Claw based combat

[Stadler]

Claw based attacks, perks or attacks assisted by claws


Here are a few random thoughts for PCs, that have claws instead of fingernails:


When to enable the claw attacks?
To be able to attack with your claws, you need at least one free hand, meaning: You can use it with a shield and no weapon or the other way around (one one-handed weapon and no shield, e. g. M. Bolt + Claw attack). While you can choose to dual-wield your claws (no weapon and no shield ... Hello Captain Obvious) this could be hard to balance so for now lets assume, that it acts the same way, as single wielding your claws.


Differences between claw attacks
These are just examples for now, so don't take anything being set into stone, thanks.

• Dragon claws
  
  
  May have a certain base attack power only (e. g. 20) and act like a 'normal' one-handed weapon
  
• I believe, they are powerful enough, but since other races can inherit the DragonFire perk, too, I'll probably play around a bit with their attack power.
  

[*]Lizard claws

• 
  Base attack power around 13-20 + chance of armor-piercing (lowering or ignoring enemy armor).
  

[*]Cat claws

• 
  Base attack power similar to lizards + chance to blind enemys + maybe a chance of armor-piercing, too (Yay, more balancing)
  

[*]Dog/Wolf claws

• 
  No claw attack, but they could possibly aid a Bite attack (if any), since its easier to hold onto your enemy with these claws.
  
• Maybe only applied to wolves, but wolves are not in the game atm AFAICS.
  

[*]Fox/Kitsune claws

• 
  Base attack power around 10-20 (probably lower, than lizard claws)
  
• Fox is mostly just fluff and doesn't need more balancing IMHO
  
• Kitsune may get some balancing, although theres the ninetails ^^
  

[*]Salamander claws

• 
  Have to talk to @Savin, before I implement such an attack. So the following are just random thoughts and may never be implemented. *DONE* Savin's ok with it.
  
• Base attack power around 13-20 + chance of armor-piercing(?) + fire-based damage similar to Tail Slap (??? may require a certain salamander score or at least having the mander tail ... well, maybe both)
  

[*]Demon claws

• 
  Base attack power around 13-17 + maybe chance of armor pierce (lower chance than lizards)
  
• I see them mostly as being fluff. You want to become more and more demon like? Time to visit the factory and talk to the secretary ^^
  

[*]Harpy talons

• 
  Probably with harpy feet an aerial attack similar to raptor jump attack.
  
• May include a claw-attack, if I implement a harpy clawType (e. G. CLAW_TYPE_HARPY_TALONS:int = 8) for their hands.
  

[*]Raptor claws

• 
  Raptors are NYI both in my patch and in @Kitteh6660's mod and its highly likely, that I won't implement them unless @Kitteh6660 adds raptors to his mod. Again: Just an example an nothing set in stone.
  
• Claw attack simliar to Lizard claws including armor pierce
  
• May assist in Bite attack
  
• Raptors may gain a Jump attack, when their feet TF + maybe a higher Jump attack, when they have those ferocious (long, thick, curved, whatever) raptor claws.
  
• Raptors with big cocks may have a tease-like attack, when jumping at enemys with their big cocks and maybe raptor TF shrinks them to normal size. Anyway: You have to grow them after TFing to raptor.
  
• Raptor combat is probably somewhat tricky to implement and probably needs a lot of balancing.
  
• Maybe raptor TF could lead to a bad end due to overdose. e. g. PC joining a pack and goes out for hunting.
  
• I <3 teh raptors

[*]Scorpion claws

• 
  Yet another NYI and like raptors @Kitteh6660 has to add them first. So I can't promise anything.
  
• TF would probably TF two of your fingers on each hand to scorpion claws and the remaining three will be human fingers. Maybe with a carapace, similar to spider-morphs and driders.
  
