind the scenes, and you have to keep that in mind when you design it.

That's one way of doing it; rather than give players false choices, I've just removed them altogether.
I think this is a very good point, and should really be taken into account. Please don't assume that the people experiencing the game will be aware of the writing process (especially since it is now available on Steam), and people will probably criticize the game quite heavily for providing false choices and misleading players, especially since that is the entire advertised premise, and the game is almost exclusively writing.

I think the writers have been exceptional, coming across any writing I disliked is exceptionally rare, but relevantly, almost always revolves around funneling the player into choices and experiences without proper consideration.

Again, since I have yet to (but am keen to) experience this content, I have no strong opinion on what should or should not be added, and I would appreciate if people wouldn't assume as such. My point is basically what I stated.
Why is overbearing negative consequences given precedence in a game designed around player freedom and the ability to engage in kinks and interests in a positive manner? That seems to confuse the design ethos entirely, especially if it punishes the player for trying to engage in content they might enjoy?

Punishing the player for trying to engage with your mechanics is bad game design, writers decisions are extremely important, but as far as making a cohesive game that the majority of people will experience without any context, false choices really should be avoided. I think the majority of choices should be based around letting the player decide what kinks they enjoy, and defining their champions personality, rather than gating content behind a false branch that is already prefixed.
 

Aurore

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Oct 23, 2020
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I never liked bimbo content, I feel that when a character is bimboficated, he loses the essence, it's more of a paranoia of mine. However, I really wish that you can consume more of that content in the future.
 

Helia

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May 8, 2017
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I never liked bimbo content, I feel that when a character is bimboficated, he loses the essence, it's more of a paranoia of mine. However, I really wish that you can consume more of that content in the future.

I inherently dislike any content that correlates bimbofication with losing the sense of self and the characters agency (thus I really like the consensual and positively portrayed scenes). It's hard for me to demand or dictate any of this form of content, since it is a character personality, it could potentially be utilized with any character in the game. At most I'll just express my hope as a fan, and an appreciation for the incredible talent of all the writers.
 

Tarnakus

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Oct 31, 2020
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Locking up companions behind players choice exist in this game already neither it isn't something new in gaming (companions and slaves in CoC1 that exclude each other). Here you need to choose between Brint and Brienne (you can argue that content is "balanced", but i didn't count scenes), you can tell Quin to fuck off (and delete him from game, even worse "balance" that Azzy), if you don't have cock you are locked from Kiyoko sex content (don't know about her companion content) and a lot of kitsune content in general, not to mention smaller npc that can be locked like behemot or harem cats. Some examples from the top of my head. So i don't understand this discussion about Azzy and her bimbo content. Not first or last scenes you will miss cuz of player choices.
 

Helia

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May 8, 2017
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Locking up companions behind players choice exist in this game already neither it isn't something new in gaming (companions and slaves in CoC1 that exclude each other). Here you need to choose between Brint and Brienne (you can argue that content is "balanced", but i didn't count scenes), you can tell Quin to fuck off (and delete him from game, even worse "balance" that Azzy), if you don't have cock you are locked from Kiyoko sex content (don't know about her companion content) and a lot of kitsune content in general, not to mention smaller npc that can be locked like behemot or harem cats. Some examples from the top of my head. So i don't understand this discussion about Azzy and her bimbo content. Not first or last scenes you will miss cuz of player choices.

There is a rather significant difference between a telegraphed scene where the player can choose to recruit someone, engage in specific fetish content they may be interested in, or otherwise make an informed choice with clear influence. And one that is not explained or foreshadowed in any clear capacity, requires searching a random forum for answers, and where the player is punished for trying to engage in the experience a writer set out for them via a deceptive false choice.

Plus, even in situations that have similar issues, such as the examples Observer gave. Just because there are other examples of poor game design, doesn't make it somehow more reasonable or acceptable, and in fact is quite worrying.

This project provides a lot more freedom to writers than traditional game development projects, in that they can freely choose what they want to write and expand, for better and for worse. But in a game specifically advertised around player freedom and creating an engrossing sandbox, where the game is almost exclusively written, with very few visual elements, consistent design and mechanics are important.

