Weapon and Combat expansion and augmentation

Greyfox643

Well-Known Member
May 20, 2016
291
367
Greetings, after posting a thread about possibly creating more content for bow weapons, I was made to realize that ONLY bows in the game have a special thing associated with them.
 They are the ONLY weapon in the game that:

  1. Has a trainer
  2. has a brief quest (find bow, find trainer, max training, get special arrow and bow)
  3. has a tracked skill
  4. has a reward for maxing a tracked skill
  5. has a unique special attack that ONLY can be used by Bows



So, what I would like to do, is create a frame work (and eventual expansions) that would allow other weapons to receive this attention as well. This will allow players to chose whatever weapon category they feel that their specific character would prefer to utilize over everything else. To do this, I realize I would need to do the following:

  1. Create specific weapon categories, and create a parser for each one

    Working idea is Pistol, Rifle, Bow, Specialist Weapons for ranged weapons. Blades, blunts, Whips, Martial Arts (for fists, tonfas, etc) for melee weapons

[*]Assign ALL WEAPONS IN THE GAME a parser to solidify its category

[*]Create a tracked skill (like Tanis' bow training) for each of the (likely the 8 above) weapon categories

  1. Would start at 0/100. Increase naturally by 1 point for every combat victory when you have the weapon equipped

    Classes would have 1 weapon each that starts at 25/100. Mercenary would have 2 that receive a starting bonus.
  2. Training increases skill by 5 points. Would stop at 16 sessions (80 points total) leaving Captain Steele to add his/her/their own flair to their fighting style.
  3. The success of unique weapon skills would scale of off this training stat.


[*]LINK ALL OF THE THINGS TOGETHER

[*]Pray


And that's just for the foundation of this system. After its been decided what weapon categories there will be, the following would need to be accomplished for EACH category:

  1. Create several NPCs (or piggyback off of existing ones) to each provide permanent training on these categories.

    First one would likely be on Tavros (LOTS of space in the merchant section), a generic gun shop and shooting range. Would not be available until after the first beacon is secured.
  2. Second would be Fyn, for blade training

[*]Find, or create at least 2 different weapons for each category to add differentiation and support early game/late-game characters

[*]Find, or create a weapon for each category that would have a scaling attribute

  1. The idea behind this is to create a weapon that is initially weaker than most options in existence, but could potentially scale to surpass them if the player finishes the training, finds the weapon, and level's up its associated skill high enough

    The skill in question would be based on the player's Primary Stat

[*]possibly lock this weapon behind a 100% training restriction


[*]Create One unique Skill for each weapon category

  1. Possibly suggest one or two select-able or passive perks for the 3 classes based on one or two of the weapon categories

[*]Create One unique accessory for each weapon category.

  1. For the min-maxers in all of us

[*]LINK ALL OF THE THINGS

[*]Pray

[*]Repeat steps 1 through 7 until all categories are created

  1. (limit one category to each Document to limit the amount of insanity and keep things tidy and organized)



  • Is this a huge project?

    Sort of. I'm planning to segment everything so I am not overwhelmed by the scope of this.

[*]Is it complicated?

  • Not really in my opinion, as i don't have to write things with body types or smut in mind

[*]Should a newbie really be attempting this?

  • Sure, you guys are all busy writing all of the kinky smut I enjoy!

[*]Is this even needed?

  • I've already read some QQing about weapon favoritism (bows) about the forums. i think this can provide a solution so everyone can create their perfect Captain Steele






So, why post this? Well I would like input on how best to organize all weapons in the game. While 8 Weapon categories is what i came up with, things may be better if its trimmed down and simplified with 6 or 4 categories total. And it would certainly cut down on coding overhead. There also may be weapon parsers in existence that aren't included in the master list in the google document.


And, of course, this could simply not be desired at all!


So what say you, perverts of the Tainted Space?


For TL:DR  Steele finds weapon. Steele finds trainer. Trainer does the thing. Steele gets new skill. Trainer does the thing again. Steele gets new weapon. Trainer does the thing one last time. Unlocks scalable weapon from a follower or a vendor.


Repeat for each weapon category. Become fuckmaster of all forms of combat. Fuckmaster Captain Steele.