• However: I won't add a new skinType, like SKIN_TYPE_CARAPACE, since I see scorps as having carapaced scorpion tail+lower body+arms with the rest being different (maybe normal human skin only, like in mander TF)
  
• Base attack power around 20-25 with a (slightly?) higher chance of armor pierce (Probably needs balancing)
  

[*]Lamia claws

• 
  And another NYI (See above NYIs)
  
• Base ATP around 13 + Chance of poisoning
  
• Probably naga TF extended using snake oil (bought from Benoit after naga TF finished) or enhanced snake oil (from Benoit or naga + enhanced by Lumi)
  
• TF may go this way (Not necessarily in that order):
  1. 
     Gain snake hair (meaning hair on head replaced by snake skin, hair growth stops + baldness)
     
  2. Gain snake skin (lizard skin with different skinDesc and skinAdj, needs us to consider snake skincolors)
     
  3. Gain snake face
     
  4. Gain predator arms with lamia (or simply lizard) claws.
     
• So basically they would be more powerful nagas (making them stronger aka balance them).
  

[*]Mantis scythes

• 
  NYI. Only in Xianxia mod for now.
  
• I'll use CLAW_TYPE_MANTIS:int = 7 for this, so there are no conflicts with Xianxia mod.
  
• Quoting Ormael here: "About mantis arms I think it would be mostly pure raw dmg oriented. I mean technicaly mantis fingers wouldn't be much use and more their scythes so taking into acount they are sharp and mantises would be moving slight faster than other races it would mean their raw attack power should be higher. At cost of not having any other bonuses their will trade it with having much higher base atk value."
  
• Any more ideas @Ormael?
  

[*]Other races with claws

• 
  Ideas? Suggestions?
  

Where do you plan to implement this?
This is mainly a suggestion for @Kitteh6660's mod. But it will be at least in my dragon patch/mod, too. However: Kitteh6660's mod comes first.


Who will write this?
I volunteer! But if anyone wants to help: Feel free, required that you know how to fork, branch and PR over @GitHub

 

[Kharn]

Perhaps harpy feet talon attack? And your raptor jump attack description then got me to consider CoC's dick length's and then I imagine the jump attack accidentally knocking em unconscious due to big, floppy dick. 

 

[Stadler]

Perhaps harpy feet talon attack? And your raptor jump attack description then got me to consider CoC's dick length's and then I imagine the jump attack accidentally knocking em unconscious due to big, floppy dick. 

Harpy feet attacks sounds like a good idea. About raptors with big cocks: They won't have an oversized cock to begin with, so you have to grow them using other method and maybe I'll rather use it as a tease-attack. However: This may cause even more balancing problems. I like raptors, but I don't want to make them too powerful.


PS: I'm watching soccer (Germany vs. France) right now. So answers may come later.

 

[Savin]

• Salamander claws
  
  
  Have to talk to @Savin, before I implement such an attack. So the following are just random thoughts and may never be implemented
  
• Base attack power around 20-30 + chance of armor-piercing(?) + fire-based damage similar to Tail Slap (??? may require a certain salamander score or at least have the mander tail)
  

Sure

 

[Stadler]

Sure

Does that mean you're ok with it?

 

[Savin]

Does that mean you're ok with it?

Sure

 

[Ormael]

I take that if I see something that strike my fancy I can grab it for Xianxia too @Stadler ?


And something similar I got already in really stubby shape in Xianxia that is as their say 'almost like your idea' (aka Mantis arms ^^)

 

[Stadler]

I take that if I see something that strike my fancy I can grab it for Xianxia too @Stadler ?


And something similar I got already in really stubby shape in Xianxia that is as their say 'almost like your idea' (aka Mantis arms ^^)

Sure, feel free.

And I'd suggest you to add clawType = CLAW_TYPE_MANTIS so you can simply add:


switch (player.clawType)
{
// [...]
case CLAW_TYPE_MANTIS:
doStuff();
break;
// [...]
}


To Combat.as for most cases


I guess, I'll add Mantis to my list.


PS: I'd suggest to use 7 for CLAW_TYPE_MANTIS. I'll skip this in my patch or add
 

public static const CLAW_TYPE_MANTIS:int                                            =   7; // NYI, Xianxia mod only for now

 

[Ormael]

Ok would later try contribute to tlak on claws...to not sound I only crabbint them.


