I don't love Paige [Rant]

[Don Kiwi]

If you like Paige and don't want to see me criticize her, do us both a favour and don't continue reading.

That aside, I have on big problem with how Paige is written.
The game assumes I love her.
Not only that, it assumes I love her more than literally all my other crewmates.This is made the whole hospital scene and her arrival on the ship extremely annoying to read. Sure, she's cool, but I don't love her. I wanted to give her eyes so I can have a badass pirate/navigator on my ship, not a fucking wife.

On breaking your sexual relations to her she literally says:
“I don’t really care who you bang, because I know, at the end of the day, even if I’m sharing this,” she accentuates, cupping your member and cum-engorged balls with her right hand, “nobody else is taking this,” she says, placing her hand over your heart."
To which the PC (in their internal dialogue) replies
That’s true: you don’t have the same connection with the rest of your crew that you do with Paige, and she’s absolutely right.

Why? How would the game know that? I love HER more than Penny, Anno, Bess and Sera?
It takes away player agency and just assumes that you MUST love her. Fuck that.

I've noticed her entire character was written by B. Is this a theme in their work? Has he mentioned why he does this? Is it just bad writing? Am I just an idiot for caring about this?

 

[Evil]

Well put it this way, Steele loves all their companions, some of them in wildly different ways.

In Paige's case, Steele has created a deeper connection than just a sexual one, Steele gave her back her sight. She adores Steele for that and lets be honest, would Steele have paid half a million credits to restore her eyes if they didn't at least have some love for her?

 

[Don Kiwi]

would Steele have paid half a million credits to restore her eyes if they didn't at least have some love for her?

I did

 

[null_blank]

would Steele have paid half a million credits to restore her eyes if they didn't at least have some love for her?

Well...I mean it's just 500k...

 

[Don Kiwi]

Well...I mean it's just 500k...

exactly. I did her stuff after finishing Myrellion, I had a decent bit to spare after selling all the gems

 

[KAZEARC]

for me at least when i play no matter if its TiTs or CoC2 i usually only have a intimate relationship with only one person. i tend to not have that many crewmembers usealle being my lover then azra,olympia and maybe a few others based on what i'm doing.
as far as LOVE goes that only real love show in game from my playthroughs is paige,penny,frosty,bess,kiro and mirrin. there are more but those are the ones that stand out to me.
paige love steele coz he/she did something that she can never repay and made her dreams come true even if it was more for a act of kindness over love it's still a huge thing to her and she will love you for that act alone.

 

[Don Kiwi]

Spoiler

for me at least when i play no matter if its TiTs or CoC2 i usually only have a intimate relationship with only one person. i tend to not have that many crewmembers usealle being my lover then azra,olympia and maybe a few others based on what i'm doing.
as far as LOVE goes that only real love show in game from my playthroughs is paige,penny,frosty,bess,kiro and mirrin. there are more but those are the ones that stand out to me.
paige love steele coz he/she did something that she can never repay and made her dreams come true even if it was more for a act of kindness over love it's still a huge thing to her and she will love you for that act alone.

That's nice, and if it was just her saying she loved me that would be fine, but my character responds in kind and even denounces their love for the other crewmembers without the player being consulted. Not everyone plays this game with monogamy in mind and I personally wasn't interested in a romantic relationship with Paige.

 

[Evil]

Steele doesn't denounce the rest of the crew, they just say that they don't have the same connection as they do with Paige. Which is a completely different thing.

 

[Don Kiwi]

Steele doesn't denounce the rest of the crew, they just say that they don't have the same connection as they do with Paige. Which is a completely different thing.

I said "denounces their love for the rest of the crew". The phrasing "not the same connection" implies that they care less for the others.

 

[Emerald]

I said "denounces their love for the rest of the crew". The phrasing "not the same connection" implies that they care less for the others.

No it doesn't, your path to get Paige onto your ship is a whole different scenario to Anno, Bess, and Sera where you can technically easily get them on board. You have to actually work for Paige's new eyes and spend a heap on her to get to that point compared to some others. (Yes ik it's easy to get 500k but for those that don't cheat the system it takes a lil' bit)
If you're gonna actively pursue a romance path to a character you don't like that way you should expect some disconnect. But Paige's whole thing with Steele is not the same as the others, hence the line. She had surgery and all and you practically payed for that after sexing her/pursuing her. So speaking on Steele's part, that would imply that they care that much.

