Least favourite pokemon game?

[PyrateHyena]

Just have to get this out of my head! Sorry upfront if it seems annoying or superfluous or dangerous or crazy or anything alike...


In my own humble opinion, generation 4 introduced way too many legendaries, it just seems to be nintendos way of saying fock y'all to anyone who likes to complete their pokedex! Many of these (15! I hardly know what to say about this...) are hard or downright impossible to obtain if you do not like to cheat/glitch or use download-codes (which imo is the same as cheating...), which is not even the main problem. The main prolem is, that 15 are just way too much to feel or be special. IMO ten would be too many already, but 15 is just insane.


What pokemon am I talking about? Just Rotom, Uxie, Mesprit, Azelf, Dialga, Palkia, Heatran, Regigigas, Giratina, Cresselia, Phione, Manaphy, Darkrai, Shaymin and Arceus (hope I got all names right). I am certainly not sure what to think of this. Am I alone with this opinion? Am I overreacting? Underreacting? I do not know what angers me the most about this. There have been bad designs and mistakes in every generation, but this one is angering me the most. I do not dislike the fourth generation of pokemon as a whole, I do not dislike every pokemon or every legendary pokemon of the fourth generation. But this amount of legendaries in diamond, pearl and platinum is plain wrong.


What are your least favourite pokemon games and for what (main) reason?

 

[FrankenApple]

Pokemon Go because I finally decided to play Pokemon White as my first Pokemon game ever and whenever I try to google some common questions, the front pages are full of irrelevant Pokemon Go information.

 

[MESeele]

Pokemon designs have slowly been getting less...pokemon(?) each generation. I played gen 1-4 and stopped (Diamond was the last for me). So, something about 4 must have been the tipping point.


Maybe as TC says, the selling point of the games have changed- apparently they still say "gotta catch 'em all", but they're full of shit. It's not the goal anymore. It's just not gonna happen. "You can try" is a more fitting moniker. I feel like the series has also become quantity = quality in design. For whatever reason, in Diamond I grabbed a few pokes as I went, smashed the elite 4 and whoever else, and had my 10-20 hours of fun. I certainly didn't bother to pace through the grass to see what popped out next. The magic had gone.


It's not burnout on the genre though, cause I hold a near-rabid love of megaten, and fill my compendium in all those games (I even rooted out the fiends in SMTIV- and fuck those guys).

 

[Graav]

Pokemon Red best pokemon game

 

[Zavos]

Diamond/Pearl/Platinum


This is probably the point where the quality took its downward turn

 

[Woider]

Diamond/Pearl/Platinum


This is probably the point where the quality took its downward turn

That's funny, as 4th gen was my favourite gen.


Least favourite games are definately FireRed and LeafGreen. I didn't feel the 1st gen to 3rd gen conversion worked as well as 2nd to 4th.

 

[Krynh]

Pokemon Go. Which is the first time I've played Pokemon since Pokemon cards came out in the UK. Back in the late 90's

 

[PyrateHyena]

[...] I didn't feel the 1st gen to 3rd gen conversion worked as well as 2nd to 4th.

Agreed.

 

[Zaku]

Fire Red/Leaf Green has to be my choice. That remake was lacking somehow, and not as fun as the other games.


Oddly, Platinum is one of my favorites though. Possibly because Team Galactic was the first one that really seemed like a genuine threat, Team Rocket and Team Aqua/Magma never really seemed dangerous in the way Team Galactic came across. Hard to explain why, though.

 

[Zavos]

Fire Red/Leaf Green

I stand corrected.  If nobody objects, FR/LG shall now be the standard against all pokemon game failings shall be measured. 

 

[BubbleLord]

Wow. Pokemon Puzzle League didn't get shit on for once? Wow.

 

[Nonesuch]

@PyrateHyena and Mysty (gj giving yourself a name I can't mention btw) nailed it tbh tbf imho fam.