Current working weapon specials list




Bows - Concussive Shot (damage scales with skill and has a chance to stun). {This is already in the game}


Pistols - trick shot (three very weak shots aimed at the enemy's legs, hands, then head., first has a very small chance to trip, second a small chance to disarm, last a moderate chance to stun.) {Think of a gunslinger firing low first and using the recoil of the weapon to fire upwards in a controlled manner)


Rifles - controlled burst (fires 3 very weak but high accuracy shots, center mass. If they all connect, the enemy suffers an Accuracy penalty from taking withering amounts of weapons fire so quickly. This skill CAN proc additional shots from weapons, but additional shots suffer the damage penalty)


Exotic - unsure


Melee weapons 


Blades - Coup De Grace, a devestating lunging attack, dealing moderate damage with a high chance to crit, and inflicting damage over time. Would tire out the player and inflict accuracy and strength penalties for a few rounds of combat, also overextending and committing to a combat ending attack is taxing


Blunts - Crushing blow. Deals normal damage with a moderate chance of knocking down your enemy. Can be used successively, increasing energy costs, but upping the damage and trip chance with each use.


Martial arts - This one, will be complex. The player will be granted a passive that grows in strength with the training level, making fists and fist weapons more damaging. Would grant 2 skills. One that adds 1 bonus attack (because unarmed strikes are inherently weaker than other weapons, and One that would be a kick-involved skill (which would lock out some lower body types) that confers some benefit. Thinking of a small boost to effectiveness when.one ability is used after the other. Perhaps just a buff to the next melee attack.


Whips - Bind, very low accuracy but restrains enemy from attacking you, allows one of 2 special attacks. 1. Slam: ends the bind state, but slams your opponent on the ground for moderate damage, they take a turn standing up again, which gives the player 1 free found to act. 2. Bound tease: grants an extremely high bonus to your tease for 2 rounds. Automatically ends after the 2nd tease (ends the bind state as well). But enemy can immediately act afterwards.
 
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Nik_van_Rijn

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Sep 10, 2015
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506
Moscow, RF
I don't think that having a system of weapon skills a-la one in Fallout is a good idea, for several reasons:


1) In the true spirit of Space Fantasy adventure, PC is and always will be proficient with every weapon they are physically capable of using.


2)Properly implementing the effects of skill levels on combat will require a major.overhaul.


3)It will either buff Steele even more if the current level of effectiveness will be the low point; nerf or force to grind people that won't wish to specialize if it won't.


So IMO this idea will work better with keeping it to the Tanis' template: finding various aficionados and weapon experts to learn cool new tricks and possibly new items from.
 
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Greyfox643

Well-Known Member
May 20, 2016
291
367
That was the goal, I thought I conveyed  the x.X


Literally all the skill progress tracker is for, is a "progress bar" until that weapon category has its unique skill unlocked. Progression literally is taking a weapon Captain Steele is already proficient in and mastering it.


The only scaling I planned was for 3 weapons for each category. One that scales off of Strength  (for mercs), reflex (for smugs), and intelligence  (for techgeeks). Which is a simple addition, as it merely would take the appropriate stat and apply as a bonus in some form. But these 3 weapons are really only going to be attractive to people who HEAVILY dumped points into their class' stat. As these weapons will be weaker and other alternatives to balanced and "jack of all trades" builds. 


For TL:DR (should've put this in the OP) Steele finds weapon. Steele finds trainer. Trainer does the thing. Steele gets new skill. Trainer does the thing again. Steele gets new weapon. Trainer does the thing one last time. Unlocks scalable weapon from a follower or a vendor.


Repeat for each weapon category. Become fuckmaster of all forms of combat. Fuckmaster Captain Steele.
 

Coopaer

Member
Dec 21, 2015
12
2
I think this actually sounds like a pretty interesting idea, but I wanted to ask about whips and other lust weapons. Would there be separate categories for them or would they fit under one of the ones you've already mentioned?
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
291
367
They'd be in the same category. I think it's redundant to have a "Lust pistol" and "not Lust pistol" for echo category. Though the working list is:


 Pistol, Rifle, Bow, Specialist Weapons (the catch all) for ranged weapons.


Blades, blunts, Martial Arts (for fists and fist weapons) and exotic (the catch all) for melee weapons


Not sure to make it more or less complex from this list of 8
 

Coopaer

Member
Dec 21, 2015
12
2
Well those 8 seem like they'd cover just about every weapon. I do think this sounds like a pretty good idea, and at least more than just bows would get perks.
 

Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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Repeat for each weapon category. Become fuckmaster of all forms of combat. Fuckmaster Captain Steele.

If that all weapon otpions would be accesable by all classes that would be tempting. Or you thoght about each class becoming fuckmaster of thei share of all weapons? I mean it mya prove some troubles to make tech almost casualy swing scalable merc typical weapon.