It's not at all saying Steele don't love your crewmates, nor see them as lesser, it is in fact accurate that your love for Paige is different than the others. You're not paying for a fricking eye surgery (Which as far as I'm concerned is a major surgery, tech shit or not) with others like you do with her, that alone's a lot to do for someone.
(Before anyone says it, I'm not saying you can't help a surgery for a friend either, but seeing as it's clearly tied to Paige's romance here, well what'd you expect)

 

[Evil]

Exactly.

Each of your crew loves Steele for different reasons, but how each of them gets on board the ship doesn't diminish the love between Steele and said crewmate.
Just a few examples:
- Anno - Steele risks their neck to get Anno off Tavros, be it from deactivating the bomb or just picking her up as the planet cracks apart.
- Reaha - Steele buys her contract and can get her off the pleasure patches she was forced to use and was addicted to.
- Yammi - showed her basic decency and helped her when her slave contract was increased through no fault of her own.
- Kase - Got him out of a shitty contract and into a better position.

The list goes on. Steele might be polyamorous, but that just means they have a lot of love to give. So the love they show Anno doesn't take away from the love they show Yammi or Reaha or anyone else. That Paige's situation is a little more vocal doesn't change that Steele loves their harem equally, otherwise they wouldn't have them on the Pimpwagon, I mean ship.

 

[KAZEARC]

Exactly.

Each of your crew loves Steele for different reasons, but how each of them gets on board the ship doesn't diminish the love between Steele and said crewmate.
Just a few examples:
- Anno - Steele risks their neck to get Anno off Tavros, be it from deactivating the bomb or just picking her up as the planet cracks apart.
- Reaha - Steele buys her contract and can get her off the pleasure patches she was forced to use and was addicted to.
- Yammi - showed her basic decency and helped her when her slave contract was increased through no fault of her own.
- Kase - Got him out of a shitty contract and into a better position.

The list goes on. Steele might be polyamorous, but that just means they have a lot of love to give. So the love they show Anno doesn't take away from the love they show Yammi or Reaha or anyone else. That Paige's situation is a little more vocal doesn't change that Steele loves their harem equally, otherwise they wouldn't have them on the Pimpwagon, I mean ship.

penny- helps her get out of debt.
ardia- saves her from becoming a slave.
amber- gives her a home and some to take care of her so she is not alone in the wild.
bess- lots of things.
kiro-saves her from becoming a bimbo sex slave.(to be fair i do kinda like her bimbo form.)

what makes paige difference is because she only that the surgery because steele what her to be happy and that she has at that point somewhat fallen for them. the surgery make her full in love coz that is a huge thing and that bond from that you can't have with anyone else.
think of it like you helped a friend with something like that and they said that there is a bond that you have because of that. would that fuck you yo friendship because of something like that.
please tell me that her futa expack is coming soon.

 

[Don Kiwi]

what makes paige difference is because she only that the surgery because steele what her to be happy and that she has at that point somewhat fallen for them. the surgery make her full in love coz that is a huge thing and that bond from that you can't have with anyone else.
think of it like you helped a friend with something like that and they said that there is a bond that you have because of that. would that fuck you yo friendship because of something like that.
please tell me that her futa expack is coming soon.

The list goes on. Steele might be polyamorous, but that just means they have a lot of love to give. So the love they show Anno doesn't take away from the love they show Yammi or Reaha or anyone else. That Paige's situation is a little more vocal doesn't change that Steele loves their harem equally, otherwise they wouldn't have them on the Pimpwagon, I mean ship.

No it doesn't, your path to get Paige onto your ship is a whole different scenario to Anno, Bess, and Sera where you can technically easily get them on board. You have to actually work for Paige's new eyes and spend a heap on her to get to that point compared to some others. (Yes ik it's easy to get 500k but for those that don't cheat the system it takes a lil' bit)
If you're gonna actively pursue a romance path to a character you don't like that way you should expect some disconnect. But Paige's whole thing with Steele is not the same as the others, hence the line. She had surgery and all and you practically payed for that after sexing her/pursuing her. So speaking on Steele's part, that would imply that they care that much.