I enjoy the "campaign" of pokemon games, and then the fooling around in the aftergame content, much more than the multiplayer aspect of it, so how intrinsically unfun Gen 4 was hit me hard. I dislike almost every aspect of legendaries - they tend to be horribly overdesigned in terms of appearance, they tend not to be very interesting in terms of gameplay (Big Water Thing used Mega Water Beam! Oh yeah, well Stupid Looking Psychic Loli used Mega Psychic Beam!) and they just don't seem like something regular trainers should be able to own in terms of RP - so to be confronted with so many of them in 4 was deeply disheartening. On a personal level it also irked me that they outmoded one of my favourite pokemon, Flygon, at a stroke with underground jet shark dragon for no damn reason. With most of the dev time apparently absorbed into tinkering with the mechanics, the actual game felt like a trudge.


Gen 5 meanwhile felt a lot better in all of these aspects. I really enjoyed playing it.

 

[Woider]

Wow. Pokemon Puzzle League didn't get shit on for once? Wow.

Can't hate something you never played. Shit, I have Pokémon Pinball on the GBA and it's fun as fuck.

I stand corrected.  If nobody objects, FR/LG shall now be the standard against all pokemon game failings shall be measured. 

Agreed. I'd rather play the originals, and I'm not even huge fans of them.

 

[PyrateHyena]

[...] Possibly because Team Galactic was the first one that really seemed like a genuine threat, Team Rocket and Team Aqua/Magma never really seemed dangerous in the way Team Galactic came across. Hard to explain why, though.

Funny thing. In my opinion Team Rocket was pretty badass and, compared to almost all the other evil teams, down to earth with their goals. Simply steal stuff and get rich! That was damn cool! Aqua and Magma were at least funny in a comic-book-supervillain style, but Galactic was just over the top, just as the concepts of the title legendaries were kind of ridiculous. I loved X and Y for going back to the roots with their evil team. I love Team Flare in design and concept.

 

[BubbleLord]

If I can't have friendship and strategy to beat my opponents, then this isn't real Pokemon. #PokemonRightsMatter


Create buzzwords. We're going to make Nintendo understand that even Diglett can fly.

 

[Skeleton Man]

The BST, IV, and EV systems have needed a complete overhaul since Gen III. Pokemon stats need to be totally redesigned, which in turn means the entire game outside of its thematic presentation needs to be redesigned. They've fucked it up that badly. I've been hearing some wild speculation about a major reboot after Sun/Moon. I'm not holding my breath, but it is very much needed.


For a series that tries to espouse the "power of friendship" and "triumph through effort" with the whole "trainer" angle, the fact that it boils down to Eugenics Simulator on a mechanical level is really fucking sad.

So much this. I frickin' loathe the IV and nature system that makes that pokemon you spent hours working beside completely wasted because you find out its IVs were completely garbage and sucked dick from the beginning. Then adding insult to injury: because you didn't specifically EV train it, the stats are all wonky and you end up with an Alakazam with a jacked Attack stat and no Speed. Yaaaaaaay(!) The day they find a way to make a  compromise between competitive and casual gameplay by overhauling those invisible numbers, that's the day Pokemon properly takes a step forward. Not this Z-Move and Mega Evolution silliness.

And on topic, I guess Pokemon XY. Following up Gen 5 was gonna be tough (I loved those games), the jump in hardware quality and the perks that came with it were nice but at the end of the day? Just not a fun game to play. Mega Evolution made some shitty pokemon a bit more usable but locked the means to do so behind hold items you need to find in game, the game force fed overpowered pokemon down your throat by giving you two starters AND a Mega Lucario for free, coupled with the early EXP Share and Lucky Egg... Only reason I bought Pokemon X was because Xerneas looked like the deer god from Princess Mononoke.

 

[Zavos]

So much this. I frickin' loathe the IV and nature system that makes that pokemon you spent hours working beside completely wasted because you find out its IVs were completely garbage and sucked dick from the beginning. Then adding insult to injury: because you didn't specifically EV train it, the stats are all wonky and you end up with an Alakazam with a jacked Attack stat and no Speed. Yaaaaaaay(!) 

