Questions about Arona and Etheryn

Viyfolm

Member
Feb 20, 2021
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I have some questions about Arona and Etheryn.

First, I don't like Arona, and I was wondering if there was some way to get her to leave, permanently. I might have made some mistakes somewhere, but it seems like nothing I do at, or prior to, the orc camps will prevent Arona from showing up later at the tavern, with the Champion implying that they're on friendly terms, regardless of whatever betrayal I try. Is there something I can do to get her to just go away?

Second, I'd like to level up Etheryn a bit for the Winter city stuff, but I don't really want to interact with the sexual side of the character. Is there some way to deal with her resolve issues without having sex with her?
 

WolframL

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Feb 12, 2020
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If you want Arona to be out of sight and mind, you have to actually do what she tells you during the Right of Conquest sequence and not screw things up for her. That way she becomes chieftain and will happily hang out at the warcamp until the heat death of the universe and you won't see her again until you go there and recruit her. By screwing her over during the quest you've given her nowhere else to go, so of course she's going to make her way to the nearest place where she can find a fucking drink. :p

And no, you cannot avoid seeing to Ryn's needs if you don't want her to suffer the penalty associated with being blue-balled. If you don't want to do it, Arona will happily take that job off your hands while you watch...
 

Emerald

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Jun 8, 2016
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First, I don't like Arona, and I was wondering if there was some way to get her to leave, permanently. I might have made some mistakes somewhere, but it seems like nothing I do at, or prior to, the orc camps will prevent Arona from showing up later at the tavern, with the Champion implying that they're on friendly terms, regardless of whatever betrayal I try. Is there something I can do to get her to just go away?
If you fail at making her leader you can tell her to pretty much go away afterwards, just don't tell her to go to Hawkthorne I think it is. Unfortunately it's a(nother) false-choice scenario where you're locked out of all the orc camp content if you don't make her Chief. Getting her exiled pretty much can give you an option to remove her from the game, but you're locked out of a whole village in doing so, so it's frustratingly not worth it.
(Speaking as someone who very much dislikes Arona, but loves Rags's content.)
 

Viyfolm

Member
Feb 20, 2021
7
2
I thought I tried the not telling her about Hawkethorne thing, and she showed up anyway. That was where I thought I messed up. I don't want access to the camp, so that's no loss, but I was hoping that telling her that there was nothing for her in Hawkethorn might, you know, make her not want to go there. Absolutely not going to give her what she wants, though, so that path is off the table.

As for Etheryn, I guess I'll have to just deal with her content with her being mostly useless, seeing as I'm certainly not going to interact with Arona more than strictly necessary.

Thanks for the speedy replies.
 

Savin

Master Analmander
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Aug 26, 2015
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If Arona doesn't leave after she's exiled and you tell her to go away, that's a bug.

You can also get rid of the whole camp, her included, by letting Benny go on a rampage and presumably kill everyone. Wait in the shadows for Benny to appear, and then leave without helping Arona fight him.
 

Viyfolm

Member
Feb 20, 2021
7
2
I'll try that, too. I thought I had tried a few different things with that quest, including the Benny rampage one, but I'll admit that I might not have properly kept track of what save I was on, and what had happened in that save. I'll try again, be more careful, and see what happens.

Thanks for the comment, and for developing the game.
 

Wint3rRyd3r

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Feb 14, 2021
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Yeah Arona is easily one of my least favorite characters too. But she's chieftain on my save and shows up at the Frost Hound and war camp both. Like a stalker. And I don't have it in me to miss out on Rags and let Benny rampage. Also I think Ryn getting the blue ball status is natural mechanic of her character. It's never interfered for me but I get how it can be a problem for some.
 

jwins

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Dec 1, 2020
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In my save I didn't talk to her after completing the quest and she hasn't appeared at the Frost Hound at all. I guess the throne talk is what locks her in as a companion so as long as you don't step on the top most square you should be fine.
I could also talk to Rags with no issues so the orcmance is on the table if you're interested.
 

Upcast Drake

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It might very well be bugged since that option was coded way before Arona as a companion became a thing.

Edit: Fixed for next release.
 
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Undecided

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Feb 16, 2021
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Second, I'd like to level up Etheryn a bit for the Winter city stuff, but I don't really want to interact with the sexual side of the character. Is there some way to deal with her resolve issues without having sex with her?

