Thanks for Sophora!

[FaithoftheFallen]

The wiki lists one William as the writer for them (are there specific pronouns for "vengeance?"), and I'd just like to say thanks! I absolutely love the idea of their character and their attitude. Something about the never saying a word, very lethal combatant, and complete mood shift for the sex scenes makes them a super interesting character.

And their art is damn badass.

They've got some wicked doomslayer vibes, which in the headcannon I'm running right now (Stormguard conqueror), makes for such a wicked foil, and its not an enemy that just flops over when beaten, the whole post-encounter is filled with the same ultra seriousness! The descriptions given of a moment of sudden silence before they attack, and the descriptions of the ice-blade doing damage even through armour and shields gives me such a psycher vibe, and the self-corrupting semen is a nice touch. makes me want to dig into their character, backstory, and history more! Do they work for the Jumpers as implied? Are they basically an ultra modded super soldier? Is the corruptive semen an inherited or modded bit? Are they so frustrated because they've been shipped halfway across the galaxy for revenge against Steele, and they've had to leave their harem of others that have had their self removed behind?

Just awesome!

 

[XBoxMaster131]

The wiki lists one William as the writer for them (are there specific pronouns for "vengeance?"), and I'd just like to say thanks! I absolutely love the idea of their character and their attitude. Something about the never saying a word, very lethal combatant, and complete mood shift for the sex scenes makes them a super interesting character.

And their art is damn badass.

They've got some wicked doomslayer vibes, which in the headcannon I'm running right now (Stormguard conqueror), makes for such a wicked foil, and its not an enemy that just flops over when beaten, the whole post-encounter is filled with the same ultra seriousness! The descriptions given of a moment of sudden silence before they attack, and the descriptions of the ice-blade doing damage even through armour and shields gives me such a psycher vibe, and the self-corrupting semen is a nice touch. makes me want to dig into their character, backstory, and history more! Do they work for the Jumpers as implied? Are they basically an ultra modded super soldier? Is the corruptive semen an inherited or modded bit? Are they so frustrated because they've been shipped halfway across the galaxy for revenge against Steele, and they've had to leave their harem of others that have had their self removed behind?

Just awesome!

Too bad we'll never seen any more of her cuz the devs needed to Shanghai William to help rush out Phaedra.

I'm sorry but I just had to lay that out, I can't be the only one thinking it.

 

[Nora Steele]

Too bad we'll never seen any more of her cuz the devs needed to Shanghai William to help rush out Phaedra.

I'm sorry but I just had to lay that out, I can't be the only one thinking it.

You aren't. I am hoping against hope that he can tie up her story, but I am not holding my breath. I stopped playing the game two years ago when the only thing in progress was the Javascript conversion. I'm back now, but I'm not holding onto faith with as firm a grip as I used to.

 

[XBoxMaster131]

You aren't. I am hoping against hope that he can tie up her story, but I am not holding my breath. I stopped playing the game two years ago when the only thing in progress was the Javascript conversion. I'm back now, but I'm not holding onto faith with as firm a grip as I used to.

Things have been downhill for a while.

I'm hoping too but.... man..... it's not easy

 

[Nora Steele]

Things have been downhill for a while.

I'm hoping too but.... man..... it's not easy

I can only imagine. ;-;

 

[Couch]

Too bad we'll never seen any more of her cuz the devs needed to Shanghai William to help rush out Phaedra.

I'm sorry but I just had to lay that out, I can't be the only one thinking it.

I want to point out that rushing out Phaedra's main story is the correct and responsible course of action. If FenCo back when TiTS development began over a decade ago was as professional as it is now, then they probably would have thought to start development by blitzing through the entire main questline as quickly as possible, then gone back and filled out planets with side content over time. This would have allowed writers to script their projects with a sense of where the main story went, and what events and parts of lore had to be indelible, and it would have meant the game wound up being equally content-rich throughout. Instead TiTS followed the CoC model, with development taking place mostly or entirely on one planet at a time. This had a lot of mostly negative effects on development, among these that this model fosters the community sentiment you're expressing, that once the story is completed then the game is over.