I know there is some popularity in designing subtle choices with unclear consequences inspired by games such as the Witcher series, but the difference there-in is that no matter what the player decides, they will still have a meaningful and full experience. I don't personally like such choices and game design, especially for a game built around being a sandbox and kink heavy, but they are consistent and make sense. There is separation between tailoring how a character experiences the world via their personality, and punishing them for the "wrong" option.
 

Alypia

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Apr 22, 2016
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There is a rather significant difference between a telegraphed scene where the player can choose to recruit someone, engage in specific fetish content they may be interested in, or otherwise make an informed choice with clear influence. And one that is not explained or foreshadowed in any clear capacity, requires searching a random forum for answers, and where the player is punished for trying to engage in the experience a writer set out for them via a deceptive false choice.
I understand where this is coming from, but I don't think that there's anything deceptive about the corruption route for the Hive. The choice isn't framed as "indulge in bimbo content or don't", but rather "corrupt these characters or don't". It's telegraphed as "the champ is a naughty bastard". Naughty bastards getting mindless sex slaves that aren't good for anything other than threesome scenes doesn't feel like a bait and switch at all! It feels like, rather, exactly the kind of thing that people who are into the corruption fetish would want.

Besides, the fact that consensual, temporary, on-demand bimbo content does exist for Companion Azzy - in fact, was always planned as being part of her content - kind of makes this complaint feel a little empty. The thing that you want is in the game.
 
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Tarnakus

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Oct 31, 2020
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So you would like a list of every kink and scenes that you are missing when you choose gender or tranform into one? Or maybe warnings on every tranformation item what you would miss after change? For that exact reason forum and wiki exist. If you want to optimize your playthrough you need to metagame. It's true in every game. The notion that any game should done it for you and give you everything on silver plate is bizzare for me. Not to mention magical tool called saving. It's not like CoC2 is 90hr game. You can easily done new playthrough in couple of hours.

Are you arguing that every game in world advertised as sandbox is false advertised? Cuz in everyone of them i can nitpick something you can't do therefore it's not sandbox. Not to mention every sandbox have borders.
Idea that Savin and crew have super powers cuz they are doing text-based game is fallacy. With enought time and money you can port CoC2 into anything you would like. You could do visual novel, game on ureal engine, develope your own game engine, vr game or movie. But they don't have infinite time and money so they need to choose what to write and what not. Couple of people point it out already.

I know there is some popularity in designing subtle choices with unclear consequences inspired by games such as the Witcher series, but the difference there-in is that no matter what the player decides, they will still have a meaningful and full experience. I don't personally like such choices and game design, especially for a game built around being a sandbox and kink heavy, but they are consistent and make sense. There is separation between tailoring how a character experiences the world via their personality, and punishing them for the "wrong" option.

Full experience on one Witcher 3 playthrough? Your choices kill npc and lock you up from content (check Witcher 2 there you had 2 different second acts). I think you play some different Witcher than me or you have different definition of full experience. Even Baldurs Gate game from 1998 lock up companions and quest behind player choice. It is normal game design and it is consistent in CoC2 (in CoC1 and TiTS too) what my previous examples shows. Argument that this is porn game therefore it should be no meaningful choices is absurd. Then why don't you want to strip combat mechanincs, inventory, random encounters or stats? Cuz after all they are just annoyance between you and smut.

I can easily argue that getting corupted hive is the "right" choice that give you rewards. You get exclusive thresome scene (with char that probably will not get any other sex content), you can hate Azzy and don't want her as companion or you want corrupt playthrough for immersion (all valiable reasons to corrupt hive). It all depends where you stand and how you value companions and scenes.

Some point about illusionary choices in games. Every game you played is one big illusion of choice. No matter what you choose at begging or do in the middle you will end up in finite number of ends. So that means we should strip off every choice in every game? And what we would get? Books and movies. Same point i can apply to metagaming: such as best builds, routes or items, so even games that don't have plot have illusion of choice in them.
 