It's not at all saying Steele don't love your crewmates, nor see them as lesser, it is in fact accurate that your love for Paige is different than the others. You're not paying for a fricking eye surgery (Which as far as I'm concerned is a major surgery, tech shit or not) with others like you do with her, that alone's a lot to do for someone.
(Before anyone says it, I'm not saying you can't help a surgery for a friend either, but seeing as it's clearly tied to Paige's romance here, well what'd you expect)

I just want a more casual option with her, I think that my character would have helped her without romantic pursuit, as they have done with all the examples you listed. I'll probably skip her next time, which is a shame, because she is a cool character. But that doesn't mean I love her.

 

[Evil]

So don't talk to her after you recruit her.

 

[Emerald]

I just want a more casual option with her, I think that my character would have helped her without romantic pursuit, as they have done with all the examples you listed. I'll probably skip her next time, which is a shame, because she is a cool character. But that doesn't mean I love her.

The thing is it's not "Your character", it's Steele. And like Steele the writing for them is all over the place and you shouldn't expect them or characters involved with them to act the way you want.
You sexed her and went out of your way to give her new eyes. Congrats ya got a romance, don't talk to the character after recruiting, fr it's that simple. :U

 

[KAZEARC]

So don't talk to her after you recruit her.

the way i see it is the one that sleeps in bed with you is your lover that one you care for. so just have on the ship to do her job.

 

[KAZEARC]

The thing is it's not "Your character", it's Steele. And like Steele the writing for them is all over the place and you shouldn't expect them or characters involved with them to act the way you want.
You sexed her and went out of your way to give her new eyes. Congrats ya got a romance, don't talk to the character after recruiting, fr it's that simple. :U

if i was in paige's shoes i would fall in love with steele.
steele shows up to her class nitpicks her way of teaching, becomes friends, she opens up alot, she fucks you coz she has not in 7 years, you giver her eyes back. that is a love story. and a better one that what is was given to read as a kid or in high school.

 

[Kesil]

I'd say it's a mixture of "waifus gonna waifu" writing + Steele money-saving everyone and their kaithrit pals in a shithole universe. Just like you'll keep on reading that x character is the best fuck Steele ever had.

 

[Don Kiwi]

So don't talk to her after you recruit her.

the thing I mentioned is immediately after the surgery, before she enters the ship

The thing is it's not "Your character", it's Steele. And like Steele the writing for them is all over the place and you shouldn't expect them or characters involved with them to act the way you want.
You sexed her and went out of your way to give her new eyes. Congrats ya got a romance, don't talk to the character after recruiting, fr it's that simple. :U

disagree, it is the player character and the game has an array of choice and customization for most relations. Paige being a one-route character was not predictable from the outset.

the way i see it is the one that sleeps in bed with you is your lover that one you care for. so just have on the ship to do her job.

that's a nice headcanon, but not what the game says.

again, I'll likely skip her next time. I seem to be the only one who feels this way, so I guess it's just not for me.

 

[Don Kiwi]

I'd say it's a mixture of "waifus gonna waifu" writing + Steele money-saving everyone and their kaithrit pals in a shithole universe. Just like you'll keep on reading that x character is the best fuck Steele ever had.

That seems about right. I still don't like how openly the PC agrees, but fair enough.

 

[KAZEARC]

then just block that part out. that game is made with a open relationship, fuck every hole you can or get fucked by every dick in mind over just 2 people tougher forever.
my head can is that you sleep with you be with got penny in my bed then penny is my lover same goes from paige and the others.

paige is my favorite npc because her relationship feels the most real coz of what you do for her and she loves for you both that and you.for others, penny love the player because of debt or making her a slut for her dick or both. and the others are all sex based most of the time or a fetch quest.

 

[Kesil]

I still don't like how openly the PC agrees, but fair enough.

I dislike it as well. The "it's not you, it's Steele - the text can't predict how every player will react" reasoning feels like an excuse at times.

 

[B]

It's a valid criticism to have. Paige was the second submission I wrote for TiTS, way back in 2016, and at the time I wasn't as confident in the tone or direction of my writing for the game. While it's true that love can take many shapes, and what Steele has with Paige is different than what they'll have with anyone else, not only was that not conveyed as well as it could be, but it's also putting words in the player's mouth through Steele.

There's definitely an element of "it's a porn game, and Paige is trying to waifu it up real hard" to it, but if I were to write Paige today, I would have handled it a bit differently.