This is one big reason why i prefer fangames.  The better made ones usually have an option for working around these problems, if you're willing to put in some work.  Insurgence for example, allows you to reset EVs, raise IVs to max (if you're willing to grind a bit for the materials) and regenerate a new nature.  Its enough toil to make you try and go for gold to start, but if you screw up you don't have to start all over, just redo a few steps.  

 

[PyrateHyena]

[...] We're going to make Nintendo understand that even Diglett can fly.

Made me remember http://www.rarecandytreatment.com/comics/1108298/brown-baron/


@IVIysterious That is exactly why I dislike competitive play. It is nothing like that game I played when I was... I dunno let's say ten. The way I played and still play Pokemon is I pick what I like, train hard and succeed, every playthrough with a different team and different move sets of course. I don't really get the fun part about using the same pokemon over and over again. You miss out on a huge variety and quite interesting challenges. It is not that I have never been into competitive play or excessive breeding, but it is just not my cup of tea.

 

[shadefalcon]

So much this. I frickin' loathe the IV and nature system that makes that pokemon you spent hours working beside completely wasted because you find out its IVs were completely garbage and sucked dick from the beginning. Then adding insult to injury: because you didn't specifically EV train it, the stats are all wonky and you end up with an Alakazam with a jacked Attack stat and no Speed. Yaaaaaaay(!) The day they find a way to make a  compromise between competitive and casual gameplay by overhauling those invisible numbers, that's the day Pokemon properly takes a step forward. Not this Z-Move and Mega Evolution silliness.
 

For a series that tries to espouse the "power of friendship" and "triumph through effort" with the whole "trainer" angle, the fact that it boils down to Eugenics Simulator on a mechanical level is really fucking sad. The way the game works is completely at odds with its message and the tone of the universe, and that's one reason it feels so childish. Casuals will beat the Elite 4 of each game with whatever pokemon they fancy and be done with it. Anyone that wants to go even one step further into the post-game content will learn very quickly that whatever they like is probably hot fucking garbage and they'd better just learn to deal with using what's good. Because fuck you.


*continues to simmer*

TMW you got attached to a pokemon whom you brought with you since the very beginning of the game all the way too the elite 4, but it turns out to have crappy IVs and a garbage nature... (I rarely check their natures when I catch em all, I just play for fun )


The anime makes it sound like it's all about the bond between a pokemon and its trainer, but I guess that doesn't count if it's a Gardevoire with the sassy nature...


...I just had a realization... Everybody's talking about IV training in sun and moon, but they all fail to see the hidden signs.


Pokemon S&M, Personality training(breaking) (This way you can easily whip out that awful jolly nature of your pokemon into a much more powerful timid one...)


Cause good stats are everything amiright?


As for worst pokemon game? Tough question. Story wise I loved black and white, but most of the new pokemons in those games really didn't have the same "magic" I originally felt when I first played pokemon. I kinda wish I had heard about the nuzlocke challenge before I played white. That way I probably would've had more fun and gotten more attached to the pokemons there regardless of my initial feelings about their design.

 

[MESeele]

The anime makes it sound like it's all about the bond between a pokemon and its trainer, but I guess that doesn't count if it's a Gardevoire with the sassy nature...

The anime is full of over-competitive, power-poke hungry antagonists and rivals, but it's told from the perspective of a naive and hopeful child who continually tries to prove them wrong. There's a reason Ash never succeeds in the end... I'm convinced the reason he's a perma 10-12ish-year old is to protect his little heart from breaking after realizing the pokemon he loves really are garbage. The moment where he is confronted with the choice or either casting aside those he loves for success as a trainer, or discarding his life-long dream. The anime is just as cold and heartless as the games.

 

[FerrousFlint]

Hey you, Pikachu


FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK this game!!!!!!!!