Btw about raptors is it what I think it's? Something like such raptor fingers? xD

 

[Stadler]

Ok would later try contribute to tlak on claws...to not sound I only crabbint them.


Btw about raptors is it what I think it's? Something like such raptor fingers? xD

Yay, hooray for teh raptors. mmh ... their feathers may be somewhat tricky to implement.

 

[Ormael]

Yay, hooray for teh raptors. mmh ... their feathers may be somewhat tricky to implement.

Well it would be probably like hapry arms now. Well raptors arms actualy could be easy made based on harpy ones just with more sharp and pronouced claws. As for mantis one arms well if it meant to be used possible in xianxia too just make list not trying some specialy group them (that would only later bring trouble of you keep moving some claw types as new ones was addded and etc.). As for mantis claws...err technicaly blades they got on they arms bonus is +15 * each NG tier so in NG+ it would be 30, NG++ 45 and so on instead of those +7. But it was first such thing I add in xianxia (hence meantiong it''s quite stubby form) so maybe with those of yours claws addition would rebalance them later in term of bonus added.


Also I do really think would try add this to xianxia making melee fight somehow vialable in contrast to using weapons.

 

[Kharn]

Raptor as in velociraptor or genus of predatory bird raptor?

 

[Ormael]

@Stadler About mantis arms I think it would be mostly pure raw dmg oriented. I mean technicaly mantis fingers wouldn't be much use and more their scythes so taking into acount they are sharp and mantises would be moving slight faster than other races it would mean their raw attack power should be higher. At cost of not having any other bonuses their will trade it with having much higher base atk value.


That would be my thought how to treat mantis claws in this system you making for claws and melee fight.

 

[Stadler]

@Stadler About mantis arms I think it would be mostly pure raw dmg oriented. I mean technicaly mantis fingers wouldn't be much use and more their scythes so taking into acount they are sharp and mantises would be moving slight faster than other races it would mean their raw attack power should be higher. At cost of not having any other bonuses their will trade it with having much higher base atk value.


That would be my thought how to treat mantis claws in this system you making for claws and melee fight.

Aah, Scythes! Thats the word I was looking for.


I assume, Mantis PCs will still have hands since without them that would be game over?! ^^

Raptor as in velociraptor or genus of predatory bird raptor?

More, like those in ARK: SE



PS: Maybe raptor TF could lead to a bad end due to overdose. e. g. PC joining a pack and goes out for hunting.

 

[Kharn]

Never played Ark, but now I want to...and those are more the raptors I like (well birds are good too, but too many scenes need to be wrote if beak TF went in).

 

[Ormael]

Aah, Scythes! Thats the word I was looking for.


I assume, Mantis PCs will still have hands since without them that would be game over?! ^^

Well scorpions may be tricky to make into game without going for taur path and giving scorpion claws on lower tauric body as first pair of legs. If PC woul human body structure then it would be game over with scorpion since it hands will change into corpion claws so effectively messing up so many things ingame.


As for mantis scythes here is reference pic I sued making mantis TF for Xianxia As you can see those aren't typical clwas for mantis arms but still it would be hard to classify them otherwise if not call as mantis version of 'claws'

 

[Stadler]

Never played Ark, but now I want to...and those are more the raptors I like (well birds are good too, but too many scenes need to be wrote if beak TF went in).

OT: Feel free, but note that is quite resource hungry. Its far better now, but it was horrible, when the early access started.

 

[Stadler]

Well scorpions may be tricky to make into game without going for taur path and giving scorpion claws on lower tauric body as first pair of legs. If PC woul human body structure then it would be game over with scorpion since it hands will change into corpion claws so effectively messing up so many things ingame.

I imagine scorpion hands would have two fingers TF to scorpion claws, with the rest being normal human fingers. Oh and scorpion tail is already in game (TF you PC to manticore in the debug menu)
And I don't think, that scorpion TF requires to be tauric, but their TF could include a taur TF with scorpion lower body. probably with a high scorpionScore() requirement, so players can easily chose to be a non-tauric scorpion.

