Zil-Human Cross Breeds

[Breider32]

According to the Zil Codex entry, Zil/Human children are chimeras rather than hybrids, can anyone elaborate on that?

 

[Krynh]

They're going to be hybrids instead I think. There was a big 'ol debate about this on Misty's thread about Preggo zill.

 

[Breider32]

They're going to be hybrids instead I think. There was a big 'ol debate about this on Misty's thread about Preggo zill.

OK, do you have a link to that thread?

 

[Nonesuch]

I don't really know what the original intention behind the "chimeric" zil children was. It's not biological chimerism, it's supposed to be reminiscent of mythical chimerism, where one organism is made up of non-blended parts of multiple organisms. So zil-human children are, according to the Codex, supposed to be strange and mismatched combinations of human and zil features without any hybridization or blending. So they could just have like a totally normal human head on a zil torso with human arms and zil legs. 

Think you're taking that way too pedantically. Clearly "cute hybrid" was the intention when that was written.

 

[Nik_van_Rijn]

With a little bit of creativity, the bee babies can still rate fairly high on the "snowflake meter" without resorting to strange and potentially disturbing stuff like chimerism. I'm fairly certain the one hypothetical zil-naleen chimera mentioned at some point is described in less-than-flattering terms. A scrambled Mr. Potato Head is not what I think of when I think "cute."

I won't argue that your idea of hybrid bee-babies isn't cute and fleshed out, because it is. ^_^


But it's worth noting that the actual Zil Codex entry doesn't go into the details of how hymeric children of a zil and a human would look like aside from namedropping the concept itself. Such information shouldn't be even available considering that Rush worlds don't get surveyed or researched in any meaningful capacity prior to the moment the hordes of space bums and corporate whores get a free reign over it.


So between 7 months gestation time and 2 months since the beginning of the current Rush, the couldn't have possibly been any crosbreeds born, unless we consider some super potent pregnancy speed enchancing methods.


There is also the fact that the zil-naleen hybrids are described in the naleen Codex entry and are deliberately relegated to being something allegedly reported. On top of that, 'cumbersome' may not be a flattering characteristic, but it's not particularly negative either.


Lastly, I'm quite curious as to why do you oppose to the inclusion of chymerism in this instance, while presumably being OK with it when it comes to something like Naleen or pretty much any monster girl ever (including harpies )?

 

[Breider32]

A "cute hybrid" would be what I'm writing.  My zil-human babies have human skin and hair, but are otherwise normal-ish zil (there are some other differences, but those are the only ones I'm communicating in-game). While those details probably seem completely superfluous, it's worth noting that the actual composition of pure-blooded zil hair and skin is probably fairly different from human hair and skin. So the zil hybrids could still have some unique elements to them. Maybe their skin is much softer, as well as having a completely different pigmentation, or maybe the oils in their human hair smell different to other zil. Maybe that exoticism is considered quite attractive and appealing (zil obviously enjoy getting it on with other races).


With a little bit of creativity, the bee babies can still rate fairly high on the "snowflake meter" without resorting to strange and potentially disturbing stuff like chimerism. I'm fairly certain the one hypothetical zil-naleen chimera mentioned at some point is described in less-than-flattering terms. A scrambled Mr. Potato Head is not what I think of when I think "cute."  

Thanks for clearing that up for me, things make a lot more sense now on that end! Hope your other project goes well so you can get to the pregnancy stuff soon!

 

[Breider32]

Do note that my name is purple, not red. That just means I'm a volunteer contributor and my word is no more meaningful than the average forum user's. The zil pregnancy expansion is very [WIP] at the moment, and there's still a chance Fen could come in and completely rearrange the whole thing, or just say flat-out that my content won't work. I'm not expecting that, but it is possible. The only people that can give you "official" answers to any TiTS-related question have red names. And really, Savin and Gedan are likely to refer you to Fen himself, because he is the perverted mastermind behind this whole thing. It's literally just him.


Speaking of @Savin, can I get an official word on this zil chimerism thing from you? Do I need to go back to Fen and ask him very directly about this? I thought it was handled the last time I asked you guys about it, but the more it's brought up, the more uncertain I get. I'd really love a direct "yay" or "nay" on whether or not giving zil chimerism the axe is an okay thing to do. I can try and work with it if Fen wants it to stay, but I sort of need to know that ahead of time.

Well, you've still been more of a help to me than anyone else so far, so thanks for that.

 

[Breider32]

A "cute hybrid" would be what I'm writing.  My zil-human babies have human skin and hair, but are otherwise normal-ish zil (there are some other differences, but those are the only ones I'm communicating in-game). While those details probably seem completely superfluous, it's worth noting that the actual composition of pure-blooded zil hair and skin is probably fairly different from human hair and skin. So the zil hybrids could still have some unique elements to them. Maybe their skin is much softer, as well as having a completely different pigmentation, or maybe the oils in their human hair smell different to other zil. Maybe that exoticism is considered quite attractive and appealing (zil obviously enjoy getting it on with other races).


