Demons before Kasyrra?

TheGraeyRebis

Active Member
Dec 10, 2024
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Trying to do a write up submission and I'm making sure that it's accurate to the current lore. I vaguely remember snippets of lore about how the portal that Kas came through to get to Savarra opens up constantly and at a fixed time and has been there for a while with other cults coming and going to use it. To top off, the Demon Codex Entry has Cait recall that Mallach's description of Demons way back in the day is more accurate to the Demons that come from Mareth than to the Wraiths of the Godswar. Does that mean there might of been a demon or two that slipped through from the same portal long before Kas arrived?
 

Dreamer44

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Apr 25, 2020
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Trying to do a write up submission and I'm making sure that it's accurate to the current lore. I vaguely remember snippets of lore about how the portal that Kas came through to get to Savarra opens up constantly and at a fixed time and has been there for a while with other cults coming and going to use it. To top off, the Demon Codex Entry has Cait recall that Mallach's description of Demons way back in the day is more accurate to the Demons that come from Mareth than to the Wraiths of the Godswar. Does that mean there might of been a demon or two that slipped through from the same portal long before Kas arrived?
I'd say 99.9% no.

Portals to Mareth are mostly one-way. Demons can send objects to other worlds, but not pass through themselves.

Kasyrra needed to experiment and use the research of another demon that had studies the portals to find a way out.

And Cait says that Kas is not how demons were depicted, because for Savarrans Wraiths are demonic.
 

TheGraeyRebis

Active Member
Dec 10, 2024
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Portals to Mareth are mostly one-way. Demons can send objects to other worlds, but not pass through themselves.
The portal she came through is the only exception according to her and some other NPC dialogue, though, but requires someone being sent from both sides for both to make it through.

And Cait says that Kas is not how demons were depicted, because for Savarrans Wraiths are demonic.
Cait says this in her dialogue but in the Demon Codex Entry, she mentions in the Society & Culture section how one of Mallach's teachings was "One mustn't overindulge in her passions, lest corruption invariably take hold." and then wonders if Mallach might of been talking about Mareth Demons and if he had known of them this entire time.
 

Savin

Master Analmander
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Aug 26, 2015
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the Demon Codex Entry has Cait recall that Mallach's description of Demons way back in the day is more accurate to the Demons that come from Mareth than to the Wraiths of the Godswar
That's the exact opposite of what Cait's saying; she says the demons of today DO NOT bear a resemblance to the "demons" of the Godswar.

So no, Kas is the first Marethian demon to ever leave Mareth.
 

TheGraeyRebis

Active Member
Dec 10, 2024
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That's the exact opposite of what Cait's saying; she says the demons of today DO NOT bear a resemblance to the "demons" of the Godswar.

So no, Kas is the first Marethian demon to ever leave Mareth.
Well, that's confusing. The entry I'm referencing is the Society & Culture section where she says...

"Even Mallach understands that moderation is a virtue. One mustn't overindulge in her passions, lest corruption invariably take hold.

Wait, was Mallach talking about demons? Did the Lord of Song know, even centuries ago...?

Maybe our demons and Mareth's aren't so different after all."


... is where it got the gears turning on if this was a potential story thread I could of used for the write up. Thanks for clearing that up, though.
 

Ace Hangman

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Sep 16, 2021
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I think she's just referring to the obsessive nature of demons. The wraiths were creatures with no real emotion or sensation (I am being a bit general), so they'd be overwhelmed with seeking out emotions, usually pleasure, lust, and breeding. Marethian demons are creatures of obsession as well, I think that's the similarity. There may have been 'demons' before the wraiths, like ancient fire elementals or something deep in the earth, but those would be way different from wraiths and (Marethian) demons.

'The legends about demons painted them as black, oily, formless beings of nightmare; shadows drawing forth from the abyss, the void between worlds. Yet the things calling themselves demons now? They're nothing like the legends! The first of them we encountered was Kasyrra, their so-called new queen: a statuesque crimson woman with traits mixing bovine, dragon, and fiend. She appeared to [pc.name] alone, tearing her way into our world through the portal in Hawkstone's temple... the same one my sister was flung through moments before.

She'd almost be beautiful if it wasn't for the black pit in her heart where her soul ought to be.

Kasyrra was the first and only of her kind in Savarra for a time, but now that we've seen what she did to Alissa... how many more broken souls has she torn from people? There will only be more demons across the Marches as we progress. One more reason we have to stop them!

After seeing Queen Alissa's transformation, there's clearly no consistent way to identify a demon... Kasyrra and her broken elven queen were wholly different beasts, though both were cloven-legged and had tails and horns. It seems evident that there's quite a bit of variety in what constitutes a demon's physical form. We can't be complacent in assuming we understand what demons look like... they may even be shapeshifters, as they can clearly change other peoples' bodies!'