But I like your thought about filling of bar for getting skill. Maybe current archery training from Tanis could get such change later on. SO people could see in stats how long till bar fill up xD
 

Coopaer

Member
Dec 21, 2015
12
2
Just realised this would add a lot more interesting options for a smuggler with the quick draw perk (I think that's the one). If they could be bothered training in multiple weapon types.
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
291
367
If that all weapon otpions would be accesable by all classes that would be tempting. Or you thoght about each class becoming fuckmaster of their share of all weapons?


But I like your thought about filling of bar for getting skill. Maybe current archery training from Tanis could get such change later on. SO people could see in stats how long till bar fill up 

Each class would have a set of their own special scalable weapons that build on the strengths of that class. The merc variants would likely have more raw damage, smugs would get extra crit chance or bonus attacks, Techies would get strange damage combos and effects (think electric weapons that also deal Lust damage, or weapons that stun as well as bonus shield damage). 


So Merc = high damage, lower special effects. Smug = medium damage, bonus chance for more damage. Tech = lower damage but branching damage and effects. 


And all 3 classes get access to the same set of 8 special skills.


Speaking of skills, that is the next thing I need to plan. What do you think of these ideas?


Bows - Concussive Shot (damage scales with skill and has a chance to stun). {This is already in the game}


Pistols - trick shot (two weak shots aimed at the enemy's hands then legs, first has a small chance to disarm, second a chance to stun.)


Rifles - controlled burst (fires 3 very weak but high accuracy shots, center mass. If they all connect, the enemy suffers an Accuracy penalty from taking withering amounts of weapons fire so quickly. This skill CAN proc additional shots from weapons, but additional shots suffer the damage penalty)


Exotic - unsure


Melee weapons 


Blades - Coup De Grace, a devestating lunge, dealing moderate damage, and inflicting damage over time. 


Blunts - Crushin blow. Deals normal damage with a moderate chance of knocking down your enemy. Can be used successively, increasing energy costs, but upping the damage and trip chance with each use.


Martial arts - This one, will be complex. The player will be granted a passive that grows in strength with the training level, making fists and fist weapons more damaging. Would grant 2 skills. One that adds 1 bonus attack (because unarmed strikes are inherently weaker than other weapons, and One that would be a kick-involved skill (which would lock out some lower body types) that confers some benefit.


Whips - Bind, restrains enemy from attacking you, allows one of 2 special attacks. 1. Slam: ends the bind state, but slams your opponent on the ground for moderate damage, they take a turn standing up again. 2. Bound tease: grants an extremely high bonus to your tease for 2 rounds. Automatically ends after the 2nd tease (ends the bind state as well).


What do you think? Cool? Useless? Hugely over powered? 
 

Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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Pistols - trick shot (two weak shots aimed at the enemy's hands then legs, first has a small chance to disarm, second a chance to stun.)


Exotic - unsure

About pistols I was thinking: both shoots can disarm enemy and put part that when first shoot already trigger disarm the second can be dunno...a little stronged in dmg but not having chance for disarm. Reason I thought that well earlier PC was aiming at hands so part of attack was absorbed by weapon and part by hand that was holding it so with diarmed enemy all dmg of attck would go toward enemy hand.


On exotic you mean all other types of range weapons that not fit inder those meantioned above?


Other examples...I not dev so I not sure if it look fine from their pov but I think as from my pov it all looks quite good with need only to tune each skill to not make again one or two types of weapons so OP that PC wouldn't take other types (but that typical issue of balancing stuff).
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
291
367
About pistols I was thinking: both shoots can disarm enemy and put part that when first shoot already trigger disarm the second can be dunno...a little stronged in dmg but not having chance for disarm. Reason I thought that well earlier PC was aiming at hands so part of attack was absorbed by weapon and part by hand that was holding it so with diarmed enemy all dmg of attck would go toward enemy hand. i was thinking that as well. However I realized that Savin would enjoy less variables to code instead of more. Having two different debuts instead of a debuff-possible-damage-or-retry-debuff would be simpler


On exotic you mean all other types of range weapons that not fit inder those meantioned above? that's it exactly. I'm not sure to even include exotic types since they are so oddball and they each have their already interesting quirks and effects. May drop weapon categories down to 7 for simplicity. 