With regards to Etheryn, you don't actually need to deal with her by sexing her. If you pick up the Charmer ability [Bolstering Dance] you can restore her resolve without sexing her. Although this does leave her with the [Blue Balls] status effect.

Although, on the Dark (or Hardcore) difficulty - you'd need to have High Presence (for a higher resolve heal) to even be able to restore resolve (outside of consumables - which do feel a tad underpowered).
 
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SomeNobody

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Dec 18, 2020
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It seems like you should be able to have Cait help Etheryn with their bluballed issues on the regular, beyond that one-off scene to do so early on.
I mean you can already have Cait take care of Berwyn's problems can't you?
 

valk42

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Mar 4, 2016
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It would be neat if Cait and/or Arona would help Ryn if in-party at the same time, currently managing Ryn's needs as a vagina-only character is rather difficult. Arona would probably deal some damage to Ryn's confidence while helping, to keep things balanced and realistic. Maybe Cait would reduce or increase Ryn's libido toward the mid-range as her draw-back? I am no good at balance.
 

Alypia

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Apr 22, 2016
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It would be neat if Cait and/or Arona would help Ryn if in-party at the same time, currently managing Ryn's needs as a vagina-only character is rather difficult.
Aw, you don't like the dildo or service top scenes?
 
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WolframL

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Or spoiling her, which meets her sexual needs and gives her a nice Confidence boost by letting her be in control and making the act all about her pleasure.
 
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Tendril

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Aug 19, 2018
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Even if either Arona or Cait can deal with Etheryn, the fact that this only triggers at the Frost Hound would be a non-starter even if the other stuff involving her weren't a non-starter. You should be able to automate Etheryn interacting with party members for sex; all interparty relationships going through you hurts
vermisilatude and is game-mechanically unneeded.
 

Alypia

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Apr 22, 2016
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Even if either Arona or Cait can deal with Etheryn, the fact that this only triggers at the Frost Hound would be a non-starter even if the other stuff involving her weren't a non-starter. You should be able to automate Etheryn interacting with party members for sex; all interparty relationships going through you hurts
vermisilatude and is game-mechanically unneeded.
"Verisimilitude".

It's unclear to me from this post whether you want the player to be able to tell the companions to go fuck Ryn because you can't be assed, or whether you want them to fuck Ryn without the player's say-so. "You should be able to automate" places agency with the player, but complaining about "all interparty relationships going through you" (which, incidentally, is completely and totally untrue) implies you don't even want the player to have input. The first presents a few problems; the second presents more problems and seems like a fundamental misunderstanding of the character.

The blueballs mechanic is meant to be frustrating to Ryn, and meant to be frustrating to the player. It's not "unneeded"; it's, like, major functionality intended from the ground up.
 

Tendril

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you want the player to be able to tell the companions to go fuck Ryn

There is a failure here to make a distinction between the player and the player character, creating confusion. The confusion comes to a head here:

"You should be able to automate" places agency with the player

The point is that the player has to maneuver their character to the Frost Hound to pick a Cait/Arona option when that makes absolutely no sense in the game world and abuses the player's time.

"all interparty relationships going through you" (which, incidentally, is completely and totally untrue) implies you don't even want the player to have input.

This is, again, confusing. There is literally no loss or gain of player input in the story in either the status quo or what I suggested should happen. Like, none. Player input, story-wise, remains identical. What changes is player clicking, in UI use, and in the emergent narrative of having to run the party back to the Hound as the result of that clicking.

Automating Ryn's interactions with the other party members means exactly what I said: they can take care of each other, because they'd want to do that in story and because the extra clicking serves no purpose (and Frost Hound-only is just bizarre, given that every other square of the game world is a love hotel).
 

Magenta Needle

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trail rations + camping supplies should be enough to grind exp with Ryn.
Also, that's just a small debuff. I could complete AzzyQuest (which means high resolve damage) with blue balled Ryn.
Bolstering dance also help wit resolve for those who like Quin.
 

Alypia

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Apr 22, 2016
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There is a failure here to make a distinction between the player and the player character, creating confusion.
Yes, your comment was unclear; no, it has nothing to do with the player/PC distinction.