Tide Hunter

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Full experience on one Witcher 3 playthrough? Your choices kill npc and lock you up from content (check Witcher 2 there you had 2 different second acts). I think you play some different Witcher than me or you have different definition of full experience. Even Baldurs Gate game from 1998 lock up companions and quest behind player choice. It is normal game design and it is consistent in CoC2 (in CoC1 and TiTS too) what my previous examples shows. Argument that this is porn game therefore it should be no meaningful choices is absurd. Then why don't you want to strip combat mechanincs, inventory, random encounters or stats? Cuz after all they are just annoyance between you and smut.
I can't directly speak for Helia, but it seems to me that this paragraph is a gross misrepresentation of the stance. First the "Full experience" thing. I think that it is the "different definition" thing, which, given that the only other option you presented was an obviously incorrect one, should have been clear. It isn't "I get to see literally everything and all the content in the game," it's "If you pick path A you get just as much content as path B even if it is an entirely different route." Not sure how true that really is for the Witcher games, but the core behind that also still supports Helia's stance that this is an unbalanced level of content where one option is weighted so heavily in favor of that there's practically no reason to pick the other one due to how little you get in return.

Second, the previous examples. The three are either balanced (Brint vs Brienne, they aren't exactly equal but the tradeoffs between what is there vs what isn't it roughly equal, though currently not exact until Brienne gets her fire equipment set), a clear binary (Quin being a straightforwards choice between content and no content, rather than content on one side vs different content on the other), or are currently planned to be remedied (Magicocks have been planned for a long time, which will allow female characters to experience scenes intended for characters with cocks, including the Kiyoko content, without having an actual cock). These specific examples do not show it to be "consistent in CoC2," though there are probably other situations similar to this, just not in those examples.

Third, the "oh, so you believe [thing that you didn't say]? Well then why not [reductio ad absurdum]." Yes, it would be absurd to argue that there should be no meaningful choices because there's porn. That was not said. In context, Helia was saying that choices should more clearly telegraph what you're loosing out by picking one option over the other, especially in a "kink-heavy" game (And also this whole conversation is about how, rather than a meaningful choice, it's a false choice and people who dislike it think that the false choice is bad, at least in this case, due to the presentation). And the rest of the paragraph is practically a non-sequitur, because even if your statement on what Helia believes was true and not a misrepresentation, meaningful choices do not equal literally everything that is not porn, and disliking them does not equal a dislike for anything that prevents you from seeing porn.
 

Helia

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May 8, 2017
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I understand where this is coming from, but I don't think that there's anything deceptive about the corruption route for the Hive. The choice isn't framed as "indulge in bimbo content or don't", but rather "corrupt these characters or don't". It's telegraphed as "the champ is a naughty bastard". Naughty bastards getting mindless sex slaves that aren't good for anything other than threesome scenes doesn't feel like a bait and switch at all! It feels like, rather, exactly the kind of thing that people who are into the corruption fetish would want.

Besides, the fact that consensual, temporary, on-demand bimbo content does exist for Companion Azzy - in fact, was always planned as being part of her content - kind of makes this complaint feel a little empty. The thing that you want is in the game.

I specifically clarified that I am not referring to content that I want or desire, but rather, what represents consistent and logical game design, especially for what would most likely be a fair majority of players who don't engage in the online community or forums. I can't speak to the specifics of that particular choice, because I was talking in a general sense in response to the observations Observer made, which I feel are reasonable and important to consider in a game where-in the entire gameplay loop revolves around text based narrative and character based choices.

Tarnakus, I'm having trouble figuring out how to respond to your post because it feels very off base from what I was trying to say, and is inferring some extreme notions that I don't believe I was insinuating.

So you would like a list of every kink and scenes that you are missing when you choose gender or tranform into one? Or maybe warnings on every tranformation item what you would miss after change? For that exact reason forum and wiki exist.

