How to play with training wheels off

tonyq46

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Aug 21, 2021
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So I managed to get through most of the game by just steam rolling through with over leveling my characters and spamming the auto button. On occasion I have to swtich it up, but that mostly entails spamming Tease instead. Then I get to Winter City, get through Jael'yn and Elthara, and finally hit the wall that is the Queen. I struggle, but I manage after even more blind spamming of whatever I can, and finally I believe I can coast for a while before the next major boss.

Then I step into the Glacial Rift and get bodied by the normal encounters.

Long story short, I need to actually learn how combat works in this game. I tried reading the in-game guide thing, but honestly I work best with examples, like who to put in a party with what gear or what a build should look like. Any advice for me?
 

Tide Hunter

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May 4, 2019
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So I managed to get through most of the game by just steam rolling through with over leveling my characters and spamming the auto button. On occasion I have to swtich it up, but that mostly entails spamming Tease instead. Then I get to Winter City, get through Jael'yn and Elthara, and finally hit the wall that is the Queen. I struggle, but I manage after even more blind spamming of whatever I can, and finally I believe I can coast for a while before the next major boss.

Then I step into the Glacial Rift and get bodied by the normal encounters.

Long story short, I need to actually learn how combat works in this game. I tried reading the in-game guide thing, but honestly I work best with examples, like who to put in a party with what gear or what a build should look like. Any advice for me?
What is your build like? What is your class? What is your equipment? What stats have you levelled? What are your powers? Since you've already got a rather levelled character, I assume you have a build, even if you've not necessarily thought about it. For advice to be given, what you have now should be known, and what you want too.
 
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Burnerbro

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My first question is: do you actually want to learn how the combat works and think you will enjoy tinkering with your build and party composition? If not, the Story difficulty might be a better option for you, since you almost can't lose a fight while it is on.
 
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tonyq46

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Aug 21, 2021
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To put it in the best way possible, I want to be able to understand things well enough that when I lose I can identify why I did and make changes in response, but I don't need to go full meta. To make a comparison, I want to know how to play through a Pokemon game's story, but I don't need to do crazy things with held items and move combos beyond Rain Dance makes Thunder hit.

As for what I have going on, I prefer either Black Mage or White Mage, I have saves for both. Statwise I try to even it out, but willpower is typically high for both. Equipment-wise I usually just use what I find in story or in drops, I don't typically buy anything unless it's for a quest. Power-wise again I usually just go with what I learn through tomes and leveling.
 
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Bast

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Aug 12, 2021
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Try to specialize your character in one direction and don't try to do multiple things at once. Either be tank, heals, health damage dealer or tease damage dealer. If you go the damage route then try to do the same type of damage your other party members do. Like health damage if you run around with Azzy and tease damage if you run around with bimbo Azzy for instance.
After you figured out what you want your character to be able to do, look at what the codex and find out which attributes and stats would be complementary to your playstyle and try to put gear on your character accordingly.
 
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Burnerbro

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Gotcha.

1) Consider making Presence your dump stat, since outside of Tease and Charmer class Powers its main benefit is buffing the Attack Power and Spellpower of your companions and Summons, which they are utilizing suboptimally when not controlled manually. You will need to perform the big heals and/or big damage yourself. Put those points into maxing out Willpower and then Toughness (survivability through Raw HP), Agility (universal hit chance, Initiative and Evasion) or Cunning (Magic Resistance and crits) in whatever order you think will suit you best.

2) Cait is a great choice for any party that runs on auto or PC-only control sceme, because she will actually use her Ultimate, unlike every other companion. Her Witch Set, that you can get from Vivienne, pretty much guarantees that everything she does during the combat is increasing your party's survivability, making it impossible for the AI to use her Powers too-too badly.

3) Blessing Power is utterly busted, being a party wide buff for Accuracy, Attack Power and Spellpower. So I'd recommend using it on your White Mage as much as possible for setting up your most powerful heals and damage turns, and potentially on your Black Mage as well.

4) Grease+Fireball is the bread and butter strategy of any spell-based damage dealer against groups of enemies. It has been pretty busted ever since it got into the game, and will carry you past any fights that don't feature a lot of Fire Resistance. Banishment (the Black Mage's Ultimate) works really well for getting a single target out of the fight and buying your party some time to heal back up.