A complaint about all interparty relationships going through "you" implies companions should be taking care of Ryn's needs without any input from player or player character, like how Brint and Cait or Cait and Arona fuck on their own whenever without anybody telling them to. If the player/PC is the one who tells them to do a thing ("hey, yo, can you fuck Ryn because I can't be assed"), and then they keep doing it automatically, then that is an interparty relationship that goes through both the player and the player character. Hence the lack of clarity.
The point is that the player has to maneuver their character to the Frost Hound to pick a Cait/Arona option when that makes absolutely no sense in the game world and abuses the player's time.

[...]

This is, again, confusing. There is literally no loss or gain of player input in the story in either the status quo or what I suggested should happen. Like, none. Player input, story-wise, remains identical. What changes is player clicking, in UI use, and in the emergent narrative of having to run the party back to the Hound as the result of that clicking.

Automating Ryn's interactions with the other party members means exactly what I said: they can take care of each other, because they'd want to do that in story and because the extra clicking serves no purpose (and Frost Hound-only is just bizarre, given that every other square of the game world is a love hotel).
I'm sorry that you're confused.

You seem to be stuck on this "Frost Hound" thing, which is, as I said, completely untrue. Camping supplies exist. Camp is one of the other valid sites for repeatable companion sex. And Ryn can even get relief in camp without the player fucking her, so long as Arona is in the party. Just ask Arona for a "threesome" and then "just watch". Boom. That said, this option really ought to exist for Cait as well, as should a valid threesome for Cait, Ryn, and a Champion without a penis. Perhaps somebody should write it.

Besides, if a nightly camp stop (which is all you need with low-Libido Ryn to prevent blue balls) is overly onerous to you, then I can't really take your complaint about the 'emergent narrative' of the game and 'vermisilatude [sic]' seriously. After all, for verisimilitude, you should be sleeping every night anyway, and from there it's just a click or two to getting her relief, whether through Arona or Champ. Don't dress this up as a 'narrative' or 'story' problem. Just say you can't be assed to keep Ryn well-fucked and happy, and as such, don't want to take her around in your party. That's a perfectly valid feeling, but it's also one that places the burden on you rather than some supposed structural problem with the game. Kind of like how the player doesn't get Kiyoko as a companion without making a babbu with her. If you don't want babbus, you don't get Kiyoko. Them's the breaks.

The blue balls are meant to be noticeable, but not incredibly taxing for the player/character to handle this - not significantly more taxing than it is for the player themselves to handle their own blue-balling. This is the whole point. You're supposed to want to remove her cage. Allowing the player to automate Ryn's relief with a set-and-forget option, whether handled by the companions or by the player character themselves, would move it out of sight and out of mind, and reduce its relevance and immediacy for players who like Ryn enough to take her around in the party. If you don't like Ryn enough to do that, that's fine. Just give her a hug every so often and leave her in the Frost Hound. Maybe give her a razorcup every so often in case she's plot-relevant and necessary for combat like she is in the Palace of Ice.
 

WolframL

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Another factor in play here: Confident Ryn's writing is predicated on she and the Champion having an intimate relationship; her weekly hug scene involves her making out with the Champion in front of everyone. Hence the mechanics requiring your active participation in seeing to her emotional and sexual needs are linked to how she's written. Bear in mind also that Ryn starts out seeing the Champion differently from your other companions because you're the one who rescues her from Kas' bindings and (ideally) is standing up for her with Carmen, encouraging her in conversations and so on.

That said, this option really ought to exist for Cait as well, as should a valid threesome for Cait, Ryn, and a Champion without a penis.
It is kind of odd that Cait can see to Ryn's needs during the confession but not afterwards aside from that one situation. Maybe she doesn't want to overuse those Secret Sexual Chakra tricks? Or maybe getting the lube out of her tail was just a lot of effort.... but yes, both of these would be sensible additions to the game at some point.
 

Magenta Needle

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On taking care of Ryn, I think Arona's companion talk about Ryn sums it up, especially if she had sex with her before.

I think we should move on and let things settle for a bit before this thread turns toxic for everyone involved.
 
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Paradox01

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I think we should move on and let things settle for a bit before this thread turns toxic for everyone involved.
I agree, and while I side with Alypia on this (she's one of the best writers here and if you need proof just read her post a few up), I do think that there is an argument to be had for balancing writing a good story with sexy bits.

Fans of these games can usually be broken into a few general camps:

1) "Fapfapfap." I love how sexy dese NPCs are and how hard they make my dick. They meet/exceed my boner thrashold.