There are many reasons why most community writers have a limited shelf life, some of which are inescapable facts of life, but some of which FenCo's early business practices were responsible for and they've made major efforts to correct over the years. The game now is better to write for than the game when I was an active writer. Projects now get coded in a reasonable amount of time, for instance, which was not true circa 2016, when you could expect to wait 8, 10, 12 months for a project to actually get coded unless you got lucky enough for Fen to personally fast-track it. Knowing you were writing things that would take so long to actually get implemented that there was a significant chance of it just being forgotten outright was a significant factor in writer burnout.

Another was that the game only really developed one planet at a time, and development spent about two years on any given planet, meaning if you didn't like the theme of the planet, you weren't going to be motivated to write content there. This got to be a problem during the New Texas/Myrellion years, because those planets were controversial, but they were also the new hotness and you had to write stuff that went there if you wanted to be part of expanding the frontier of the gameworld. There's a reason that 90% of my own writing output went to Uveto even though I was around for significantly longer than that: because I wanted to write for that planet and I didn't want to write for Myrellion. I left shortly after that for other facts-of-life reasons, of course, but if Uveto had been available from the beginning, I could have written more during the time that I was active, and I might not have left so many loose ends in my content which I now regret including.

It's also had significant effects on even the staff writers. Savin wound up making both Saendra and Kara, both of whom are basically the same character, in part because there wasn't enough main progression available yet to justify continuing Saendra's storyline in the way that he wanted. And of course Kara's storyline then also stalled out because there also wasn't enough main progression available yet to justify continuing her story either. Instead of one very good story from one of the best writers, we got two half-baked ones.

In short, having William working on Phaedra's story instead of a personal project may be disappointing if you would rather see that personal project come first, but it's significantly better for the game, and if it had been the development model from the beginning then TiTS would probably be in a healthier place now. Hopefully whatever comes next after TiTS will be better for the change.

 

[XBoxMaster131]

I want to point out that rushing out Phaedra's main story is the correct and responsible course of action. If FenCo back when TiTS development began over a decade ago was as professional as it is now, then they probably would have thought to start development by blitzing through the entire main questline as quickly as possible, then gone back and filled out planets with side content over time. This would have allowed writers to script their projects with a sense of where the main story went, and what events and parts of lore had to be indelible, and it would have meant the game wound up being equally content-rich throughout. Instead TiTS followed the CoC model, with development taking place mostly or entirely on one planet at a time. This had a lot of mostly negative effects on development, among these that this model fosters the community sentiment you're expressing, that once the story is completed then the game is over.

There are many reasons why most community writers have a limited shelf life, some of which are inescapable facts of life, but some of which FenCo's early business practices were responsible for and they've made major efforts to correct over the years. The game now is better to write for than the game when I was an active writer. Projects now get coded in a reasonable amount of time, for instance, which was not true circa 2016, when you could expect to wait 8, 10, 12 months for a project to actually get coded unless you got lucky enough for Fen to personally fast-track it. Knowing you were writing things that would take so long to actually get implemented that there was a significant chance of it just being forgotten outright was a significant factor in writer burnout.

Another was that the game only really developed one planet at a time, and development spent about two years on any given planet, meaning if you didn't like the theme of the planet, you weren't going to be motivated to write content there. This got to be a problem during the New Texas/Myrellion years, because those planets were controversial, but they were also the new hotness and you had to write stuff that went there if you wanted to be part of expanding the frontier of the gameworld. There's a reason that 90% of my own writing output went to Uveto even though I was around for significantly longer than that: because I wanted to write for that planet and I didn't want to write for Myrellion. I left shortly after that for other facts-of-life reasons, of course, but if Uveto had been available from the beginning, I could have written more during the time that I was active, and I might not have left so many loose ends in my content which I now regret including.

It's also had significant effects on even the staff writers. Savin wound up making both Saendra and Kara, both of whom are basically the same character, in part because there wasn't enough main progression available yet to justify continuing Saendra's storyline in the way that he wanted. And of course Kara's storyline then also stalled out because there also wasn't enough main progression available yet to justify continuing her story either. Instead of one very good story from one of the best writers, we got two half-baked ones.