5) Speaking of resistances, the Sense action has been recently changed and is now guaranteed to work. So using it on enemies that seem to have resistances and weaknesses that are less obvious than "fire beats plant and loses to water" might be worthwhile.
 
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Tide Hunter

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The tl:dr of this is basically: buy equipment which benefits spellpower and spellcasters, get the amulet of transference from the Old Forest. Focus your stats on Willpower and Agility, and either presence as a support or toughness/cunning for if you aren't. Use either support powers or damage powers as a white mage, and don't use Smite Evil but you can use Charge Weapon if you use a Metal Wand. As a black mage, use grease and fireball, and either a fire summon or Vitality Reap as your encounter power. For companions, best composition is a tank, a support, and a damage dealer, though some characters dip into two categories at once.
As for what I have going on, I prefer either Black Mage or White Mage, I have saves for both. Statwise I try to even it out, but willpower is typically high for both. Equipment-wise I usually just use what I find in story or in drops, I don't typically buy anything unless it's for a quest. Power-wise again I usually just go with what I learn through tomes and leveling.
Okay, so, unless you happen to have found the Witch's outfit in the first forest area, you probably should buy some equipment. Personally I'd say you should at least have the Leather Coat from Leorah's store, it's basically a sidegrade to the Witch's outfit except it has more evasion and no bonus resistances to magic. That said, since you've beaten the Palace of Ice dungeon, so you probably have the Royal Leathers, and that's a good choice too. While some equipment is more specialized, the game is designed such that you can beat it using equipment that you can buy in Hawkthorne, so buying equipment to fill empty slots is probably a good idea. If you don't have the Amulet of Transference/Union, and it is because you haven't picked it up, there's a small puzzle section called the Ruined Shrine where you can find it in the Old Forest. Just exit Hawkethorne by going up and then just keep going to the right, and you should find it. The Amulet gives 8 spell penetration, which counters Ward, the stat that lowers magic damage dealt when hit, and can be upgraded to also give 5 spellpower, which is your main stat since you run spellcasters.

I assume you beat Tollus in the tutorial, so using the Bladed staff is a decent idea, as it is just a quarterstaff but stronger, but in terms of better spellcasting equipment you have options which are good. The first is to get the Spiraled Staff, which you can get by doing Berwyn's recruitment quest. If you haven't done it, he's the Summoner enemy in the Hill area to the right of Hawkthorne, and above level 3 you can access his quest after beating him a few times. Once you enter the quest, interact with the bookshelf to get to choose between the Spiraled Staff and the Spiraled Blade. As you're a pure caster, rather than a half caster, pick Spiraled Staff. It has the highest Spellpower and Spellpenetration of any single weapon, and as such is a great choice for pure casters.

That said, the other choice for a spellcaster is to dual-wield. The highest spellpow and spellpen you can get on a combination of two weapons can be obtained via the Kitsune, but you do have to give up the Amulet of Union to access it. The second highest needs you to buy either the Blank Scroll or the Fox Jewel from Kohaku, the Kitsune merchant, and the Metal Wand from Svern, the merchant who's part of the traveling Caravan. I personally recommend the Blank Scroll since it provides an accuracy buff too. That said, you don't need to hyper-focus on those two stats, so instead of getting the kitsune things, you can instead buy the Lynx Totem from Leorah or the Mage wand from Ivris, which provide better evasion and accuracy than the Kitsune options in exchange for lower spellpower.

Speaking of Leorah, she sells the Wizard Ring, which gives 5 spellpower. Useful for a mage.

Now then, on stats. Do not evenly spread it out. Strength is mostly worthless if you're not using melee weapons as your source of damage. Presence's main use is for tease-centric builds, though it can have use as support as it gives buffs to the damage of your allies and strengthens the stats of your summons, so if your White Mage is support-focused rather than damage focused, you may want to level presence (and also have that character learn to summon). Your black mage can also do presence if you want to have them summon, but if they're damage focused (since they're a black mage) it would be better to level any other stat to boost either their damage capabilities or their survivability, as the more damage you deal, the more likely enemies are to attack you (this is the threat system).