Other examples...I not dev so I not sure if it look fine from their pov but I think as from my pov it all looks quite good with need only to tune each skill to not make again one or two types of weapons so OP that PC wouldn't take other types (but that typical issue of balancing stuff). this is the inevitable battle with anything that deals with combat in a videogame. I just hope the ideas behind the skills are varied enough to encourage different people to use different things, but aren't so awesome as to encourage one weapon type over the rest. If the effects are good then I'll skip straight to drafting and editing the documents. 

I've added my responses in line with your points.


Expanded skills slightly and added them to the op.


Next to consider are the NPCS that would offer training.


Tanis is on Men'GA for bows. And just needs to be slightly tweaked under the hood to make this compatible with everything.


Was thinking Sera for whip training, but I'd need permission, and  2 or 3 tease-filled training scenes for her.


Martial arts was going to a brand new NPC on Tavros. Was thinking of creating a martial arts master of some form. Complete with a small dojo. She/he would have given defense lessons out to anyone who asked, for a price.


I'm thinking of Anno or Penny for pistol training, but I would need to get permission for either first. 


I planned on making a gun shop/firing range on Tavros as well with a new NPC for Rifle training. Could always throw Pistols in with that as well. Unsure of what company to make him work for, or to make him freelance.


There is the wonderfully Charming dance instructor on the top floor of Tavros for Bladed weapons, but I would need permission to change his temporary sword buff to a permanent one.


Unsure about blunt weapons at this time.
 
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Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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I planned on making a gun shop/firing range on Tavros as well with a new NPC for Rifle training. Could always throw Pistols in with that as well. Unsure of what company to make him work for, or to make him freelance.

iven how Emmy likes guns and other stuff she could get rifle training. Not like she already giving people chance to get 2 customized weapons xD
 

Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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Well yes she do likes them but then again I could sya almsot all other npc that OP meantioned form existing npc are as well fitting I mean they also just happen to use such type of weapons or well fitting like Sera that we not even know if she using whip weapons but fit as demoness fit for whip type of weapon.


That way we could hardly find npc from existing ones to be fitting for a trainer.
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
291
367
Emmy for Rifle training is an awesome idea!


And that would further spread out all of the trainers across available worlds.


Now, for martial arts, because the skill quickly adds bonus damage, I was thinking of locking every 4 training sessions behind a level or two to ensure a player doesn't max things out at level 1 and go full One Punch Man on the galaxy. 


For other skills, quests (for Emmy {Rifle} and Sera {whip}) serve as a natural barrier, and money (for martial arts, and pistols) to keep level 1 players from immediately starting off with a power surge. And blunt training will be locked behind the main quest, as I'll likely either find or create an NPC on the Myr home world to train Captain Steele 


That leaves blades, and bows available right at level 1.


Which nicely rounds off a form of natural  progression in the current game I think
 

Coopaer

Member
Dec 21, 2015
12
2
Actually I think Anno makes a little more sense for rifle than Emmy. My reason for thinking that is mostly just because of that scene you can get where you see who's the better shot. I dunno.
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
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True, but remember that Anno always uses a Personalized Pistol in combat when you adventure with her


And even has special dialogue for that specific pistol to create one for Steele
 

Coopaer

Member
Dec 21, 2015
12
2
True. But Emmy doesn't really have any dialogue or scenes relating to any specific weapon types. I guess either one would work though. It just doesn't seem to me like they'd be skillful enough with rifles to be able to fully train someone.


Edit: Actually I like Terra_Lupis' idea. That makes quite a bit of sense.
 
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Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
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Hmm, so gaining the Rifle Skill would involve finding a Red Myr willing to finalize training with Steele.


I'd like to avoid a character involved in Favian's quest.


And preferably someone who is an actual combatant of the Federation,  maybe Lieve?
 

Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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Well as long someone from Myr planet would be final/only one trainer of rifle it would be good.


And Emmy is weapon fan and run shop with (that suprising I know) weapons and yet people say: nah she can't do it...like really why? why?


So I could run weapon shop, been able to customize wepon but nagh noone will call me specialist of any type of weapons? I fell you are just much against of involving Emmy here for any type of weapons trainer :/


And instead saying Anno is superb weapon specialist that could train PC in almost all weapon types. I really not getting this patter of thought :colbert:


PS. Much of this post contain sarcasm in case some one not get it...nope I not try bash any of you I just been really sarcastic here xD
 

Terra_Lupis

Active Member
Aug 28, 2015
34
9
How about flinging around ideas we actually take a step back and see who we have already available as potential trainers.