Well I mean, again, I can't speak for CoC2 yet, but with Trials, the devs put a lot of care into immersive telegraphing and foreshadowing to provide the players an accessible and enjoyable experience, whether via item descriptions, inner monologues, or tool-tips, without breaking immersion and maintaining consistency. The majority of people who play games do so casually, and never engage in online discussion, news, or debate, and are completely unaware of the on-going circumstances and major issues within the industry. Since the game has been officially released on steam, and the dev team have shown considerable care and talent in multiple facets of the game, whether it be squad based combat mechanics, improvements in design and accessibility from previous projects, or otherwise; you have to keep your audience in mind during the design process.

In fact, a lack of player communication is exactly why characters such as Shizuya caused significant outcry, in a game specifically built around a sex positive portrayal of mature content, being forced into a borderline non-consensual scene is a huge design flaw.

Having to rely on a wiki to play a game is a failure of game design, not an insurmountable one, and sometimes a necessary one for projects as ambitious as Dwarf Fortress, but it is at its core, a design flaw.

Are you arguing that every game in world advertised as sandbox is false advertised? Cuz in everyone of them i can nitpick something you can't do therefore it's not sandbox.
I'm rather baffled by this point, meaningful choices and interactivity are what make games stand-out in various forms of media. The entire premise of the game is that the player can create the character of their desires, determine their sexuality, and influence their personality to provide a meaningfully tailored experience. Choices that orient content to the player are fantastic, false flags that provide the illusion of depth, but instead cheat the player out of a meaningful play experience are essentially false choices, choices that aren't ever worth experiencing or doing, and are completely redundant.
There is a difference between willfully deciding not to opt into specific content, and being completely locked out of a significant amount of content due to poor communication.

Again, I can't say for sure that anything within CoC2 resides within this category, I only went off what Observer mentioned, but in general, I do hope that the game designers and writers keep this in mind with future development.

Your choices kill npc and lock you up from content (check Witcher 2 there you had 2 different second acts).
It is interesting that you brought this up, because I distinctly remember a lot of discussion and critique revolving around this facet of the second game. Because so much content that is heavily intertwined narratively is split up between separate playthroughs, I recall hearing arguments that you don't get a complete story on a single playthrough, and since replaying makes the other side of the game non-canonical, it invalidates a huge part of the experience, without being much of a direct choice in and of itself that allows the player to make an impact on the world.

In fact, the third game ignores this choice almost entirely, demonstrating that it was far too ambitious for the dev team to make meaningful design decisions around. There is careful consideration that comes up when creating diverging paths between allowing the player to create a personal experience, and creating the feeling of being cheated out of a significant amount of content that helps complete the narrative.

I do consider the sandbox elements of the game more important than creating a heavily diverging narrative. Allowing the player to openly make the decision what kind of content they are interested in, rather than having obscure consequences, is something I feel is more important for this particular gaming experience.

The rest of what you stated is essentially a non-sequitur that doesn't really have anything to do with what I'm discussing.
 

Alypia

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Apr 22, 2016
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I specifically clarified that I am not referring to content that I want or desire, but rather, what represents consistent and logical game design, especially for what would most likely be a fair majority of players who don't engage in the online community or forums. I can't speak to the specifics of that particular choice, because I was talking in a general sense in response to the observations Observer made, which I feel are reasonable and important to consider in a game where-in the entire gameplay loop revolves around text based narrative and character based choices.
I see. I understand wanting to talk about things in this way, but I don't know how useful it is. Recommendations and requests in this thread and in this subforum are best when they are concrete and specific. If you want to talk about a game design problem that you see in other games but not necessarily in this one, there's another games subforum that may be better for it.
Well I mean, again, I can't speak for CoC2 yet, but with Trials, the devs put a lot of care into immersive telegraphing and foreshadowing to provide the players an accessible and enjoyable experience, whether via item descriptions, inner monologues, or tool-tips, without breaking immersion and maintaining consistency.
There's an item in this game that you can get from HiveQuest. Its description clearly states that it is a cursed item that increases the player's breast size under certain circumstances. And yet, there's still all kinds of people who wander into the bug reports forum, the regular forum, and even the Discord wondering why their Champion has Z-cup titties.