For those that don't know, and really it's understandable - it was a stupid tech gimmick game, Hey You, Pikachu was a game on the N64, staring the titular mascot, Pikachu. The game had voice recognition hardware that allowed you to talk to and interact with it, AND IT HARDLY EVER WORKED. i remember spending HOURS replaying levels and doing everything short of deepthroating the thing to get Pikachu to follow the simplest of commands. I understand that this was some groundbreaking attempt at fully rendering pokemon in a non stadium setting but Pokemon Snap was the far better achievement at this then this game. I hear it might get redone for the 3ds or NX, but I just want a fully immersive console pokemon game already, like Colosseum or X D for the Gamecube.

 

[Woider]

TMW you got attached to a pokemon whom you brought with you since the very beginning of the game all the way too the elite 4, but it turns out to have crappy IVs and a garbage nature... (I rarely check their natures when I catch em all, I just play for fun )


The anime makes it sound like it's all about the bond between a pokemon and its trainer, but I guess that doesn't count if it's a Gardevoire with the sassy nature...


...I just had a realization... Everybody's talking about IV training in sun and moon, but they all fail to see the hidden signs.


Pokemon S&M, Personality training(breaking) (This way you can easily whip out that awful jolly nature of your pokemon into a much more powerful timid one...)


Cause good stats are everything amiright?


As for worst pokemon game? Tough question. Story wise I loved black and white, but most of the new pokemons in those games really didn't have the same "magic" I originally felt when I first played pokemon. I kinda wish I had heard about the nuzlocke challenge before I played white. That way I probably would've had more fun and gotten more attached to the pokemons there regardless of my initial feelings about their design.

To be fair, natures are only a 10% up/down and you can beat all games + post-game with any reasonably-varied team. EVs, IVs and Natures aren't really relevant outside of Competetive Battling. Have to admit, never played any game past gen IV, lost interest as I got older.

 

[MateMint]

Of the games I have played Pokemon Ruby (and whatever Gen 3) was really bad, atleast in my eyes compared to gen 1 and 2. A downgrade to the day/night cycle, no good pokemon, weak gameplay and too much ocean. HeartGold is my current favorite, just love Gen 2 I guess  

 

[Kesil]

For a series that tries to espouse the "power of friendship" and "triumph through effort" with the whole "trainer" angle, the fact that it boils down to Eugenics Simulator on a mechanical level is really fucking sad. The way the game works is completely at odds with its message and the tone of the universe, and that's one reason it feels so childish. Casuals will beat the Elite 4 of each game with whatever pokemon they fancy and be done with it. Anyone that wants to go even one step further into the post-game content will learn very quickly that whatever they like is probably hot fucking garbage and they'd better just learn to deal with using what's good. Because fuck you.

The way I played and still play Pokemon is I pick what I like, train hard and succeed, every playthrough with a different team and different move sets of course. I don't really get the fun part about using the same pokemon over and over again. You miss out on a huge variety and quite interesting challenges. It is not that I have never been into competitive play or excessive breeding, but it is just not my cup of tea.

It's one major reason I drifted away from competitive stuff. But there's also the fact that it's not just competitive stuff anymore. Endgame content like the Battle Maison in Gen V requires you to use optimized pokemon and movesets that are on par with the competitive meta if you want to see consistent success. And that's absolutely a part of the normal single player experience. 


And the Battle Maison isn't even "competitive," it just fuckin' cheats. Like it literally cheats in the code. It cheats so much you need either stupid amounts of luck or competitive-tier teams to deal with it.  ¬¬

The anime is full of over-competitive, power-poke hungry antagonists and rivals, but it's told from the perspective of a naive and hopeful child who continually tries to prove them wrong. There's a reason Ash never succeeds in the end... I'm convinced the reason he's a perma 10-12ish-year old is to protect his little heart from breaking after realizing the pokemon he loves really are garbage. The moment where he is confronted with the choice or either casting aside those he loves for success as a trainer, or discarding his life-long dream. The anime is just as cold and heartless as the games.

I just realised I'm screwed being a Pokémon fan and a Yu-Gi-Oh! one who's there for the fun.

 

[Number13]

Probably Firered and Leafgreen myself.

 

[Nik_van_Rijn]

As someone whose major exposure to Pokemens ended pretty right much after it had started about 12-13 years ago, hearing about the apparently great amount of fandom woes and a freaking 'power creep' going on there makes me go  :staredog: . 