In short, having William working on Phaedra's story instead of a personal project may be disappointing if you would rather see that personal project come first, but it's significantly better for the game, and if it had been the development model from the beginning then TiTS would probably be in a healthier place now. Hopefully whatever comes next after TiTS will be better for the change.

I suppose you do have a point. But regardless or the reasons why, I don't like seeing someone hard work just get thrown out like that. If what I've heard is right William have the Sophora content basically half done. And now all of that is gone. It's a damn shame, and just plain wasteful and disrespectful towards William.

Be honest man, as someone who has seen the inside and is willing to lay it down hard: what do you think is the future for the game? Are they just gonna crank out Phaedra as fast as possible to get it over with? Are they gonna stick to TiTS to try and get things in better shape? Or are they just gonna let it sputter out? And will there even be anything after this?

Sorry for slamming you with so many questions like that but these have been bugging me for a while and idk if I'll get another chance to ask and maybe get an answer.

 

[Lolipop]

In short, having William working on Phaedra's story

Except that's not what happened. They had William prioritize his personal project over Phaedra's story. Then, when william was nearly done with the project, and what was already implemented could easily have been placed in the game, Fen threw a hissy fit, axed everything, and sent him to work of Phaedra for whatever the fuck reason.

The content already exists. Fen just doesn't want to code it Makes no sense. If you wanna prioritize the main plot, ya prioritize the main plot. Not spend a good few months on a side project and throw it out

 

[Couch]

I suppose you do have a point. But regardless or the reasons why, I don't like seeing someone hard work just get thrown out like that. If what I've heard is right William have the Sophora content basically half done. And now all of that is gone. It's a damn shame, and just plain wasteful and disrespectful towards William.

Be honest man, as someone who has seen the inside and is willing to lay it down hard: what do you think is the future for the game? Are they just gonna crank out Phaedra as fast as possible to get it over with? Are they gonna stick to TiTS to try and get things in better shape? Or are they just gonna let it sputter out? And will there even be anything after this?

Sorry for slamming you with so many questions like that but these have been bugging me for a while and idk if I'll get another chance to ask and maybe get an answer.

I don't have any special insider knowledge. I'm not on the Discord, I haven't seriously written for the game in years, and I never had a strong relationship with Fenoxo. Nearly everyone I did have a strong relationship with has stopped writing for various reasons. However, since you asked me to lay it down hard: if you think that there won't be anything after this, then you're a fool. This is a business with employees, this is how they make their livelihoods.

Now, will the future see a mountain of talented writers return like there were eight years ago? Maybe. Probably not, unless there's a substantial effort at community outreach, but it's certainly possible that a new game would bring in a new community. It's also possible that some older writers will eventually find themselves in a position where they want to write again, and find that TiTS or the game after TiTS has new space for them to explore, and you'll see a renaissance to some degree. I don't think anyone who comes back will be as prolific as they were, but they might have a gem or two left in them.

Even with the reduction in writing output, I expect TiTS updates to continue official development for at least a year or two after the main story concludes while development begins on the next project, with gradually waning support from the staff writers over that time period as more and more of them are pulled over to the new game. Unlike CoC, which was held together with glue to the point where it's not surprising that work on it ended immediately, TiTS has a higher likelihood of continued support following end of official development as long as there's new community content for it. It probably won't continue forever, but nothing does.

 

[Wafflesnake]

Except that's not what happened. They had William prioritize his personal project over Phaedra's story. Then, when william was nearly done with the project, and what was already implemented could easily have been placed in the game, Fen threw a hissy fit, axed everything, and sent him to work of Phaedra for whatever the fuck reason.

The content already exists. Fen just doesn't want to code it Makes no sense. If you wanna prioritize the main plot, ya prioritize the main plot. Not spend a good few months on a side project and throw it out

this is making a lot of unfounded assumptions. both savin and fenoxo have stated concerns in the public discord chat about how sophora pushes the line of what TiTS is supposed to be about. this is not a hissy fit, or a power trip. you can bet that if they were willing to express their concerns in the public chat after the decision was made, then there was definitely a much longer, legitimate discussion about it privately.

william themselves said that sophora was an experiment, one that didn't end up fitting in game.

nothing has been "axed" william has stated that it's just in stasis and will not be deleted. additionally, fenoxo even said he's willing to work with will to make sophora fit in the game

if you want to say you had no way of knowing because you're not in the discord, don't make unfounded assumptions.