With a little bit of creativity, the bee babies can still rate fairly high on the "snowflake meter" without resorting to strange and potentially disturbing stuff like chimerism. I'm fairly certain the one hypothetical zil-naleen chimera mentioned at some point is described in less-than-flattering terms. A scrambled Mr. Potato Head is not what I think of when I think "cute."  

Do you think the individuals with the red text names will be mad if I try messaging them directly?

 

[Breider32]

Um... Well, you're not really supposed to message Fen or Gedan about forum stuff. Savin might be able to help you, but I can't really recommend PM'ing him, either. 


Everyone with a red name is up to their eyeballs in work, and they have a lot of different things to juggle.

Yeah, I figured they wouldn't like PMs, that's why I was asking. So I should just hope that they see my questions and can solidly confirm and/or deny them, or are user page comments OK? I think I figured out my problem with the quote system BTW.

 

[Breider32]

That's pretty much it, yeah.  


I mean, you could tag them with the @(their name) system if you really want their specific input, but I wouldn't overuse that.

Yeah, I don't wanna seem like I'm spamming them. If I do that, I'll probably just ask if what you've already said is more or less correct, keep it simple.

 

[Noob Salad]

I think I've possibly used @ more than any other posted here, and I haven't gotten banned yet.


So yeah, as long as you're not as bad as me.

 

[Breider32]

That's pretty much it, yeah.  


I mean, you could tag them with the @(their name) system if you really want their specific input, but I wouldn't overuse that.

@Savin, is IVIysteriousPerson correct with their statements about Zil-Human cross breeds? If you're not sure, who should I ask? BTW, ignore the quote above, the site seems to be acting up and I can't get rid of that.

 

[Krynh]

and my word is no more meaningful than the average forum user's

Better written though and a lot more in-depth

I think I've possibly used @ more than any other posted here, and I haven't gotten banned yet.


So yeah, as long as you're not as bad as me.

You're a special snowflake though

 

[Nik_van_Rijn]

It's a pretty negative label. Almost explicitly so.

Point. I hope those smarty pants are nice and comfortable.

But that's not something unique to zil and naleen. That's applicable to pretty much all absurdly incompatible interspecies reproduction in TiTS. And, as far as I'm aware, the zil are the only race in the entire game that mention chimerism. That makes them a weird outlier, and it comes off as rather messy to me. The long and short of it is that the chimerism is a stupid semantics issue and dropping it won't really change anything other than lending some small sense of uniformity to the way interspecies breeding works in TiTS.


This little detail is really starting to grate on me. I had no idea people would be so attached to something so utterly inconsequential. It's not like I want to take away their honey or something...

I don't think that your suggestion had any strong opposition to begin with. The people that argued with you and nitpicked at your idea did it not because they were particularly fond of that bit of lore, but for the hell of it. Like in many cases on this forum.


With that shift from focusing on the awful implications being a chimera can have for poor cross-breed babies to the lore consistency and semantics issue will most likely make this change go down even more smoothly.

 

[Savin]

Speaking of @Savin, can I get an official word on this zil chimerism thing from you?

And I will reiterate the zil are not my species. Ask Fen.

 

[Breider32]

I know, that's why I asked if I should go ask Fen very directly.  


*sigh* I'll save it for when I'm actually working on that project, at least. Take some time to collect any and all potential problems into one neat little pile and just present all of to to Fen at once, that way I don't have to bother him every other day when I start working on it in earnest again...

Hey, what do you think a human/nyrea cross would look like (or a human,nyrea and red myr cross with Renvra's children)?

 

[Ormael]

@Savin So there is not any one unified stand on each specific race chimerism depending on writer for said race to decide? I had impression there was some already set up general rule no matter if Fen, you, Coach or someone else wrote race -_-'

 

[Nik_van_Rijn]

Probably mostly like a nyrea. Humans sort of have a trope of being "weak breeders" in stuff like this, if for no other reason than human traits are rather boring. Maybe a nyrea with normal human hair instead of the spiky stuff pure nyrea have? Might change something small like normal human ears, too. Little details, but mostly nyrea overall. That's what I'd do, at least.

I'd also guess that in case of human/nyrea/red myr hybrid you won't allow the lust venom to be inherited?

 

[NotYouNorI]

I'd also guess that in case of human/nyrea/red myr hybrid you won't allow the lust venom to be inherited?

Maybe watered down to just having aphrodisiacal qualities without its addicting and pacifying lethargy inducing effect.

 

[Lashcharge]

Probably mostly like a nyrea. Humans sort of have a trope of being "weak breeders" in stuff like this, if for no other reason than human traits are rather boring. Maybe a nyrea with normal human hair instead of the spiky stuff pure nyrea have? Might change something small like normal human ears, too. Little details, but mostly nyrea overall. That's what I'd do, at least.

You should mess with a few more stuff, like giving them human eyes or tongue, dropping the chitin entirely or even do hybrid genital like vahn has.

 

[Savin]

@Savin So there is not any one unified stand on each specific race chimerism depending on writer for said race to decide? I had impression there was some already set up general rule no matter if Fen, you, Coach or someone else wrote race -_-'

There might be, for all I know. I don't care, since I don't write much pregnancy stuff.