Tanis = Bow (Need More of These)


Anarrie = Advanced Bow


Anno = Pistols


Astra Irons = Advanced Pistols


Syri = Shotguns & Machine Guns (Need More of These)


Lieve = Rifles


Nehzara = Advanced Rifles (After short interlude finding out that her mother pulled some strings to advance her daughter's career without her knowledge)


Penny = Melee


Queen Tavira = Advanced Melee (If you choose not to kill her)


Emmy would bring up the point of knowing some people that could help improve Steele's skill. The people she knows would be the basic trainers and then Steele would have to find the Advanced trainers on their own. After completing training with each trainer, the trainer in question would then give Steele a special weapon based on what they teach (Tanis gives Steele Tanis' Bow after several training sessions). Depending on what job you pick at the start would also determine your starting skill with each weapon class. Mercenary would start with level two on all weapons classes, Smuggler would start with level one in some classes and level two in others and lastly Tech Specialists would start with level one in melee and pistols. No Level or Level Zero is basic civilian training and Level 10 is Specialist level.
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
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May I ask why you think Advanced training is necessary currently? 


I'm not being snide, I actually want to know your thoughts behind it
 

Terra_Lupis

Active Member
Aug 28, 2015
34
9
I was thinking of real world scenarios, the majority of us know the basics of handling a weapon and self defence, a trained professional knowns even more (Tanis, Lieve, Anno, Penny) but not as much as a soldier (Anarrie, Astra, Syri, Nehzara, Queen Tavira).
 

Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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But then having basic and advanced trainer may people wish to see for each type of weapons getting 2 skills/perks and also two weapons. As using already existing bow case Tanis giving after training completed weapon+skil. So then if advanced bow trainer won;t give another weapon and some other skill....what would be point of going there? I could say that just for higher cap on weapon skill but would it satisfy enough amount of players?
 

Terra_Lupis

Active Member
Aug 28, 2015
34
9
Or perhaps it could be like Tam-Wolf getting the upgrade during Kara's second quest, where instead of being awarded a second new weapon, the first weapon you were given by the basic trainer will be upgraded both physically and functionally. The only one that would upgrade their own weapon with the layout I mentioned before would be Syri.
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
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That was already intended. Training was to stop with one trainer, but finishing everything allows a player to unlock a scalable weapon that fits the class and skill.
 

Ormael

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Aug 27, 2015
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Or perhaps it could be like Tam-Wolf getting the upgrade during Kara's second quest, where instead of being awarded a second new weapon, the first weapon you were given by the basic trainer will be upgraded both physically and functionally. The only one that would upgrade their own weapon with the layout I mentioned before would be Syri.

What about compability? I mean if one trainer is form USC and other is from natives from some new planet that was discovered in current rush. Both got slight different technologies and who could say that making one upgrade weapon given by other won't cause some negative outcome? Ofc if we say to hell with logic it's fine. But then it could make us limited to meet trainers that are all msotly tied to USC evne if meet of different planets.
 

Greyfox643

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May 20, 2016
291
367
Or perhaps it could be like Tam-Wolf getting the upgrade during Kara's second quest, where instead of being awarded a second new weapon, the first weapon you were given by the basic trainer will be upgraded both physically and functionally. The only one that would upgrade their own weapon with the layout I mentioned before would be Syri.

It's going to vary weapon to weapon.


Tanis's bow was going to get a futuristic overhaul and added to Steele Tech's product line through Anno (same thing would happen with black market, only it's a one shot modification and not a new product design)


Either your old man's (Victor Steele) rifle or pistol was going to able to be found.


I wanted to ask permission for the owner of the Energy Rapier for a bladed weapon


The Lust whip could be brought to Sera to create a new whip.


No working ideas for other weapons yet.


I'm reluctant to make all of them upgrades as they WILL be weaker initially. The plan is to have them deal 6 less damage of the average damage of ALL weapons in that category. Then they'd get their scaling effect which gives you 2-4 points of damage for every 5 points in your class's primary skill (strength, reflex, or intellect). And 1-2 points for every 4 training sessions completed  (3-6 cap until advanced trainingis unlocked )


I think I will not include advanced trainers.


The current trainers will suffice from level 1 to 8. Once 9 to 16 is unlocked, I'll add them, and a potential new passive.for each weapon category. 
 

Coopaer

Member
Dec 21, 2015
12
2
That sounds really good. Another thing that it'd probably be important to think of is kinetic and energy weapons, since if you make the special weapons all one type mercenaries or tech specialists won't get much use out of them. Not sure if I worded this right...
 
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