 

[KAZEARC]

waifu it up hard lol. you play the nose boop game in bed. best fucking scene in the game END OF.

 

[Don Kiwi]

It's a valid criticism to have. Paige was the second submission I wrote for TiTS, way back in 2016, and at the time I wasn't as confident in the tone or direction of my writing for the game. While it's true that love can take many shapes, and what Steele has with Paige is different than what they'll have with anyone else, not only was that not conveyed as well as it could be, but it's also putting words in the player's mouth through Steele.

There's definitely an element of "it's a porn game, and Paige is trying to waifu it up real hard" to it, but if I were to write Paige today, I would have handled it a bit differently.

Hey, other than that she was written pretty well. Thank you for reading and replying too!

 

[Mlem]

The issue with Paige is that it doesnt consider that the player found love with a different character
Personally, I think my Steele formed a deeper bond with Nova, his Gray Goo Companion
I got Paige and said all the stuff because I just want the limber perk
And yes, half a million dollars? Psshhh
Chump change lmao, especially for a perk that good.

 

[Milkman]

The issue with Paige is that it doesnt consider that the player found love with a different character
Personally, I think my Steele formed a deeper bond with Nova, his Gray Goo Companion
I got Paige and said all the stuff because I just want the limber perk
And yes, half a million dollars? Psshhh
Chump change lmao, especially for a perk that good.

I mean it is pretty hard to form a stronger bond than basically becoming a symbiotic union of flesh and machine. Heh Nova is the only companion that gets to cuddle up to and share nearly all of Steele's experiences 24/7.

 

[Mlem]

I mean it is pretty hard to form a stronger bond than basically becoming a symbiotic union of flesh and machine. Heh Nova is the only companion that gets to cuddle up to and share nearly all of Steele's experiences 24/7.

Plus she is very cute and lovable
Also the only one that fights alongside you in a way that doesn't get in the way
Not to mention that she also grows alongside you, with the experiences that you gain along the way.

In a way, she is the perfect partner, sure she is usually just like 1 to 2 aspects away from the best available outfits,
And she isn't even the best armor I should be wearing given I'm playing Smuggler, which takes greater advantage off evasion
But that's kind of irrelevant when she can brighten up your day with just a few words every now and again.
A real cutie that one~

 

[Throg]

This is really more a criticism of the writing choices than Paige's character, and I don't think it's an unfair criticism, seeing as so many of the relationships do offer that choice.

That said... ya don't love your friends? You can interpret her being "in your heart" (for lack of better phrase) in a lot of different ways; the important thing is that, whatever your dynamic is with her, you aren't about to drop or replace her. You've established a bond that is unique, if not necessarily romantic, just like you do with all your crew/friends/romantic partners. Even if your love with Paige was established as entirely platonic, your connection wouldn't be "the same" as your connection with Anno, Kase, etc. That's how human... or... sapient relationships work. Having different ones between different people doesn't diminish one or the other. Nobody on your crew can replace Paige, just like Paige can't replace anyone else on your crew. At least, that's how I took the statement, even though I adore her.

Another way to think of it is, is the PC taking Paige's heart from Kiro? Pretty clearly not, but the PC doesn't lose anything for it, and neither does Kiro.

This may be part of why (from a writing perspective) she doesn't actually say the "L" word to the PC until after you've decided she's your sleep partner on your ship (or at least after her surgery; haven't tried taking a naptime in her apartment after the surgery to see if you get the sleepytime menu- then again, I could be remembering wrong altogether).

More to the point, if you are thinking of recruiting her as a mere asset rather than at least a friend, regardless of how much money you spent, does it really make sense that a character like Paige would jump ship to tag along on your adventure? Is she the type to be bought? Gonna say "no", given how cautious she is to even reveal the fact that she's blind- her trust in a situation like that would be nil.

While a choice to make it clear you view your relationship as casual would be nice, the writing does make sense, and I never got the impression that any of the way it was orchestrated was done clumsily or unintentionally.

 

[Tide Hunter]

Another way to think of it is, is the PC taking Paige's heart from Kiro? Pretty clearly not, but the PC doesn't lose anything for it, and neither does Kiro.

Steele ain't taking Paige's heart from Kiro, they broke up ages ago because they didn't mesh and they don't express romantic interest in each other despite sexual attraction when they met.