I always knew that Japanese game devs loved them some hardcoreness and loathed causals, but to think that they will do this to Pokemon fans.

The anime is full of over-competitive, power-poke hungry antagonists and rivals, but it's told from the perspective of a naive and hopeful child who continually tries to prove them wrong. There's a reason Ash never succeeds in the end... I'm convinced the reason he's a perma 10-12ish-year old is to protect his little heart from breaking after realizing the pokemon he loves really are garbage. The moment where he is confronted with the choice or either casting aside those he loves for success as a trainer, or discarding his life-long dream. The anime is just as cold and heartless as the games.

But Ash's pokemons performed pretty decently in the episodes and movies I glimpsed, hell, they even bitchslapped some legendries on occasion, IIRC.

 

[MESeele]

But Ash's pokemons performed pretty decently in the episodes and movies I glimpsed, hell, they even bitchslapped some legendries on occasion, IIRC.

Admittedly, as far as the anime goes I've only seen the gen1 stuff (maybe some gen2), the mewtwo movie, and a sparse few episodes beyond that. But I do know that however well he does, he always loses in the end. Every time. Performing decently means nothing. When things get competitive, he loses. (and remember, even the crappiest teams can beat the story in the games. Most are talking about how fucked up the metagame is, and how contrary it is to the message the games and shows try to put across- though as I mentioned, even that message is only skin-deep)


As for beating down legendaries, I think that has more to do with Ash being every chosen one ever who's garbed in oodles of plot, rather than him having a shining bond of love and trust or decent pokes.

 

[Woider]

Newer Gen post-games can't be reliably beaten without serious optimization. The pokemon the AI use are IV perfect, EV min-maxed, and usually have movesets tuned around their natures and abilities. 10% is huge, too, especially for speed. Not having a speed nature can put a pokemon in an entirely different speed tier, and for some pokemon that makes them flat-out unusable. 


Power creep has seriously eroded the ability to use what you like, and Game Freak doesn't really seem to care.

Can't speak for anything post 4th, but I've never had this issue. Maybe it's just that I always made sure my teams were varied, and with good coverage of strengths and weaknesses.

 

[Nonesuch]

From my experience of Gen 5 - which was the last installment I played, and am likely to play - what Misty says is true. You can get a little way into the post-game content with your favourites, but very quickly the game starts using highly tuned Legendary/cheese teams and it stops being possible. In a way I kind of respect that - it's telling you something you'd otherwise learn the hard way in multiplayer - but there's no doubt it makes for a pretty miserable experience when you have to submit to the incredibly tedious and soulless business of raising perfect Uber/OU pokemon in exactly the right fashion before hammering home one of Smogon's movepools. At its core it's cynical and deeply unfun.


Reading some of the Nuzlocke stories and comics has made me think that if I ever was to pick the series up again, that would be the only way I'd play it.

 

[Glassboy]

Definitely Black/White, the world felt dull and empty, just straight roads to pander through until you find the next bridge. There was no need to backtrack and there weren't any secret areas like the sunken ship from Ruby/Saphire or the power plant in Red/Blue.

The Pokémon felt incredibly uninspired. It was like they just ripped them from gen 1 Munna and Musharna were basically Drowzee and Hypno, Woobat and Swoobat were just Zubat and Golbat, Drilbur=Sandshrew, Tympol=Poliwag, Ducklett=Psyduck and Foongus is basically Voltorb. And then there's Klink who's literally just a pair of gears like what even?

And as much as I know everyone says the plot was good it felt needlessly complicated to me. Truth or Ideals? What does that even mean? They just go around doing the same stuff as any other Pokémon bad guy team.

But then they had to go and make Black and White 2. One cartridge apparently wasn't enough to hold all of that plot. They didn't even bother making a new region or adding new Pokémon! "We've unlocked some new areas on the map!" Better start throwing our money at them! It was basically DLC of the worst quality!

Sooo... Ehmm... I don't like Gen V...