As for mantis scythes here is reference pic I sued making mantis TF for Xianxia As you can see those aren't typical clwas for mantis arms but still it would be hard to classify them otherwise if not call as mantis version of 'claws'

Since we start posting pictures, Heres, whats inspired me of my dragon neck and dragon rear body TF:
Kale TF 2-3 by LigerPhoenix on DeviantArt and Kale TF 2-4 by LigerPhoenix on DeviantArt
 

 

[Ormael]

I imagine scorpion hands would have two fingers TF to scorpion claws, with the rest being normal human fingers. Oh and scorpion tail is already in game (TF you PC to manticore in the debug menu)
And I don't think, that scorpion TF requires to be tauric, but their TF could include a taur TF with scorpion lower body. probably with a high scorpionScore() requirement, so players can easily chose to be a non-tauric scorpion.


Since we start posting pictures, Heres, whats inspired me of my dragon neck and dragon rear body TF:
Kale TF 2-3 by LigerPhoenix on DeviantArt and Kale TF 2-4 by LigerPhoenix on DeviantArt
 

It could be also made as another special type of arms that will make PC got at once claws ended arms and normal arms. As for taur lower body i too also thought that for some scorpion-morph PC that advanced far on scropion score getting simialr to drider lower body ended with sorpion tail instead of drider abdomen would be a way.


As for scropion tail it's as thing hard to get in revamp and req. debug for becoming manticore. In my mod I made some simialr to taurinum item that would give PC scorpion tail properly and made also manticores as easier to get race not using some debugging or otherwise save editong means. But still on my radar is to proper scorpion TF been added to game. I seen someone on revamp trello was linking to scorpion tf.


Ahh I see your insipirations. So there comes too rear body part too or was it inspired by other pics. My inspiration lately are from looking over monster girl encyclopedia ^^ This mantis pic is pic for manitses entry there. As funny fact if you check salamander or phoenix entires there... (as both races author meantioned he do been inspired by this source too in some way). Sadly they not yet got dracolisks mosnter girl there :/ But taking basilisks there are jsut subtype of lamia it could ends looking like lamia with many dragon features and wings.

 

[Stadler]

It could be also made as another special type of arms that will make PC got at once claws ended arms and normal arms. As for taur lower body i too also thought that for some scorpion-morph PC that advanced far on scropion score getting simialr to drider lower body ended with sorpion tail instead of drider abdomen would be a way.

Using a new armType would be mandatory, if you take look at my Scorpion claws description (Just edited my main post). And like I said before about taurs: I think, there should be a chance to go through all scorpion TFs without becoming tauric.
Fun fact: I considered to implement Super Taurinum (Obtained from Rathazul and enhanced by Lumi), which has a chance to grant you 6 legs, when your PC is already a taur.
I'll reconsider, after my patch reaches version 1.0.0 final.

As for scropion tail it's as thing hard to get in revamp and req. debug for becoming manticore. In my mod I made some simialr to taurinum item that would give PC scorpion tail properly and made also manticores as easier to get race not using some debugging or otherwise save editong means. But still on my radar is to proper scorpion TF been added to game. I seen someone on revamp trello was linking to scorpion tf.

While I don't think, that manticores should be an actual race I too think, that it should be easier to become manticore without debugging or hacking. Oh, and there should probably be a lion TF (Enh. Whisker Fruit or complete new race). That would make manticores more manticore-ish

Ahh I see your insipirations. So there comes too rear body part too or was it inspired by other pics. My inspiration lately are from looking over monster girl encyclopedia ^^ This mantis pic is pic for manitses entry there. As funny fact if you check salamander or phoenix entires there... (as both races author meantioned he do been inspired by this source too in some way). Sadly they not yet got dracolisks mosnter girl there :/ But taking basilisks there are jsut subtype of lamia it could ends looking like lamia with many dragon features and wings.