 

[XBoxMaster131]

I want to point out that rushing out Phaedra's main story is the correct and responsible course of action. If FenCo back when TiTS development began over a decade ago was as professional as it is now, then they probably would have thought to start development by blitzing through the entire main questline as quickly as possible, then gone back and filled out planets with side content over time. This would have allowed writers to script their projects with a sense of where the main story went, and what events and parts of lore had to be indelible, and it would have meant the game wound up being equally content-rich throughout. Instead TiTS followed the CoC model, with development taking place mostly or entirely on one planet at a time. This had a lot of mostly negative effects on development, among these that this model fosters the community sentiment you're expressing, that once the story is completed then the game is over.

There are many reasons why most community writers have a limited shelf life, some of which are inescapable facts of life, but some of which FenCo's early business practices were responsible for and they've made major efforts to correct over the years. The game now is better to write for than the game when I was an active writer. Projects now get coded in a reasonable amount of time, for instance, which was not true circa 2016, when you could expect to wait 8, 10, 12 months for a project to actually get coded unless you got lucky enough for Fen to personally fast-track it. Knowing you were writing things that would take so long to actually get implemented that there was a significant chance of it just being forgotten outright was a significant factor in writer burnout.

Another was that the game only really developed one planet at a time, and development spent about two years on any given planet, meaning if you didn't like the theme of the planet, you weren't going to be motivated to write content there. This got to be a problem during the New Texas/Myrellion years, because those planets were controversial, but they were also the new hotness and you had to write stuff that went there if you wanted to be part of expanding the frontier of the gameworld. There's a reason that 90% of my own writing output went to Uveto even though I was around for significantly longer than that: because I wanted to write for that planet and I didn't want to write for Myrellion. I left shortly after that for other facts-of-life reasons, of course, but if Uveto had been available from the beginning, I could have written more during the time that I was active, and I might not have left so many loose ends in my content which I now regret including.

It's also had significant effects on even the staff writers. Savin wound up making both Saendra and Kara, both of whom are basically the same character, in part because there wasn't enough main progression available yet to justify continuing Saendra's storyline in the way that he wanted. And of course Kara's storyline then also stalled out because there also wasn't enough main progression available yet to justify continuing her story either. Instead of one very good story from one of the best writers, we got two half-baked ones.

In short, having William working on Phaedra's story instead of a personal project may be disappointing if you would rather see that personal project come first, but it's significantly better for the game, and if it had been the development model from the beginning then TiTS would probably be in a healthier place now. Hopefully whatever comes next after TiTS will be better for the change.

I suppose you do have a point. But regardless or the reasons why, I don't like seeing someone hard work just get thrown out like that. If what I've heard is right William have the Sophora content basically half done. And now all of that is gone. It's a damn shame, and just plain wasteful and disrespectful towards William.

Be honest man, as someone who has seen the inside and is willing to lay it down hard: what do you think is the future for the game? Are they just gonna crank out Phaedra as fast as possible to get it over with? Are they gonna stick to TiTS to try and get things in better shape? Or are they just gonna let it sputter out? And will there even be anything after this?

Sorry for slamming you with so many questions like that but these have been bugging me for a while and idk if I'll get another chance to ask and

I don't have any special insider knowledge. I'm not on the Discord, I haven't seriously written for the game in years, and I never had a strong relationship with Fenoxo. Nearly everyone I did have a strong relationship with has stopped writing for various reasons. However, since you asked me to lay it down hard: if you think that there won't be anything after this, then you're a fool. This is a business with employees, this is how they make their livelihoods.

Now, will the future see a mountain of talented writers return like there were eight years ago? Maybe. Probably not, unless there's a substantial effort at community outreach, but it's certainly possible that a new game would bring in a new community. It's also possible that some older writers will eventually find themselves in a position where they want to write again, and find that TiTS or the game after TiTS has new space for them to explore, and you'll see a renaissance to some degree. I don't think anyone who comes back will be as prolific as they were, but they might have a gem or two left in them.

