Context: https://forum.fenoxo.com/threads/gweyrerk-ロスト・チルドレンの章-笑.22839/
Hello there, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to a post, written by someone who is clearly very boring and wrong about everything in my own objection and defense. (Wouldn't that making this post wrong as well?)
Since no-one has actually give me a strong enough argument for Gweyr's and their opinion in defense, guess it is my job to convince myself that I am wrong.
I've revisited the Gweyr event and dissected and compiled a list of evidence from the game itself.
Hello there, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to a post, written by someone who is clearly very boring and wrong about everything in my own objection and defense. (Wouldn't that making this post wrong as well?)
Since no-one has actually give me a strong enough argument for Gweyr's and their opinion in defense, guess it is my job to convince myself that I am wrong.
I've revisited the Gweyr event and dissected and compiled a list of evidence from the game itself.
"It was a couple of weeks into this mess... then one of the village girls disappeared. They covered their tracks pretty well, but River said he saw Tollus and his goons taking her up the hill to the old temple. I didn't know what they were about, but my gut told me it wasn't good. Sanders asked me for help, so I took my sword and my staff and went out after them."
"...Sanders asked me for help, so I took my sword and my staff and went out after them."
"...Sanders asked me for help, so I took my sword and my staff and went out after them."
- I wonder where did that staff went
- Why didn't she keep going after the River delivered the girl though if that is the case.
"...The village boys and girls who'd taken up with Tollus, I could tell that they weren't themselves. Controlled, mesmerised, possessed, whatever you want to call it. Tollus was using them as meatshields, forcing Sanders and me to have to get through my own in order to reach him. He thought I wouldn't have the stomach to do it and turn back home with my tail between my legs.
Confirmed that Gweyr clearly know that they are not acting under their will, debatable as a reflection of the event that not necessarily being aware of it while the action took place despite lacking of defense from her part. (Proven to be the latter, see Section 20)
Objection withhold as hypothesis for now.
Objection withhold as hypothesis for now.
"He didn't know me, of course. Those kids threw themselves at me without caring for themselves, so I butchered them all. They weren't trained and whatever hold Tollus had on them was dulling their senses and reactions, so it was a simple matter to cut them all down two or three at a time. There must've been a dozen of them, then his head crony Leold came at me — a bit less worthless than the rest, but still easy meat. I tore him apart, and that was when Tollus' panic turned to fucking terror. Bastard shat his pants as he took to his heels — I think he was considering using the girl he'd captured as a hostage, but after seeing what I'd done to his meatshields he didn't doubt that I'd kill her too just to get at him."
"Butchered" is a rather strong word for a, or a bunch of in this case, mercy kill supposedly, arguably indicative of lack of remorse/respect, a red flag for the player(myself).
"No good deed goes unpunished, (playername). I single-handedly saved them all from being slaves to some madman in a robe, and there and then Sanders tells me to walk the ice, else they'd lynch me. I... don't blame them for what they did, I'd have been afraid of myself too after seeing what I did. I would've been resentful if it were my Gwyn and Garret who'd been killed, even if they weren't themselves anymore; I wouldn't be able to look myself in the eye. But even so, to realise that only my husband, River and even Sanders, in a way, stood by me while the rest of Hawkethorne was willing to throw me to the wolves, I couldn't help but feel a deep disgust for the lot of them. I guess leading my own mercenary company for so long had spoiled me, made me expect things of people that most folk don't have.
- She viewed what she did as good deed
- Crossed Swords are very used to kill (which raises ethic concerns with Lumia's order despite their code presumably also followed by Sander at the time)
"Yes. Before that, though... I want you to really know what happened down in Hawkethorne that day, all those years ago."
So what we knew is not all truth after all. Well let's see what you got here (Moment of Truth).
"...I want you to be there like I was, experience things from my point of view, and decide on whether you're going to be able to trust me when we work together on dealing with Tollus and his underlings.
...If you think I'm a monster after hearing me out, I don't want you covering my back even if it's to beat back a bigger monster. I don't want you to have doubts about who I am. Do you understand me?"
...If you think I'm a monster after hearing me out, I don't want you covering my back even if it's to beat back a bigger monster. I don't want you to have doubts about who I am. Do you understand me?"
More indicative that Gweyr didn't and no reason to withhold any form of relevant information from her to the player.
Further confirmation.
Further confirmation.
"Fine. I'm going to head on out first, stall them as long as I can. I don't know how, but... whatever they're planning to do with the girl can't be good. I'll see you at the gate."
"That was then, Garth. We didn't have children then. I... if these shitheads know I'm going after them, then they may come for the pups and I need someone to watch them."
"Things were different when it was just the two of us, but we've a family now. Like I said, watch them, okay? I'll sort out this shitshow and be back before you know it."
"That was then, Garth. We didn't have children then. I... if these shitheads know I'm going after them, then they may come for the pups and I need someone to watch them."
"Things were different when it was just the two of us, but we've a family now. Like I said, watch them, okay? I'll sort out this shitshow and be back before you know it."