Mostly, yes. Although I had a few other resources for my dragon and lizard-TFs.
PS: I'd suggest putting a link to that entry in your post with that pic.
About the dracolisks. After adding them I googled for pics of them and found, that theres a dracolisk mount in Dragon Age Inquisition. Well, they are way off how I think, dracolisks should look like.
And for Lamia: They should be more like naga TF continued. Maybe with enhanced snakeOil (IIRC normal snake oil can be bought from Benoit), so they'll still lose their wings, but would probably go like this:
Gain snake hair (meaning hair on head replaced by snake skin, hair growth stops + baldness) > gain snake skin (lizard skin with different skinDesc and skinAdj, needs us to consider snake skincolors) > gain snake face > gain predator arms with lamia (or simply lizard) claws. So basically they would be more powerful nagas (making them stronger aka balance them).

 

[Ormael]

Using a new armType would be mandatory, if you take look at my Scorpion claws description (Just edited my main post). And like I said before about taurs: I think, there should be a chance to go through all scorpion TFs without becoming tauric.
Fun fact: I considered to implement Super Taurinum (Obtained from Rathazul and enhanced by Lumi), which has a chance to grant you 6 legs, when your PC is already a taur.
I'll reconsider, after my patch reaches version 1.0.0 final.

Word of advice...write down somewhere ideas and work on your won pace to make 1.0.0 Feature creep can be devastating on your motivation to making stuff. I already starting to feel slowly how feature creep for Xianxia mod stuff getting near me :/


Also that idea about Super taurinum...heheh is it due to leithans from TiTS or totlay unrelated to them?


Probably when I would add it to my mod this item will be named just Taurinum (in my mod I replaced Taurinum with Centari that makeing PC full centaur aka human upper body on horse taur lower body)

While I don't think, that manticores should be an actual race I too think, that it should be easier to become manticore without debugging or hacking. Oh, and there should probably be a lion TF (Enh. Whisker Fruit or complete new race). That would make manticores more manticore-ish

I seen somewhere on trello idea for making lion morphs so as long we get them it would be natural to base cat part of manticores on them. For now we need to be sated with cat-moprh bodyparts. Also check Scropinum in Xianxi rearding becoming manticored in legal way Someday I want this item been typical scorpion TF.

Mostly, yes. Although I had a few other resources for my dragon and lizard-TFs.
PS: I'd suggest putting a link to that entry in your post with that pic.

You meant link to mantis entry of monster girl encyclipedia or link to monster girls encyclopedia wiki? I mostly use the latter anyway lately.

About the dracolisks. After adding them I googled for pics of them and found, that theres a dracolisk mount in Dragon Age Inquisition. Well, they are way off how I think, dracolisks should look like.
And for Lamia: They should be more like naga TF continued. Maybe with enhanced snakeOil (IIRC normal snake oil can be bought from Benoit), so they'll still lose their wings, but would probably go like this:
Gain snake hair (meaning hair on head replaced by snake skin, hair growth stops + baldness) > gain snake skin (lizard skin with different skinDesc and skinAdj, needs us to consider snake skincolors) > gain snake face > gain predator arms with lamia (or simply lizard) claws. So basically they would be more powerful nagas (making them stronger aka balance them).

Heh now I really want to push you to give Xianxia a try. Maybe seeing some of TF itmes there you would give me some new ideas for TF effects ^^


Litle people knew but orginal gorgon hair for Xianxia was made as hair that are set on one lenght and will never grown again as long PC not TF them to different type of hair. Well it would be natural to...kinda lively looking snakes on PC head to actualy not grow on their own.


Making new stronger strains of lamia or naga is would be...not bad idea. I can sense how more and more ideas you got with time ^^

 

[Stadler]

Word of advice...write down somewhere ideas and work on your won pace to make 1.0.0 Feature creep can be devastating on your motivation to making stuff. I already starting to feel slowly how feature creep for Xianxia mod stuff getting near me :/

I already do this occasionally. e. g. when I planned to file 4 different PRs for CoC revamp.

Also that idea about Super taurinum...heheh is it due to leithans from TiTS or totlay unrelated to them?