2) "Um, actually, I think the motivation of X is predicated upon the action of Y..." Story is everything. Motivation is everything. I care deeply about WHY and HOW and WHERE and WHEN EVERYONE feels EVERYTHING. When there's any miniscule discrepancy between an NPC's motivation and action, I feel a total disconnect and my immersion is totally wrecked.

It's the rare person that enjoys this game because they are able to balance the two extremes. The writers have done an admirable job of making this game (and games of its ilk) more than a porno for semi-literate people (honestly, who here has watched a porn film from beginning to end in one sitting?).

My only concern is for a writer leaning too heavily in one direction. In regards to the point of this thread, that means writing characters and concepts too deep for the casual player.

Just like with movies, if your target audience is deep thinkers who appreciate "Oh shit!" moments upon second and subsequent watchings, then go full-on Inception/Memento. If your target audience is easily distracted by loud noises and images, then go all Michael Bay.

Rarely the tween shall meet.
 

Tendril

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Aug 19, 2018
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A complaint about all interparty relationships going through "you" implies companions should be taking care of Ryn's needs without any input from player or player character

It does no such thing, especially since automation was already brought up. In fact, the very point of automating requires that the player make a choice in the first place when the issue arises, so your position is as exactly wrong as it could be, and this wrongness is aggravated by doubling-down on your confusion between the player and the character. The player having made a choice as to how to handle Ryn, and having a story where Ryn and any character involved with Ryn can now interact as a result of that player’s choice, there is no mechanical need for the player to do any extra clicking (unless the decision to unmake this choice is made).

After all, for verisimilitude, you should be sleeping every night anyway

That seems to be a deliberately inane claim — I can’t tell if it’s meant facetiously — but in case it isn’t and I’m mistaken, verisimilitude is only relevant when it comes to the issues that the media emphasizes as important — in this case the choices of the characters. By your logic, failure to model food production in the game would hurt verisimilitude.

Don't dress this up as a 'narrative' or 'story' problem. Just say you can't be assed to keep Ryn well-fucked and happy, and as such, don't want to take her around in your party.

I can’t say that because your arrogant pronouncement isn’t true and I don’t want to say something that isn’t true. The snide arrogance is not appreciated, by the way, nor is it called for. I want every aspect of the game to be as smooth for players as possible for all players in general. If I wasn’t trying to run Ryn in a party and help the character, I wouldn’t have noticed any cause for concern in the first place.

Allowing the player to automate Ryn's relief with a set-and-forget option, whether handled by the companions or by the player character themselves, would move it out of sight and out of mind

And that’s blatantly false since the negative combat effects would happen regardless of how relief was handled. The adventuring day would be curtailed in ways that make the issue obvious, especially since plenty of party configurations and travel patterns allow for sustained travel that would be impossible with Ryn in the party. What would change is the interludes in resting procedures, just as dream sequences pop up during sleep but don’t require a lot of player re-affirmation.
 

Animalistic

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Jul 11, 2019
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Just ignore Ryn. Do not interact with her mary sue ass. While it would be nice to be able to tell her to ignore you , I can see many reasons why it is not happening. And I mean, I would like to think that she is going to be a terrible ruler without our help since game is not proving me otherwise. So it makes all of our ignorance of her condition and personal problems all that sweeter.
 

Undecided

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Feb 16, 2021
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Look, whilst I understand that it is not ideal, raising this complaint - when the specific interaction with Ryn the complaint is about clearly has a end date (when she gets the cage removed) does not make sense long term. People have listed some proposed solutions above and below your posts, and whilst I understand it's not the desired response - and perhaps doesn't make sense to you and some others - complaining about it won't change that unless the writers want to. And seeing the discourse between you and one of the writers for Ryn, that doesn't look like it's changing any time soon.

Ryn won't always be that way, so writing extra content for that in the mean time (such as companions taking care of her automatically) would be somewhat redundant in some cases and at worst be completely out of character depending on Ryn's state in your play-through.

See below on a proposed solution that I have if I don't want to sex Ryn all the time. It's not perfect, and I understand it's not what you want - but it is there.

With regards to Etheryn, you don't actually need to deal with her by sexing her. If you pick up the Charmer ability [Bolstering Dance] you can restore her resolve without sexing her. Although this does leave her with the [Blue Balls] status effect.