- Gweyr was requested to meet at the gate actually (Refuting Section 1-2)
- Clear expression of caring for her children as a mother
- Assuming developed empathy for children and the young alike (See Conclusion?)
...You waste no time, making a beeline for the closet and shrugging on your gambeson over your nightgown — not the best by far, but actually protecting yourself would take far too long (Post SM Action)
There's no time to waste. (Old Hawkethorne tile 0 placeholder text)
There's no time to waste. (Old Hawkethorne tile 0 placeholder text)
Indicative of discipline drilled throughout her life as a lead merc especially or/and acknowledging a sense of emergency
He's not going to be holding off these shitheads for very much longer now — not someone like him.
Sense of pride for her skill (expected)
"Shitheads" is rather interesting word of choice
"Shitheads" is rather interesting word of choice
- First four kills It's done. All four of them lie dead at your feet; it really wasn't any kind of challenge
- ......but it wasn't enough to make up for their plain lack of skill and sheer bloody-mindedness.
Hypnotized cultists being pushover relative to Gweyr
You wipe your short sword clean on their clothes of black-dyed sackcloth and sigh, feeling your anger subside just a tiny bit.
"anger" from what specifically, keep in mind that this is the kind of anger somehow related to killing of these cultist that not necessarily proving anything (subside after killing them)
"Yes, but even so..." River clenches his fists and uncovers the hoods from three of the four bodies. "Lomias. Miches. Rilian. Two months ago, they laughed and clapped at my music, patted me on the head and told me I was a good kitten. Miches even bought me milk every week from your place."
"I remember."
"I remember."
Arguably contradicting Section 7-3 (See conclusion)
You can hear screams from the east gate; that must be where the fun's happening.
You can hear screams from the east gate; Best to hurry up, lest the best parts of the party be over by the time you arrive on the scene.
You can hear screams from the east gate; Best to hurry up, lest the best parts of the party be over by the time you arrive on the scene.
"fun"; "best part of the party" after "screams" clear indicative that she did enjoy the killing despite being aware of the nature of the victims and potential more victimhood.
Since enjoyment being disproportionate to the challenge itself thus proven that the enjoyment came from the act of killing.
Since enjoyment being disproportionate to the challenge itself thus proven that the enjoyment came from the act of killing.
Some of them, you might have once recognised as kids you knew, perhaps even liked. Now, though...
- confirmed fully aware of the nature of the subject acting not under their will before the fight (See Section 20)
- Arguably disproving hypothesis made in Section 7-3 (See conclusion)
"Now that we can see each other, I'm going to tell you once, and once only.
If there's anything left of the pups that I once served drinks to at the Hound within your thick skulls, you're going to drop those toys you call weapons and run;
I'll pretend I never saw you here.
"...I'll take pleasure in gutting you all."
If there's anything left of the pups that I once served drinks to at the Hound within your thick skulls, you're going to drop those toys you call weapons and run;
I'll pretend I never saw you here.
"...I'll take pleasure in gutting you all."
- Clear indicator of lack of remorse/respect for victim of Tollus despite knowing the nature of their hostility. (See Section 20)
- Despite technically the cultist being the aggressor, Gweyr clearly took her time, wait for the cultist to walk out of the shadow and issuing threat that are far too likely to miss than hit (Refuting time constraint theory)
- Arguably disproving hypothesis made in Section 7-3 (See conclusion)
- The last of the dark-robed so-called cultists
- Ghouls wearing bodies as skin suits and demanding respect...
Further reinforcing Section 16
Hypnotised people = ghouls I guess
Hypnotised people = ghouls I guess
...The poor bastard. Guess it's up to you to save his sorry ass.
Indeed Sander felt too sorry about hitting kids logically speaking his ass is indeed sorry too. Objectively correct statement /s
- You know their faces, their voices are familiar to you; the bastard is using them as shields, because he thinks you won't dare to hurt them...
- "I'd have come earlier, but things happened, people tried to kill me. You know."
- Indicative of having social interaction with the people especially you can think their voices being familiar. Logically speaking a person would develop empathy towards the subjects due to their past social relationship. Soft contradicting Section 7-3 (See conclusion)
- Second lines being a casual dismissive defense "kill or be killed" neverminding the fact that they barely poses a threat to you
you can't help but wonder if the bald bastard — Tollus, that was his name — has them in some kind of mind-meld...
Confirmed that Gweyr wasn't being aware to the nature of the victims for her previous killing (See Section 2)
PS: I wish this line was being bolded given how much difference it can make for missing it alone.
PS: I wish this line was being bolded given how much difference it can make for missing it alone.
- Where is the staff
- Questionable wording and attitude for her past victim despite the realization?
- The killing was done without being aware to the nature of the subjects at the time
- Crossed Swords mercs, reflected by Gweyr herself, likely are trained to treat hostile subjects indifferently regardless to their personal past relationship (Believable), moreso with Gweyr herself in this cases.
- Objective man good please don't use assumption as first defense on a debate (Courtesy to Mauler for the title)
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