Probably when I would add it to my mod this item will be named just Taurinum (in my mod I replaced Taurinum with Centari that makeing PC full centaur aka human upper body on horse taur lower body)

Now, that you say it: Yes I recall, that they have 6 legs. In other words: No, not related. Try a search for 'dragontaur' @images.google.com and you'll see, there there are quite a few taurs with 6+ legs. Mostly pics from dA.


Actually I don't like your approach. If I would implement Centaurinum it'll only affect the lowerBody and legCount thus leaving the rest untouched. Meaning:

1. player.lowerBody != LOWER_BODY_TYPE_HOOFED? => TF to LOWER_BODY_TYPE_HOOFED
   
2. player.lowerBody == LOWER_BODY_TYPE_HOOFED && !player.isTaur()? => player.legCount = 4;
   

Centaurinum may be an idea, but I'll likely choose my approach. Anyway: Nuff talk about taurs. I'll keep that in mind to implement both in dragon mod >= 1.0.0

I seen somewhere on trello idea for making lion morphs so as long we get them it would be natural to base cat part of manticores on them. For now we need to be sated with cat-moprh bodyparts. Also check Scropinum in Xianxi rearding becoming manticored in legal way Someday I want this item been typical scorpion TF.

Agreed. Scorpinium from Rathazul with e. g. 1 Scorp Blood + 2 Snake Oil (the poison part). I'll keep that on my mind too.

You meant link to mantis entry of monster girl encyclipedia or link to monster girls encyclopedia wiki? I mostly use the latter anyway lately.

The former.

Litle people knew but orginal gorgon hair for Xianxia was made as hair that are set on one lenght and will never grown again as long PC not TF them to different type of hair. Well it would be natural to...kinda lively looking snakes on PC head to actualy not grow on their own.


Making new stronger strains of lamia or naga is would be...not bad idea. I can sense how more and more ideas you got with time ^^

Or just hide hair from appearance tab and skip hair growth in growHair(): if (hairType == HAIR_GORGON) return true;
Would be a simpler approach, than wading through the code and to fix multiple locations for gorgons.
Lamia PCs should still be able to choose to regain their hair growth by using Ext. Serum.

 

[Ormael]

Now, that you say it: Yes I recall, that they have 6 legs. In other words: No, not related. Try a search for 'dragontaur' @images.google.com and you'll see, there there are quite a few taurs with 6+ legs. Mostly pics from dA.

Ok I woull look slight later for those.

Actually I don't like your approach. If I would implement Centaurinum it'll only affect the lowerBody and legCount thus leaving the rest untouched. Meaning:

1. player.lowerBody != LOWER_BODY_TYPE_HOOFED? => TF to LOWER_BODY_TYPE_HOOFED
   
2. player.lowerBody == LOWER_BODY_TYPE_HOOFED && !player.isTaur()? => player.legCount = 4;
   

Centaurinum may be an idea, but I'll likely choose my approach. Anyway: Nuff talk about taurs. I'll keep that in mind to implement both in dragon mod >= 1.0.0

Well in revamp taurinum is more like item made cuz...hey we can't get taur lower body easy...I know let make some item giving only this change eventualy with some str or tou stats boosts. I made of it full-fledged TF item so it not like I made ot better. I just used it as base and made racial TF of it. As side effect it still like taurinum helps to get taur lower body easy. Nothing againt Tauriunm I got. I twas made due to need and I just made it something else...something more.

Agreed. Scorpinium from Rathazul with e. g. 1 Scorp Blood + 2 Snake Oil (the poison part). I'll keep that on my mind too.

Snake Oil x2 plus x2 Bee Honey is formula I come so far. Probably later may change it or...remove as scorpion-morphs will be added and thus making need of making this item uneeded.

The former.

Or just hide hair from appearance tab and skip hair growth in growHair(): if (hairType == HAIR_GORGON) return true;
Would be a simpler approach, than wading through the code and to fix multiple locations for gorgons.
Lamia PCs should still be able to choose to regain their hair growth by using Ext. Serum.

Umm maybe I would do it in near/far away future. For now I need to stay with soultion I made. Not perfect but it can always be changed/adjusted.