Although, on the Dark (or Hardcore) difficulty - you'd need to have High Presence (for a higher resolve heal) to even be able to restore resolve (outside of consumables - which do feel a tad underpowered).



I don't mean to offend, but (ironically I may be making some assumptions here) it feels like some assumptions were made. Just because one does not want to always deal with Ryn's issue all the time does not mean that they don't want to keep Ryn happy. It's just that the manner in which the issue is handled can be a tad irritating for a player - especially if they're trying different party combinations it will make having Ryn apart of any one of said combinations frustrating to manage.

Also, whilst I understand we should theoretically be resting every night, it is possible to go through the game without sleeping aside from level ups. Meaning that having to stop at camps (or even buy camping supplies in the first place) or the frost hound just for Ryn would be an understandable frustration. Hence, why the Bolstering Dance method is typically one I use the majority of the time if I don't feel like wasting time.

Not everyone has to be 100% invested / immersed in the story at all times, so when they are presented with this "irritation" on numerous occasions and they respond negatively - doesn't mean it's a knock on the character in any way - more so a mechanic about the character. I get that that's intended for this aspect of the character to be irritating - it's meant to feel as irritating for us as it is for her... But that doesn't mean that players can't express their irritation, and a desire for some solution to it. Whether anything is done to resolve (pun not intended) it is another matter.


All in all, I feel this topic is veering negatively, and maybe it'd be best to take a step back - although I understand the irony by me giving my input. Apologies for adding to this though. Don't want there to be any animosity.
 
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Alypia

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Apr 22, 2016
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I don't mean to offend, but (ironically I maybe making some assumptions here) it feels like some assumptions were made. Just because one does not want to always deal with Ryn's issue all the time does not mean that they don't want to keep Ryn happy. It's just that the manner in which the issue is handled can be a tad irritating for a player - especially if they're trying different party combinations it will make having Ryn apart of any one of said combinations frustrating to manage.

Also, whilst I understand we should theoretically be resting every night, it is possible to go through the game without sleeping aside from level ups. Meaning that having to stop at camps (or even buy camping supplies in the first place) or the frost hound just for Ryn would be an understandable frustration. Hence, why the Bolstering Dance method is typically one I use the majority of the time if I don't feel like wasting time.

Not everyone has to be 100% invested / immersed in the story at all times, so when they are presented with this "irritation" on numerous occasions and they respond negatively - doesn't mean it's a knock on the character in any way - more so a mechanic about the character. I get that that's intended for this aspect of the character to be irritating - it's meant to feel as irritating for us as it is for her... But that doesn't mean that players can't express their irritation, and a desire for some solution to it. Whether anything is done to resolve (pun not intended) it is another matter.
Oh, I'm not unhappy at all with the irritation being expressed. If you only knew... No, the things that made me unhappy (insofar as I was) were other things, like factual inaccuracies and the other user's combative tone. But it is perfectly reasonable to express unhappiness with the state of affairs. Like I said, it's intended behavior.

And yeah, like I said before, some of the companions that Ryn feels most comfortable with - Cait, definitely, or maybe Tui - probably should have scenes where Champ, like, holds Ryn's hand while the companion helps Ryn cum, so the player doesn't have to actually fuck Ryn to make sure she gets relief. Arona already services that ambition, but like you say: it'd be fun to have more variety for characters who like her but don't wanna fuck her.

With all that said, there ain't gonna be no automatic Ryn cummies. Just not happening. If you don't want to suffer through the minor (to varying degrees of) inconvenience associated with managing her resolve, then don't bring her around until she gets uncaged. Simple as.
 

Emerald

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Jun 8, 2016
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Do not interact with her mary sue ass.
Do you people even know what a Mary Sue is. Ryn is not a perfect character nor do you HAVE to cater to her blue balls holy shit if I had a nickle for every time I saw someone use this word wrong I'd probably be rich.

Anyways I do feel Cait could use a scene like Arona where you engage her with Ryn but then sit back and watch so that if you're not interested in doing it yourself you can pick that. I can get by with just rubbing her balls, but I'm surprised Cait doesn't have much with Ryn herself outside the initial confession scene.
 

Gothamson

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Apr 13, 2018
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For the reference; a Mary Sue by classical definition is a female character who is able to accomplish tasks with little effort and gets along with most members of a cast.

I'd give examples but that starts a war all its own.
 
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