Aside from focusing hard on willpower, I'd say you should probably also focus on agility, as it increases both accuracy and evasion, meaning you can hit more often and get hit less often. Cunning is also a good choice, as it makes you less vulnerable to magic attacks and strengthens your crit, though you should know that accuracy (provided by agility) also makes you more likely to land crits on top of landing normal hits, and magic attacks tend to be less common than physical attacks. Toughness is entirely about survivability, giving you more health and physical resistance.

So, basically. Do willpower, agility, and either cunning or toughness (or alternate between both) for black mage, and do willpower, agility, and presence for the white mage if you build support, or do the same as the black mage for damage. You can respec stats at a trainer, like Sanders, Garth, River, and Ivris.

With powers, you probably learn enough through those means. As a support White Mage, you'd probably want to learn Blessing, Shield of Light, and either Great Heal or Holy Ward. If you don't know these spells, despite them being level up powers, you can learn them by training at Sanders. That said, if you want to go with a damaging White Mage, you probably shouldn't. Entropic Winds is relatively weak as an aoe, and both Charge Weapon and Smite Evil are weapon based, and as such are more useful on a split damage build that uses both magic and physical damage, like a spellsword or a paladin. That said, if you use the Metal Wand, your attacks use spellpower rather than strength, so Charge Weapon could be useful as a strong damage buff for basic attacks, though you can't use Smite Evil with it. Celestial Smite is good single target damage.

For the Black Mage, you should focus on doing damage. As Burner said, Grease and Fireball is the bread and butter combo of damage mages. Grease stuns all enemies and makes them more vulnerable to fire damage, and Fireball damages all enemies, even if they succeed an evasion check. I'd suggest using Vitality Reap as your Encounter Ability, though you can still use a summon if you want a distraction/damage sponge. Of course, you could also use a fire summon (either Flame Spirit or one of the upgraded Flame Spirits you can get at the Temple of Terrestrial Fire in the Frostwood area), because fire damage synergizes with grease.

In terms of companions, neither should bring Quintillus, as he focuses on tease/resolve damage. If playing support as a White Mage, either do not use Cait or use the Hexblade Leathers set for her. Her base set is a mix between healer and damage dealer, her Silks set is tease focused, her witch Gear set is much more support and healing focused, but her Hexblade Set is damage focused. Additionally, don't use Etheryn, as her damage is weak and her Raiment set is support focused. If playing a damage focused white or black mage, bring either Etheryn or Cait, as Cait is a mixed healer and damage dealer with her base set or a full support with her Witch's set, and Etheryn has group heal and a summon in her base set and a heavy support focus in her Raiment set. Also, if using the normal set Cait, her attacks synergize with the Black Mage as they deal fire damage. Do not bring both.

As a black mage, if you do not use a summon, you should probably use Brienne (genderbent Brint, if you let the cursed armor take its course). Brienne can get a set in the Temple of Terrestrial Fire which gives her fire damage and a fire damage summon, which will synergize with the damage bonus from Grease. If you do not wish to forcibly turn Brint into a woman, and do not use a summon, perhaps Berwyn is a good choice. His at-will is a firebolt spell, and he has both Group Heal and a summon. That summon is pretty decent.

That said, both White Mages and Black Mages could use a tank. Azyrran, Atugia, and Arona all have Guarded Stance as the at-will of their base equipment set, allowing them to serve as a tank. Atugia is the best at being a pure tank, as her abilities heal, draw aggro to her, and even give a shield to everyone that redirects attacks that they would have sustained back onto her. However, for damage to accompany that tank, you may want Azy or Arona. Arona does purely physical damage, with both aoe and single target powers in her base set, while Azy primarily does physical damage but also has access to the White Fire white mage power, which can synergize with Grease as it does fire damage along with holy damage.

Assuming you're using support white mage, and you don't want to do Hexblade Cait, well, you can't really go wrong with Brint. He deals tons of damage, both to groups and to single target. His alternate set, which can be found in the Glacial Rift, does frost damage, so it's not a good idea to use it in the Rift, but outside of the rift it can be strong. He can also sort of serve as a tank. Basic Brint gets a lot of threat by dealing tons of damage, though when below half health he also looses half his armor so that's not good for tanking, but his frost damage set has a shield and lets him recover health and gain extra threat when attacking enemies afflicted by the frigid status effect, which is what his powers apply.