Even with the reduction in writing output, I expect TiTS updates to continue official development for at least a year or two after the main story concludes while development begins on the next project, with gradually waning support from the staff writers over that time period as more and more of them are pulled over to the new game. Unlike CoC, which was held together with glue to the point where it's not surprising that work on it ended immediately, TiTS has a higher likelihood of continued support following end of official development as long as there's new community content for it. It probably won't continue forever, but nothing does.

Thank you so much for answering.

I know how CoC ended on a cut to black rivaling the sopranos, and that happening to TiTS was honestly what I was fearing the most. This really helped put mind at ease on that and a lot of other things.

And at the end if the day all we can really do is hope.

So here's hoping the best happens.

Have a good one dude!

 

[XBoxMaster131]

this is making a lot of unfounded assumptions. both savin and fenoxo have stated concerns in the public discord chat about how sophora pushes the line of what TiTS is supposed to be about. this is not a hissy fit, or a power trip. you can bet that if they were willing to express their concerns in the public chat after the decision was made, then there was definitely a much longer, legitimate discussion about it privately.

william themselves said that sophora was an experiment, one that didn't end up fitting in game.

nothing has been "axed" william has stated that it's just in stasis and will not be deleted. additionally, fenoxo even said he's willing to work with will to make sophora fit in the game

if you want to say you had no way of knowing because you're not in the discord, don't make unfounded assumptions.

Oh yeah, I remember some of this. I had totally forgotten, and I guess I had also gotten blinded by my frustration.

Sorry.

 

[XBoxMaster131]

The original poster is probably gonna look at all this and think "Wtf did I kick off?!?!" lol

 

[FaithoftheFallen]

The original poster is probably gonna look at all this and think "Wtf did I kick off?!?!" lol

Lol, after I posted, I did some more digging (and saw William's Wall), and read some of the stuff available for it.

Having been around since the CoC days and watching everything go up and down and move sideways, I'm in a lot of ways still amazed by the passion, focus, and drive (as well as talent) by the team. I know everyone wants different things, and neat stuff, and niche stuff, and from what i've seen, there's a LOT that gets put out every month. There's already like six? times as much content in TITS as CoC? and moving one of your writers from "a neat character that a bunch of people are excited to see, a bunch of other people are getting literal rape vibes from, and requires a bunch of coding as written" to "please sketch out my next sandbox so we can actually make that a place to do things and other writers can slot content in there." makes a bunch of sense to me.

Its also worth noting that i feel we, as the community (and me especially who cant afford to support) have an AMAZING amount of say in what does get added. This game development is SOOO open compared to what usually happens. I also understand that they're very reluctant to put out official posts of "this is whats happened with this content, here's what we're planning on doing later about it", as they'd have to do it ALL THE TIME, and people would crowd every update post with "X when!!?!".

Obviously Fenoxo or whoever approved the first part to be inserted liked the idea enough to get the first part out. And you know what, while i'd be happier with more info on her, as they're an interesting character, I almost feel like we need more of these characters, who are obviously unique individuals, with unique styles and motivations who are either a) passing through on their own quest (Zodee), or b) present and antagonistic, but no further story depth.

I dont want every enemy to be (in phaedra's case) Hydrax Raider #45, and Hydrax berserker(?) #8 to have names and uniqueness, but also having "Skullcrusher Bonemaw", who is a rival group's leader or hotshot making a name for themselves and comes across you regularily? excellent!

 

[TheInfamousImmortal]

I left shortly after that for other facts-of-life reasons, of course, but if Uveto had been available from the beginning, I could have written more during the time that I was active, and I might not have left so many loose ends in my content which I now regret including.

Since Hellhound Syri and Reforged Reaha are now in the game, does that instill motivation in you to return with more projects or it hasn't moved the needle for you still?

 

[Couch]

You should assume that was the final thing I'll write for the game.

 

[TheInfamousImmortal]

You should assume that was the final thing I'll write for the game.

Damn, that sucks