I feel pretty content in saying that if our players read the material that we give to them, they will have adequate information to make decisions in line with their intent. However, many of our players do not read very well.
In fact, a lack of player communication is exactly why characters such as Shizuya caused significant outcry, in a game specifically built around a sex positive portrayal of mature content, being forced into a borderline non-consensual scene is a huge design flaw.
By contrast, even the evil rapey sex demon omnibus in this game requests the Champion's consent. Unless players explicitly consent to content that, in my experience, is quite well signposted, they will not experience it...well, outside of combat losses, but that's generally seen to be acceptable by the smutgame community.

I've got pretty limited interests, as some of the community members know, but it's very easy for me to avoid all the content I'm not interested in.

Now, explicit signposting for sexual content to enable player consent is a slightly different issue from signposting narrative choices. However, I believe that both of these things are done adequately well in CoC2.
 

Helia

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May 8, 2017
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Very much appreciated, thank you! I believe I've said my piece and allayed my concerns, hopefully such thoughts are considered in the future of the project.

On a somewhat relevant tangent, is the new honey mead item mentioned in the patch notes this games equivalent of "bimbo liqueur"? I used to check the public github for Trials out of curiosity to see the parsers that alter flavour text and character personality. My understanding is that neither game does this anymore to avoid unchecked modding, which considering the context of user submissions, makes sense, but it is a shame since I loved the resource for finding content I was interested in.

Hopefully the bimbo personality isn't correlated with intelligence (and that I can still get the cunning/presence flavour text mentioned in the design document), but I suppose I wont know until I check it out.
 
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Alypia

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The new drink gives the Champion a temporary bimbo effect, much like the unpurified honey from Queen Nyzerrah's tits. It lasts for several days and automatically qualifies your character for bimbo dialogue where it exists. Bimbo dialogue does not override stat checks or lock the Champion's Cunning to a certain level. The brew also TFs your character to make them more feminine and bimbo-like: tits, hips, thiccness, etc. These TFs do not go away when the bimbo effect wears off, but they are reversible with other TFs.

If the Champion ingests additional brew while already under the effect of brew, their personality become permanently bimbofied. (Again, the same as happens under the effect of Nyzerrah's unpurified honey.) Subsequent doses of brew will still give TFs if the player qualifies for them (i.e. has not reached the caps).
 
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Sandeklaus

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Besides, the fact that consensual, temporary, on-demand bimbo content does exist for Companion Azzy - in fact, was always planned as being part of her content - kind of makes this complaint feel a little empty. The thing that you want is in the game.
Interestingly, my feelings ran in the opposite direction when I found Bimbo Azz.

I wasn't especially surprised that the Corrupt Hive was a bit barren, given how relatively new that content area is. Azzyran being unavailable as a companion if corrupted also made total sense, not for reasons of in-setting practicality (we can manage just fine as a Bimbo, after all), but because I appreciated just how much work a whole new set of dialogue and abilities would be for a Bimbo Azzyran. I can't ask for that if I'm not willing to write it myself. Every fork doubles workload.

And then I found out you could have a Bimbo Azzyran regardless, and the latter objection just... fell a bit flat. The current Bimbo Azzyran feels like something that would normally be a consolation option added for "pure" players who wanted a Bimbo-ified hornetgirl on their team, but didn't want to actually corrupt the hive or inflict permanent non-con braindrain on a friendly NPC. Safe, sane, and consensual bimbo-ing, as a back-up! Instead, it's just... a cherry on top for players who chose not to bimbo her. Turns out that adventuring with a bimbo hornetgirl is Fine, Actually, but if you liked that idea from the start it's blocked off from you?

In essence, players are presented with two options: Bimbo Azzyran, or Do Not Bimbo Azzyran. Players who pick Bimbo Azzyran get nothing. Players who pick Do Not Bimbo Azzyran get... Non-Bimbo'd Azzyran and Bimbo'd Azzyran? (Gee, Champ, how come your queen lets you have two Azzyrans?) It feels like a very strange choice for how to branch things, if you see what I mean?
 
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