If you want a damage dealing companion aside from Brint, Brienne, or Cait, you could try Arona. She deals damage, despite also having tank power. That said, the base set deals a bunch of resolve damage in addition to physical (most likely to boost the tank ability, as more damage means more threat, so enemies focus on her more), so for pure damage dealing, all of her alternate equipment sets are good for it.
 

tonyq46

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Aug 21, 2021
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Right, so standard diversify your party but have focus in your own build. Makes sense, but I'm a bit concerned about tailoring the entire party to one particular damage. I recall me struggling with some slimes for no discernible reason up until I realized I should have been teasing them instead of doing physical damage. I guess I'm a bit worried something similar will happen again, but from the sounds of it these would be either exceptions or that the hyper focus on one damage type will override any possible resistances?
 
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Burnerbro

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Slimes are a pretty extreme edge case when it comes to resistances and vulnerabilities. And even for them elemental HP damage was another valid answer alongside hitting their Resolve. Plus the Champ and most of the companions are capable of switching which of the two health pools they are targetting, through swapping powers (or weapons, for warriors and thieves) and equipment sets respectively.
 
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Tide Hunter

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Right, so standard diversify your party but have focus in your own build. Makes sense, but I'm a bit concerned about tailoring the entire party to one particular damage. I recall me struggling with some slimes for no discernible reason up until I realized I should have been teasing them instead of doing physical damage. I guess I'm a bit worried something similar will happen again, but from the sounds of it these would be either exceptions or that the hyper focus on one damage type will override any possible resistances?
With the slimes, they're an exception because they're just super weak to teases and super strong against physical attacks. Plenty of foes are also really weak to tease damage, aside from those who are completely immune, but if you want to do tease damage, you can pick equipment to boost sexiness too. Undergarments boost either tease accuracy or tease damage resistance pierce, and all of the light armors I mentioned provide +15 or +20 sexiness, which is tease accuracy. Presence also boosts sexiness. That said, I would personally recommend only having a party of physical damage or a party that primarily does resolve damage. Not only tease, of course, as there are several foes who are completely immune to resolve damage (or at least to teases), but a tease focus would be best fit by a Charmer type character. Charmers, as a class, are a mixture of resolve damage and support, providing damage buffs and even resolve heals to the party where white mages provide healing and damage negation, though white mages also can do heavy physical damage and charmers can do heavy resolve damage. Don't worry about it too much, though. Every enemy, excluding unwinnable fights, can be beaten via health damage, even foes weak to tease, but not every enemy can be beaten via teases, which is why I personally recommend a physical focus, with tease only being a backup option.

As for a hyper-focus on one damage type, perhaps focusing purely on fire is not a good idea. Despite fire teammates synergizing well with grease, some enemies are resistant to fire where they may be weak to, say, holy. This is why the split damage of White Fire, which White Mages, Cait, and Azyrran have access to, is good. Focusing in on dealing damage to health can be good against most fights, but a single damage type amongst health damage is only good if you just bring overwhelming amounts of firepower, and your foes aren't resistant. The best damage against demons, like the Cultist fights in the Rift, is holy, because of their overwhelming weakness to it, while some of them seem to have a resistance to fire damage. Against beast-type foes, blight damage has a very damage bonus, and that foe type is largely found amongst Rift enemies, but one of the cultists are largely resistant to it and several other foes are neutral in regards to it. Vitality Reap is one of the 4 blight type powers you can learn, though I should note that Black Mages start with Withering Bolt as their at-will, which deals aoe blight damage.

Also, as Burner mentioned, companions can swap power sets. Cait and Azy both have alternate sets which are dedicated to resolve damage.
 
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Zavos

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Its worth noting that most enemy have archtypes that gives them some standardized resistances and weaknesses. Common beasts, including normal beastkin like Lupines and Centaurs, are weak to blight. Constructs are weak to storm. Undead are weak to holy, and generally have extreme piercing and crushing resistances. Extremely corrupted enemies have holy weakness and resist blight. Storm and Holy damage are currently the best all-around damage types, though in the future we're going to get content that resists them specifically.