Ohh and side note of mian post. You meantioned about not making more skin types at scorpion claws part. You know adding chitin type could be good thing. I mean Scorpions, Bee, Mantises. Spiders would be then using this skin type. So aside mantises and scorpions that aren't in revamp that already 2 existing species that was almsot from the start of orginal game there. It could even be later extended for more races that are naturaly chitin covered that may been added. Still jsut a thought I throwing radomnly in case it can inspire you xD

 

[Stadler]

Maybe only for Bees and Mantises. IMHO spiders, driders and scorps should have non-human parts with carapace and the rest being human with human skin.


Oh, and while were talking about new races: I consider bats and wyverns, too with their wings being attached to their arms. Both will have two new armType's and wingType's for large and small wings. Arms and wings will TF on par (either both small, both small or both removed at once). Arms will be similar to my mantis approach: Two fingers elongated with webbings and remaining 3 fingers left clawed (or human for bats?). General attack will probably be lowered, because, well ... its a somewhat hard to handle with only 3 (clawed) fingers and the wings in the way. While bats would be mostly fluff with a possible bad end option (lose remaining fingers + rapid shrinkage to size of a common bat) wyverns will gain other benefits (Bite (supported by claws) + Aerial Claw attack (supported by their claws) + Tail Whip (possibly slightly more dmg due to their spiky tails (row of spikes on backside of the tail)) Result would be wyvern player would have to focus on using their Special and maybe their Magical abilities rather, than just mashing the attack button until the fight is over.


PS: I'm preparing to file PRs for CoC Revamp and updating my mod in preparation for RC3. So while I'm doing it. Could anyone go through my list and take a look, if the races already in CoC revamp should be altered or if I missed any race that should gain claws, too? Would be cool and before we add more and more new races to the list we should focus on whats already ingame.

 

[Mew]

These attack values seem kinda high


Is this because they aren't affected by perks?

 

[Ormael]

Aside possible been effected by Iron Fists in Revamp (or Iron Fists and Job: Brawler in Xianxia) those claw attacks aren't affected by any other perk. And additional "fists" that are needed to been used (so technicaly not holding ANY wepaon) makes base atk value 0. As you see it gives some base for such values of claws atk ^^


Anyway @Stadler after 1-2 next released versions of Xianxia I will try add as much I can of those claw attack options to my mod too. So well it just like small note I will add them eventualy to my mod (so the question could be then asked if Revamp will do it before or after Xianxia xD )

 

[Stadler]

These attack values seem kinda high


Is this because they aren't affected by perks?

No, because I mixed up my armor defense with base attack power of weapons. I'll fix that later for them to be on par with B. Sword (17 ATP). *2/3 or something, like that, so some will be slightly more powerful (≈20) and most will have less base ATP (≈13-16 for example).

 

[Ormael]

Something I recaled. Not all claws type need to have some additional effect Stadler. I see that you trying to add to almsot each type of claws some additional effect. I think making them different slight in atk value in most cases would be enough imho.

 

[Stadler]

I partially agree. Raising and lowering numbers is generally a good method to balance things.But perks and bonuses makes combat with different races more interesting. Races that are just fluff in my eyes will likely only get a fixed ATP for claw-based attacking with no or 'light' perks.

Some considerations about dual-wielding claws:
I could implement this in 2 ways:

1. Raised Base ATP similar to two-handed weapons. Attack will be like using both claws at the exact same time.
   
2. Base ATP lowered (e. g. by 30%) but 2 attacks, resulting in 4 attacks with the Double Attack perk
   

Somehow I tend to do the latter.


Opinions?

 

[Ormael]

Well I would say former. When PC fight without weapon his 'weapon' is named FISTS not FIST so I take even in orginal game fighting unarmed meant by Fen using both hands at same time to strike. So unless we want change it radical we can go for 2 attacks but that would only make code slight more complicated. Plus double attackshould  not work for unarmed attacks (I think game still allow use double attack even if PC weapon is fists). In code there is brawler perk that normaly only Urta can use that supposed to work as unarmed version for double attack.


Still either solution you go is up to you.